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Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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HP 1650B logic analyser system disk
I have just been given an HP 1650B logic analyser but I don't have a system
disk for it so I can't use it :-( Anyone know where to get hold of this disk or can it be downloaded from somewhere? TIA, Martin. -- martindot herewhybrowat herentlworlddot herecom |
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Martin Whybrow wrote:
I have just been given an HP 1650B logic analyser but I don't have a system disk for it so I can't use it :-( Anyone know where to get hold of this disk or can it be downloaded from somewhere? TIA, Martin. Martin, Physically, this is a 3 1/2 inch PC floppy, however the format is not PC compatible. IIRC, the speed of rotation of the HP drive is like twice that of a PC. So you will not be able to download it and copy it from your PC. Duplicating a system disk from or on another HP 1650B is really your only option. Oh, and make darn sure you make yourself several copies once you do lay your hands on one. Thanks, Steve |
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"Steve" wrote in message ... Martin Whybrow wrote: I have just been given an HP 1650B logic analyser but I don't have a system disk for it so I can't use it :-( Anyone know where to get hold of this disk or can it be downloaded from somewhere? TIA, Martin. Martin, Physically, this is a 3 1/2 inch PC floppy, however the format is not PC compatible. IIRC, the speed of rotation of the HP drive is like twice that of a PC. So you will not be able to download it and copy it from your PC. Duplicating a system disk from or on another HP 1650B is really your only option. Oh, and make darn sure you make yourself several copies once you do lay your hands on one. Thanks, Steve Steve I might be able to do that on my Linux box (most floppy drive parameters can be altered in software on that system). I did get hold of a 1652 system disk, but at boot up I got an error message 0020 000B164 2000; not sure if it's because I have the wrong disk or if there is a fault on the unit (the colleague who gave me the analyser didn't mention it). Thanks, Martin -- martindot herewhybrowat herentlworlddot herecom |
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Martin Whybrow wrote:
"Steve" wrote in message ... Martin Whybrow wrote: I have just been given an HP 1650B logic analyser but I don't have a system disk for it so I can't use it :-( Anyone know where to get hold of this disk or can it be downloaded from somewhere? TIA, Martin. Martin, Physically, this is a 3 1/2 inch PC floppy, however the format is not PC compatible. IIRC, the speed of rotation of the HP drive is like twice that of a PC. So you will not be able to download it and copy it from your PC. Duplicating a system disk from or on another HP 1650B is really your only option. Oh, and make darn sure you make yourself several copies once you do lay your hands on one. Thanks, Steve Steve I might be able to do that on my Linux box (most floppy drive parameters can be altered in software on that system). I did get hold of a 1652 system disk, but at boot up I got an error message 0020 000B164 2000; not sure if it's because I have the wrong disk or if there is a fault on the unit (the colleague who gave me the analyser didn't mention it). Thanks, Martin Martin, OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) Thanks, Steve |
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Steve wrote:
OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) I am looking for a disk for a 1650A. Google found references to a program called LIFUTIL for accessing LIF disks on a DOS PC. I also found links to downloads for the 1650 from Agilent's FTP server but the files seem to have disappeared in a reorganization. I emailed Tech Support and they said they aren't there since it is obsolete. I have seen test equipment dealers selling the disks, but don't want to spend much since I have no cables or probes either (Got the 1650 cheap and figured I would try to make some probes after I got the s/w. Yes, I know the probe has a terminator in it.). ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
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Shawn D'Alimonte wrote:
Steve wrote: OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) I am looking for a disk for a 1650A. Have no clue if the 1650B diskette I have makes any difference. Google found references to a program called LIFUTIL for accessing LIF disks on a DOS PC. I also found links to downloads for the 1650 from Agilent's FTP server but the files seem to have disappeared in a reorganization. I emailed Tech Support and they said they aren't there since it is obsolete. I have seen test equipment dealers selling the disks, but don't want to spend much since I have no cables or probes either (Got the 1650 cheap and figured I would try to make some probes after I got the s/w. Yes, I know the probe has a terminator in it.). ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- Martin & Shawn, Grabbed LIFUTIL off the 'net. Ran it on a spare Pentium II machine that boots DOS ver 5.0. The utility does not allow one to make a perfect disk image, but it can be used to make an apparently functional HP diskette! Oddly, the utility allows one to dump the contents of the HP diskette to an ASCII hex dump file, yet doesn't allow use of said dump file to create a new diskette. Therefore, it's a bit of work to manually do each file at a time, but it works. Comparing ASCII dumps of original and the newly generated diskette, there are blocks of FF's verses zeroes, (in apparently the directory or "FAT" areas of the diskette) but it doesn't seem to matter. After midnight here now -- I'm off to bed. Hopefully can get a zip file together tomorrow & will email. Thanks, Steve |
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"Steve" wrote in message ... Shawn D'Alimonte wrote: Steve wrote: OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) I am looking for a disk for a 1650A. Have no clue if the 1650B diskette I have makes any difference. Google found references to a program called LIFUTIL for accessing LIF disks on a DOS PC. I also found links to downloads for the 1650 from Agilent's FTP server but the files seem to have disappeared in a reorganization. I emailed Tech Support and they said they aren't there since it is obsolete. I have seen test equipment dealers selling the disks, but don't want to spend much since I have no cables or probes either (Got the 1650 cheap and figured I would try to make some probes after I got the s/w. Yes, I know the probe has a terminator in it.). ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- Martin & Shawn, Grabbed LIFUTIL off the 'net. Ran it on a spare Pentium II machine that boots DOS ver 5.0. The utility does not allow one to make a perfect disk image, but it can be used to make an apparently functional HP diskette! Oddly, the utility allows one to dump the contents of the HP diskette to an ASCII hex dump file, yet doesn't allow use of said dump file to create a new diskette. Therefore, it's a bit of work to manually do each file at a time, but it works. Comparing ASCII dumps of original and the newly generated diskette, there are blocks of FF's verses zeroes, (in apparently the directory or "FAT" areas of the diskette) but it doesn't seem to matter. After midnight here now -- I'm off to bed. Hopefully can get a zip file together tomorrow & will email. Thanks, Steve Steve I tried automounting the disk on my Linux box (Mandrake 9.1 with customised kernel) but it wouldn't recognise the disk; I don't know the format used so I couldn't try manually mounting it. Glad to see that LIFUTIL works, I'll try to download it. I tried the same disk on a 1650A today (FW rev 1.0a, my 1650B is FW rev 2.3b) and it booted correctly, but I'm still not sure if it's a version incompatibility or a fault on the analyser. Thanks for the advice, looking forward to receiving mail :-) Martin. -- martindot herewhybrowat herentlworlddot herecom |
#8
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"Martin Whybrow" wrote in message ... "Steve" wrote in message ... Shawn D'Alimonte wrote: Steve wrote: OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) I am looking for a disk for a 1650A. Have no clue if the 1650B diskette I have makes any difference. Google found references to a program called LIFUTIL for accessing LIF disks on a DOS PC. I also found links to downloads for the 1650 from Agilent's FTP server but the files seem to have disappeared in a reorganization. I emailed Tech Support and they said they aren't there since it is obsolete. I have seen test equipment dealers selling the disks, but don't want to spend much since I have no cables or probes either (Got the 1650 cheap and figured I would try to make some probes after I got the s/w. Yes, I know the probe has a terminator in it.). ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- Martin & Shawn, Grabbed LIFUTIL off the 'net. Ran it on a spare Pentium II machine that boots DOS ver 5.0. The utility does not allow one to make a perfect disk image, but it can be used to make an apparently functional HP diskette! Oddly, the utility allows one to dump the contents of the HP diskette to an ASCII hex dump file, yet doesn't allow use of said dump file to create a new diskette. Therefore, it's a bit of work to manually do each file at a time, but it works. Comparing ASCII dumps of original and the newly generated diskette, there are blocks of FF's verses zeroes, (in apparently the directory or "FAT" areas of the diskette) but it doesn't seem to matter. After midnight here now -- I'm off to bed. Hopefully can get a zip file together tomorrow & will email. Thanks, Steve Steve I tried automounting the disk on my Linux box (Mandrake 9.1 with customised kernel) but it wouldn't recognise the disk; I don't know the format used so I couldn't try manually mounting it. Glad to see that LIFUTIL works, I'll try to download it. I tried the same disk on a 1650A today (FW rev 1.0a, my 1650B is FW rev 2.3b) and it booted correctly, but I'm still not sure if it's a version incompatibility or a fault on the analyser. Thanks for the advice, looking forward to receiving mail :-) Martin. Steve I've downloaded lifutil; can you tell me what sector size the original disk is formatted for (256 or 1024 bytes)? Thanks, Martin -- martindot herewhybrowat herentlworlddot herecom |
#9
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Martin Whybrow wrote:
"Martin Whybrow" wrote in message ... "Steve" wrote in message ... Shawn D'Alimonte wrote: Steve wrote: OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) I am looking for a disk for a 1650A. Have no clue if the 1650B diskette I have makes any difference. Google found references to a program called LIFUTIL for accessing LIF disks on a DOS PC. I also found links to downloads for the 1650 from Agilent's FTP server but the files seem to have disappeared in a reorganization. I emailed Tech Support and they said they aren't there since it is obsolete. I have seen test equipment dealers selling the disks, but don't want to spend much since I have no cables or probes either (Got the 1650 cheap and figured I would try to make some probes after I got the s/w. Yes, I know the probe has a terminator in it.). ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- Martin & Shawn, Grabbed LIFUTIL off the 'net. Ran it on a spare Pentium II machine that boots DOS ver 5.0. The utility does not allow one to make a perfect disk image, but it can be used to make an apparently functional HP diskette! Oddly, the utility allows one to dump the contents of the HP diskette to an ASCII hex dump file, yet doesn't allow use of said dump file to create a new diskette. Therefore, it's a bit of work to manually do each file at a time, but it works. Comparing ASCII dumps of original and the newly generated diskette, there are blocks of FF's verses zeroes, (in apparently the directory or "FAT" areas of the diskette) but it doesn't seem to matter. After midnight here now -- I'm off to bed. Hopefully can get a zip file together tomorrow & will email. Thanks, Steve Steve I tried automounting the disk on my Linux box (Mandrake 9.1 with customised kernel) but it wouldn't recognise the disk; I don't know the format used so I couldn't try manually mounting it. Glad to see that LIFUTIL works, I'll try to download it. I tried the same disk on a 1650A today (FW rev 1.0a, my 1650B is FW rev 2.3b) and it booted correctly, but I'm still not sure if it's a version incompatibility or a fault on the analyser. Thanks for the advice, looking forward to receiving mail :-) Martin. Steve I've downloaded lifutil; can you tell me what sector size the original disk is formatted for (256 or 1024 bytes)? Thanks, Martin -- martindot herewhybrowat herentlworlddot herecom Martin, Sounds like you don't need my files anymore, as you got your hands on a disk. Good. But perhaps I've got a version difference for the system that can still be of use. Don't know what my versions are, so I'll look. Indeed, I'd like to get my hands on your versions of what ever 1650 system files you have, just to have different versions on hand myself. Parameters are, 3 1/3 double sided (770KB size) Sector size 1024 Interleave 1 144 files in root dir vol label A165X not sure if it makes any difference When you copy files from DOS to the LIF format, pick the binary user defined file type selection. Enter C001 for 1650 system file(s), with 53 4F 54 4F for that other byte field I can't remember what it is called. Press F3 to get that pop up window to go away, or F5 to start the file transfer... when doing 1650 non-system file (i.e. "1650 config" files), they are C120 file type... with the same 53 4F 54 4F for the other byte field -- I think. Yet to test that myself. Took a bit of time to figure that out, comparing the disk created by LIFUTIL that didn't work with a disk created on the 1650. BTW, 1.44 DOS floppies with tape over the 1.44 indicator seem to work fine for me. Sorry haven't emailed the files I have yet, but been busy making a living. Later tonight, I hope. Thanks, Steve field |
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"Steve" wrote in message ... OK, OK. I've bit the hook. I've got a 1650B right here. Paid all of of $50 US for mine. Please tell me how to read the disk on my Linux RH 7.3, running a plain 2.4.27 Kernel, (as if it makes a difference) and I'll be happy to send you the image. Also have a Fedora box sitting here, too. Respectfully, I don't think it can be done. Don't have the url references, but I've read some discussion about this is the distant past, and the conclusion was a PC drive can not be used. Please prove that info wrong; it would certainly be a useful tidbit for one/us to know. Floppy drives are cheap, worth the risk, I guess.... ;^) I am looking for a disk for a 1650A. Have no clue if the 1650B diskette I have makes any difference. Google found references to a program called LIFUTIL for accessing LIF disks on a DOS PC. I also found links to downloads for the 1650 from Agilent's FTP server but the files seem to have disappeared in a reorganization. I emailed Tech Support and they said they aren't there since it is obsolete. I have seen test equipment dealers selling the disks, but don't want to spend much since I have no cables or probes either (Got the 1650 cheap and figured I would try to make some probes after I got the s/w. Yes, I know the probe has a terminator in it.). Martin & Shawn, Grabbed LIFUTIL off the 'net. Ran it on a spare Pentium II machine that boots DOS ver 5.0. The utility does not allow one to make a perfect disk image, but it can be used to make an apparently functional HP diskette! Oddly, the utility allows one to dump the contents of the HP diskette to an ASCII hex dump file, yet doesn't allow use of said dump file to create a new diskette. Therefore, it's a bit of work to manually do each file at a time, but it works. Comparing ASCII dumps of original and the newly generated diskette, there are blocks of FF's verses zeroes, (in apparently the directory or "FAT" areas of the diskette) but it doesn't seem to matter. After midnight here now -- I'm off to bed. Hopefully can get a zip file together tomorrow & will email. Thanks, Steve Steve I tried automounting the disk on my Linux box (Mandrake 9.1 with customised kernel) but it wouldn't recognise the disk; I don't know the format used so I couldn't try manually mounting it. Glad to see that LIFUTIL works, I'll try to download it. I tried the same disk on a 1650A today (FW rev 1.0a, my 1650B is FW rev 2.3b) and it booted correctly, but I'm still not sure if it's a version incompatibility or a fault on the analyser. Thanks for the advice, looking forward to receiving mail :-) Martin. Steve I've downloaded lifutil; can you tell me what sector size the original disk is formatted for (256 or 1024 bytes)? Thanks, Martin Martin, Sounds like you don't need my files anymore, as you got your hands on a disk. Good. But perhaps I've got a version difference for the system that can still be of use. Don't know what my versions are, so I'll look. Indeed, I'd like to get my hands on your versions of what ever 1650 system files you have, just to have different versions on hand myself. Parameters are, 3 1/3 double sided (770KB size) Sector size 1024 Interleave 1 144 files in root dir vol label A165X not sure if it makes any difference When you copy files from DOS to the LIF format, pick the binary user defined file type selection. Enter C001 for 1650 system file(s), with 53 4F 54 4F for that other byte field I can't remember what it is called. Press F3 to get that pop up window to go away, or F5 to start the file transfer... when doing 1650 non-system file (i.e. "1650 config" files), they are C120 file type... with the same 53 4F 54 4F for the other byte field -- I think. Yet to test that myself. Took a bit of time to figure that out, comparing the disk created by LIFUTIL that didn't work with a disk created on the 1650. BTW, 1.44 DOS floppies with tape over the 1.44 indicator seem to work fine for me. Sorry haven't emailed the files I have yet, but been busy making a living. Later tonight, I hope. Thanks, Steve Steve Thanks for the files. The 1650 is now working, it seems that the V2.03 ROM in my machine needs theV2.x system files to boot up, the V1.0 file on the previous disk I tried was obviously the reason for it not booting. If you still want to try the V1.0 system file, I'll get hold of the disk again and copy the files. Thanks for all your assistance and to Shawn for the pointer to Lifutil :-) Martin -- martindot herewhybrowat herentlworlddot herecom |
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Martin Whybrow wrote:
Thanks for all your assistance and to Shawn for the pointer to Lifutil :-) You're welcome. I wouldn't mind a copy of the files if anyone could get me a copy. It would be nice to try this thing out. ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
#12
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Shawn D'Alimonte wrote:
You're welcome. I wouldn't mind a copy of the files if anyone could get me a copy. It would be nice to try this thing out. I was able to make a working disk and just thought I would write a summary to get all the details in one message. 1) Versions The software version must match the ROM version. We have seen 1.00 and 2.00 ROMs. The ROM version is printed on the screen during the initial self test. If the versions don't match you will get the message 'Disc and ROM versions do not match'. The same software seems to work on 1650A vs 1650B (Maybe that is what determines the ROM version?) 2) Disks You will have best luck with a Double Density (720kB) disk. If you don't have any you can cover the hole on an HD disk (Opposite from the write protect tab) with tape. Format the disk under DOS or Windows and make sure there is no bad space. 3) LIFUTIL The HP1650 uses LIF formatted disks. LIFUTIL program lets you read and write LIF disks under DOS. It is an old program and hasn't been supported for years. It will work best on older (Pentium) machines. LIF was also used by some old HP computers and calculators. Most info about it on the net refers to these systems. Get it from ftp://ftp.hpmuseum.org/lif/lifutil/ 4) Files The two important files a SYSTEM_ - Operating System and PVTEST_ - Diagnostics (Needed to run self-test from the I/O menu) The other files will be example configurations. The ones I have are TIMEDEMO, STATEDEMO and MIXEDDEMO. 5) Making the Disk If you can borrow a working disk your best bet is to make a copy on the analyzer ([I/O] - Disc Operations, Select 'Duplicate Disc' as the operation). Otherwise put the files you want on the disk and LIFUTIL on a PC with DOS or Windows (May need to be in DOS mode). 1. Run LIFUTIL 2. Choose 'LIF Initialize' 3. Change the settings to: - Disk type: 3 /12" Double Sided - Sector Size: 1024 bytes - Interleave: 1 - Directory Size: 144 Files - Volume Label: A165X 4. Press F5 twice to format the disk 5. When it is done press F8 until you see the menu 6. Choose 'DOS to LIF Copy' 7 Use these settings: - DOS File Name: File you want to copy, start with SYSTEM_) - File format conversion: Binary image: No format change, user-def. type - All other can stay the same 8. With the cursor on the File format conversion line, press F6 to set the file type. For system files (SYSTEM_ and PVTEST_) User-defined LIF file type : C001 Implementation specific field: 534F544F For config files User-defined LIF file type : C120 Implementation specific field: 534F544F For other files (Reverse Assemblers, etc) Unknown. If you have a disk list it with LIFUTIL. LIFUTIL shows the type as a signed decimal number. Convert it to hex. 9. Press F5 to start the copy. 10. Repeat 7-9 for any other files you want to copy to the disk. 11. Boot the analyzer with the disk. 12. Make a copy of the disk on the analyzer. This copy may work better than the one made on your PC due to differences in the drives. Make another backup copy and put it in a safe place. 6) Error Messages 'ERROR READING SYSTEM FILE' - Wrong file or bad disk 'CANNOT FIND SYSTEM FILE' - Make sure the file SYSTEM_ is on the disk and has a file type of C001 'ROM and Disc Versions do not match' - Make sure your software version matches your ROM. ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
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