Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1   Report Post  
Old June 2nd 20, 05:17 AM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jul 2006
Posts: 420
Default Thermistor Puzzle

Given all this free time, I'm fixing stuff around the house.

I have a Brookstone Grill Alert. Stick a probe into a chunk of meat, plug
the cable (2.5mm phone plug) into the box and it happily monitors my steak
on the barbecue. Except it stopped working with unreasonably high readings
(150F reading at room temp). Wisdom on the 'Net says that the probe is
probably broken. But the replacement part (Brookstone) is no longer
available. No problem. I'll plug my decade resistance box into the grill
alert, start cranking in some resistance values and figure out the
thermistor curve. Then find another probe.

It appears to expect an NTC thermistor with 180K ohms giving an 80 F reading
and 60K ohms reading 125F. But then I pick up the old (broken?) probe and
measure it. At room temp (65F) it has a 220K resistance. Holding the probe
in my hands drops its resistance to 140K. Seems to be OK. I wiggle the cord,
expecting an intermittent short (low resistance giving a high temp reading).
Nope. It's fine. Maybe it's something wrong with the plug/jack interface. So
I open the box, unsolder a lead from the jack and measure the probe
resistance plugged in at the back of the jack. It reads 220K. Hook it all
back up and it's still wonky (probe gives a 150F reading sitting on my
desk). But if I plug my decade box in to the grill alert and dial it to 220K
ohms, the thing reads room temp.

The Grill Alert appears to just not like that probe. What have I missed?

--
Paul Hovnanian
------------------------------------------------------------------
Not all those who wander are lost. Except for the 2nd Lt.
He is lost as ****.


  #2   Report Post  
Old June 2nd 20, 12:46 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,625
Default Thermistor Puzzle

My guesses, officially classified as S.W.A.G.:

a) Clean the battery compartment, and replace the battery with a fresh one. Analogy: An audio speaker has a resistance that may be measured by a VOM, but in use, it has impedance that varies by input frequency. Could it be that the probe does the same under actual use? If so, available current will be critical for accurate readings. And these things live in a harsh environment.

b) Cold-solder or a component is intermittent. Again, these things live in a harsh environment, and something could have worked loose. Fine when sitting nicely on a bench, not so fine in use.

c) Try the probe in a pot of water. Bring it gently to a boil. It will never get above 212F, but you should be able to follow the change in resistance as the water heats, and it should be as gradual as the heating. The difference between a test at fixed points, and a test of behavior over actual range-of-use conditions.

I would start with c) first, as it will be the most immediately revealing.

Best of luck with it!

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA
  #3   Report Post  
Old June 2nd 20, 09:30 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,998
Default Thermistor Puzzle

On Monday, June 1, 2020 at 8:12:45 PM UTC-7, Paul Hovnanian P.E. wrote:
Given all this free time, I'm fixing stuff around the house.

I have a Brookstone Grill Alert. Stick a probe into a chunk of meat, plug
the cable (2.5mm phone plug) into the box and it happily monitors my steak
on the barbecue. Except it stopped working with unreasonably high readings
(150F reading at room temp). ...


It appears to expect an NTC thermistor with 180K ohms giving an 80 F reading
and 60K ohms reading 125F. But then I pick up the old (broken?) probe and
measure it. At room temp (65F) it has a 220K resistance. Holding the probe
in my hands drops its resistance to 140K. Seems to be OK. I wiggle the cord,
expecting an intermittent short (low resistance giving a high temp reading).
Nope. It's fine.


It might be that there's some oscillation at the sense amplifier; the impedance of
the probe wiring might be the issue.

If so, good news; that means it's not gonna need a new probe. Bad news,
you have an oscillating consumer device to debug.
  #4   Report Post  
Old June 2nd 20, 11:20 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Apr 2009
Posts: 200
Default Thermistor Puzzle

Paul Hovnanian P.E. wrote:

Given all this free time, I'm fixing stuff around the house.

I have a Brookstone Grill Alert. Stick a probe into a chunk of meat, plug
the cable (2.5mm phone plug) into the box and it happily monitors my steak
on the barbecue. Except it stopped working with unreasonably high readings
(150F reading at room temp). Wisdom on the 'Net says that the probe is
probably broken. But the replacement part (Brookstone) is no longer
available. No problem. I'll plug my decade resistance box into the grill
alert, start cranking in some resistance values and figure out the
thermistor curve. Then find another probe.

It appears to expect an NTC thermistor with 180K ohms giving an 80 F reading
and 60K ohms reading 125F. But then I pick up the old (broken?) probe and
measure it. At room temp (65F) it has a 220K resistance. Holding the probe
in my hands drops its resistance to 140K. Seems to be OK. I wiggle the cord,
expecting an intermittent short (low resistance giving a high temp reading).
Nope. It's fine. Maybe it's something wrong with the plug/jack interface. So
I open the box, unsolder a lead from the jack and measure the probe
resistance plugged in at the back of the jack. It reads 220K. Hook it all
back up and it's still wonky (probe gives a 150F reading sitting on my
desk). But if I plug my decade box in to the grill alert and dial it to 220K
ohms, the thing reads room temp.

The Grill Alert appears to just not like that probe. What have I missed?


Could it possibly be a semiconductor probe that uses the forward voltage
drop of a diode?


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk
  #5   Report Post  
Old June 3rd 20, 09:04 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2008
Posts: 24
Default Thermistor Puzzle

contamination inside the probe, subject to position of probe (vertical / horizontal, which jiggling the *wire* might not have changed). Grind off the crimp at its neck or whatever holds the wire, pull out sensor.



  #6   Report Post  
Old June 4th 20, 01:52 AM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Mar 2009
Posts: 170
Default Thermistor Puzzle


I chased down the curve of a microwave cooking probe. The way I did it depended on the temperatures of interest.

most temps
Stuck good and bad probes in a potatoe
Used peanut oil and the stove

Low temps
Stuck good and bad probes in a potatoe
Water and added ice cubes

I got an excellent curve match. It also turned out, that a random probe I purchased had the same curve.

The bad probe actually had an intermittent contact. The actual readout was broken at the time.


  #7   Report Post  
Old June 4th 20, 04:03 PM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Jul 2006
Posts: 420
Default Thermistor Puzzle

Adrian Tuddenham wrote:

Could it possibly be a semiconductor probe that uses the forward voltage
drop of a diode?


I checked the probe with both polarities of my ohmmeter. Also used the diode
test function to look for this.

The thing is that the temperature the device displays seems to work well
with a resistance decade box. And all the parasitics that introduces.

--
Paul Hovnanian
------------------------------------------------------------------
Only through suffering comes wisdom. -- Zeus

  #8   Report Post  
Old June 5th 20, 01:51 AM posted to sci.electronics.repair
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Dec 2008
Posts: 24
Default Thermistor Puzzle

Most failures are from wire fatigue, either at the neck of the probe or at the neck of the plug. Reasonably easy to fix, never really lasts though.


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What's the missing thermistor for? (Fortron-Sparkle PC PSU) larry moe 'n curly Electronics Repair 8 January 10th 06 06:40 AM
NTC 5D-9 Thermistor? Bob Shuman Electronics Repair 22 December 22nd 05 03:45 PM
PTC Thermistor in 11AK19 Joe Kelleher Electronics Repair 2 June 2nd 05 05:49 PM
RCA CTC177 Thermistor P/N dt Electronics Repair 2 August 11th 04 04:05 PM
Part Number for Degauss thermistor RT4201K for RCA CTC177BE Chassis TBell Electronics Repair 0 July 13th 04 05:26 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:51 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2021 DIYbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about DIY & home improvement"

 

Copyright © 2017