I'll get right to the point, and then add more info below for those who
want to read further. I don't know if this sort of a device exists, and
I've just spent all afternoon googling -- trying to find one -- without
any success at all. I hope that some kind person here will be able to
point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance for any help.

I'm looking for a programmable digit thermostat with a short probe that
just needs to reach about 2 inches through an insulated wall; in other
words, I want to mount the thermostat on the outside of a cabinet to
monitor and control the temp on the inside of the cabinet. I built the
cabinet a few years ago to ferment ale, but now I'd like to expand its
ability to include lagers which require more careful, critical control.

For ales, I used just a cheap household hvac thermostat mounted on the
inside, and there was no need for it to be programmable or even visible;
I just set it and forgot about it until the ale was done fermenting
about a week later. In fact, cooling was generally only important for
about the first 4 or 5 days, and the temperature requirements for ales
are so rough that most people don't use any cooling system at all except
perhaps to drape a wet towel over the fermenter to cool by evaporation.
I would just set my temp on 70F, and my system worked _very_ well. The
thermostat cycled a small fan (the type used to cool CPUs), and the fan
moved cold air from the lower ice compartment into the chamber where my
conical fermenter is suspended.

But lagers require _sustained_ cooling and conditioning, lasting perhaps
two months, with significantly cooler temps in the 35F to 55F range, and
with gradual, slow temperature changes (in contrast to ales which can
have a constant temp). If it isn't possible to program a thermostat to
constantly drop the temp at a controlled rate (e.g., 4-5F/day, max),
then I could manually lower the temp one degree every 6 hours or so, but
that would make having the control on the outside even more important.

What most homebrewers do is buy an old chest freezer and then change the
thermostat, but they usually use glass carboys as fermenters. I have a
conical fermenter which is too tall to put inside a chest freezer, and
my cabinet also doubles as the frame to support it. Besides, I'd really
like to try making a lager or two before deciding if I want to invest in
an extra freezer and converting it.

Also, if it turns out that my ice-cooling system isn't up to the job*, I
intend to try to augment the cooling by putting the system out in our
breezeway during the winter, but that presents the possibility of things
getting too cold, so I'd also like to be able to use the thermostat to
control some small heating device -- either a lightbulb or perhaps some
heat-tape like those used to prevent pipes from freezing. I figure that
the wires that usually control the air-conditioning will control my fan,
and those that control the heater will control my light-bulb or heating
strip.

*As for cooling power, the outside of my cooler is 16.5" x 16.5" x 34.5"
and it has 1.37" thick styrofoam (double 11/16") on all sides and top,
and 11/16" thick styrofoam between the two compartments. The lower
compartment can hold four frozen 1-gallon milk jugs, although I want to
play with that a bit because I'd like to suspend a 1/2-pint mason jar at
the bottom of my fermenter to collect yeast, etc.

Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated. I hope someone will be
able to help. Thanks.

Bill Velek -- remove the "--NO-SPAM--" from my email address

Bill Velek wrote:
I'll get right to the point, and then add more info below for those who
want to read further. I don't know if this sort of a device exists, and
I've just spent all afternoon googling -- trying to find one -- without
any success at all. I hope that some kind person here will be able to
point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance for any help.


snipped

Hi...

I think if you look at most any programmable thermostat,
you'll find that the "sensor" is simply a pair of
diodes... I can't think of any reason why you shouldn't
be able to remove them from the board and extend them.

Unfortunately I can't even imagine where you'll find
one that has more than a few programmable "steps".
Mine allows 4 - a wake up setting, a gone to work
temp, a home in the evening, and a sleeping.
Each can be different temps, and occur at any time
of the day. One of these would at least allow you
to attend to it only once in a 24 hour period rather
than every 6 hours

Mine is house branded (Mastercraft - Canadian Tire Corp
[a retail chain] - Canada) so I don't know who really
made it. But if you like I'll send you a few pics of
it; perhaps you can find out more through google.
Let me know.

Hope this helps.

Take care.

Ken

Ken Weitzel wrote:

Bill Velek wrote:

I'll get right to the point, and then add more info below for those
who want to read further. I don't know if this sort of a device
exists, and I've just spent all afternoon googling -- trying to find
one -- without any success at all. I hope that some kind person here
will be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance
for any help.

snipped

Hi...

I think if you look at most any programmable thermostat,
you'll find that the "sensor" is simply a pair of
diodes... I can't think of any reason why you shouldn't
be able to remove them from the board and extend them.

I can probably handle that.

Unfortunately I can't even imagine where you'll find
one that has more than a few programmable "steps".
Mine allows 4 - a wake up setting, a gone to work
temp, a home in the evening, and a sleeping.
Each can be different temps, and occur at any time
of the day. One of these would at least allow you
to attend to it only once in a 24 hour period rather
than every 6 hours

Well, I guess I could reprogram it every day or two, depending upon how
fast I want to drop the temp. If I want to drop it 4F degrees/day, then
I would set the time and temp like this:
wake 7:am 50F
work 1m 49F
home 7m 48F
sleep 1:am 47F
.... and then reset the next day for 46, 45, 44, and 43, respectively.
I'm not gone away overnight very often, so this would be nothing more
than a minor inconvenience.

Mine is house branded (Mastercraft - Canadian Tire Corp
[a retail chain] - Canada) so I don't know who really
made it. But if you like I'll send you a few pics of
it; perhaps you can find out more through google.
Let me know.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for the lead. Pics aren't necessary. The most important
question I have is what is the lowest temp setting. Many of these home
thermostats has a low of about 40F/5C, which isn't quite low enough.
Another friend suggested a possible circuitry modification, but I don't
know that much about electronics. Meanwhile, I have a couple of other
leads I can explore, and I guess I try looking a bit more, too.

Cheers.

Bill Velek -- remove the "--NO-SPAM--" from my email address

Bill Velek wrote:
Ken Weitzel wrote:


Bill Velek wrote:

I'll get right to the point, and then add more info below for those
who want to read further. I don't know if this sort of a device
exists, and I've just spent all afternoon googling -- trying to find
one -- without any success at all. I hope that some kind person here
will be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance
for any help.


snipped

Hi...

I think if you look at most any programmable thermostat,
you'll find that the "sensor" is simply a pair of
diodes... I can't think of any reason why you shouldn't
be able to remove them from the board and extend them.


I can probably handle that.

Unfortunately I can't even imagine where you'll find
one that has more than a few programmable "steps".
Mine allows 4 - a wake up setting, a gone to work
temp, a home in the evening, and a sleeping.
Each can be different temps, and occur at any time
of the day. One of these would at least allow you
to attend to it only once in a 24 hour period rather
than every 6 hours


Well, I guess I could reprogram it every day or two, depending upon how
fast I want to drop the temp. If I want to drop it 4F degrees/day, then
I would set the time and temp like this:
wake 7:am 50F
work 1m 49F
home 7m 48F
sleep 1:am 47F
... and then reset the next day for 46, 45, 44, and 43, respectively.
I'm not gone away overnight very often, so this would be nothing more
than a minor inconvenience.

Mine is house branded (Mastercraft - Canadian Tire Corp
[a retail chain] - Canada) so I don't know who really
made it. But if you like I'll send you a few pics of
it; perhaps you can find out more through google.
Let me know.

Hope this helps.


Thanks for the lead. Pics aren't necessary. The most important
question I have is what is the lowest temp setting. Many of these home
thermostats has a low of about 40F/5C, which isn't quite low enough.
Another friend suggested a possible circuitry modification, but I don't
know that much about electronics. Meanwhile, I have a couple of other
leads I can explore, and I guess I try looking a bit more, too.

Cheers.

Hi Bill...

Durn, didn't read carefully enough; guess I wasted your
time.

Just tried it, this one here at home only goes down to
to 55 degrees F.

Sorry about that.

Ken

Take a look at Lux 9000 http://www.luxproducts.com/thermostats/tx9000.htm

4 separate programs a day (28 total); cooling down to 45F. You'd have
to figure out where the temp sensor is and extend it.

Also take a look at Honeywell C67 - another 7 day programmable
heating/cooling stat


Ken Weitzel wrote:


Bill Velek wrote:

Ken Weitzel wrote:


Bill Velek wrote:

I'll get right to the point, and then add more info below for those
who want to read further. I don't know if this sort of a device
exists, and I've just spent all afternoon googling -- trying to find
one -- without any success at all. I hope that some kind person
here will be able to point me in the right direction. Thanks in
advance for any help.



snipped

Hi...

I think if you look at most any programmable thermostat,
you'll find that the "sensor" is simply a pair of
diodes... I can't think of any reason why you shouldn't
be able to remove them from the board and extend them.



I can probably handle that.

Unfortunately I can't even imagine where you'll find
one that has more than a few programmable "steps".
Mine allows 4 - a wake up setting, a gone to work
temp, a home in the evening, and a sleeping.
Each can be different temps, and occur at any time
of the day. One of these would at least allow you
to attend to it only once in a 24 hour period rather
than every 6 hours



Well, I guess I could reprogram it every day or two, depending upon
how fast I want to drop the temp. If I want to drop it 4F
degrees/day, then I would set the time and temp like this:
wake 7:am 50F
work 1m 49F
home 7m 48F
sleep 1:am 47F
... and then reset the next day for 46, 45, 44, and 43, respectively.
I'm not gone away overnight very often, so this would be nothing more
than a minor inconvenience.

Mine is house branded (Mastercraft - Canadian Tire Corp
[a retail chain] - Canada) so I don't know who really
made it. But if you like I'll send you a few pics of
it; perhaps you can find out more through google.
Let me know.

Hope this helps.



Thanks for the lead. Pics aren't necessary. The most important
question I have is what is the lowest temp setting. Many of these
home thermostats has a low of about 40F/5C, which isn't quite low
enough. Another friend suggested a possible circuitry modification,
but I don't know that much about electronics. Meanwhile, I have a
couple of other leads I can explore, and I guess I try looking a bit
more, too.

Cheers.


Hi Bill...

Durn, didn't read carefully enough; guess I wasted your
time.

Just tried it, this one here at home only goes down to
to 55 degrees F.

Sorry about that.

Ken