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Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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#1
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N
channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. |
#2
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote:
Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? http://www.datasheetarchive.com/2--PF5301-2-datasheet.html Not exactly a data sheet, but it does have some specs. There should be some other acceptable devices in the chart. 2N4117A or 2N4118 look very close. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#3
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:08:55 -0700 Jeff Liebermann
wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? http://www.datasheetarchive.com/2--PF5301-2-datasheet.html Not exactly a data sheet, but it does have some specs. There should be some other acceptable devices in the chart. 2N4117A or 2N4118 look very close. ITYM PN4117A and PN4118A. [Google] Or maybe so? Those do look good and there seems to be some out there, but I'm not too crazy about sources that ask for a RFQ only to tell you that they have a $100 minimum. Was hoping for something I could buy at Digikey or Mouser or some other distributor with no minimums. Although there is a Vishay 2N4117A-E3 http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/...39y4wHUM%3d I I wonder what the -E3 means? I found a datasheet, but it does not state what -E3 is. Vishay also has a 2N4118A. http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/...dZHJqghFYzA%3d In stock too. Maybe I'll give that one a go, wrong package but beggars can't be choosers. A pity that these are all EOL. *sigh* Thanks, Jeff. |
#4
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:51:41 -0400, JW wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:08:55 -0700 Jeff Liebermann wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? http://www.datasheetarchive.com/2--PF5301-2-datasheet.html Not exactly a data sheet, but it does have some specs. There should be some other acceptable devices in the chart. 2N4117A or 2N4118 look very close. ITYM PN4117A and PN4118A. [Google] Or maybe so? Actually, they look very much like the PF5301 with a JEDEC registered number instead of a NS only number. Those do look good and there seems to be some out there, but I'm not too crazy about sources that ask for a RFQ only to tell you that they have a $100 minimum. Was hoping for something I could buy at Digikey or Mouser or some other distributor with no minimums. Welcome to eBay, my favorite source for all things odd and unobtainable. www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=2n4117 www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=2n4118 I suggest you buy from two different US vendors and get some spares. Don't be surprised if you get unarked parts stolen off the production line, fished out of the rejects bin, or are counterfeits (especially electrolytics). For eBay parts, you can have anything you want except quality. Q302 is not part of a differential pair, so you shouldn't need to do any matching. Good luck. A pity that these are all EOL. *sigh* I'm getting old enough to be declared EOL. No sympathy. -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#5
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
A pity that these are all EOL. *sigh* I managed to purchase a few dozen PN4117A (new-old-stock Calogic) on eBay last year... figured they might be useful for playing around with ion-chamber radiation detector designs. There are still a couple of vendors on eBay offering these. -- Dave Platt AE6EO Friends of Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads! |
#6
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote:
Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? -- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom timing and laser controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME analog, thermocouple, LVDT, synchro, tachometer Multichannel arbitrary waveform generators |
#7
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin
wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. |
#8
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
What's the application? Do you really need a jfet?
I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Hmmm... Would that -- or a similar -- op-amp be suitable? |
#9
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:33:35 -0400, JW wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. Yikes, it's a jfet darlington! Really a weird circuit, overall. I bet a 2N7000 would work. It's just an AC amplifier. Gate currents on a 2N7000 are femtoamps. You can turn one halfway on and leave the gate open, and it will stay halfway on for hours. Fun to play with. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...rts/2N7000.jpg -- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom timing and laser controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME analog, thermocouple, LVDT, synchro, tachometer Multichannel arbitrary waveform generators |
#10
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:44:57 -0700, John Larkin
wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:33:35 -0400, JW wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. Yikes, it's a jfet darlington! Really a weird circuit, overall. I bet a 2N7000 would work. It's just an AC amplifier. Gate currents on a 2N7000 are femtoamps. You can turn one halfway on and leave the gate open, and it will stay halfway on for hours. Fun to play with. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...rts/2N7000.jpg Hmmm, biasing might be tricky. It might be better to replace both jfets with one 2N7000. Q302 has a lot of drain-source voltage. I'm wondering why it doesn't have a lot of gate current. -- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom timing and laser controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME analog, thermocouple, LVDT, synchro, tachometer Multichannel arbitrary waveform generators |
#11
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On 6/28/2013 12:34 PM, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:44:57 -0700, John Larkin wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:33:35 -0400, JW wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. Yikes, it's a jfet darlington! Really a weird circuit, overall. I bet a 2N7000 would work. It's just an AC amplifier. Gate currents on a 2N7000 are femtoamps. You can turn one halfway on and leave the gate open, and it will stay halfway on for hours. Fun to play with. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...rts/2N7000.jpg Hmmm, biasing might be tricky. It might be better to replace both jfets with one 2N7000. Q302 has a lot of drain-source voltage. I'm wondering why it doesn't have a lot of gate current. Maybe it's a cascode internally? Cheers Phil Hobbs -- Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 USA +1 845 480 2058 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net |
#12
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On 06/28/2013 05:44 PM, John Larkin wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:33:35 -0400, JW wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. Yikes, it's a jfet darlington! Really a weird circuit, overall. I bet a 2N7000 would work. It's just an AC amplifier. Gate currents on a 2N7000 are femtoamps. You can turn one halfway on and leave the gate open, and it will stay halfway on for hours. Fun to play with. Did you get the fA figure by measurements? The Onsemi and the Fairchild give 10 nA as the leakage value. Guess they are much better than specified... Pere https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...rts/2N7000.jpg |
#13
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
o pere o writes:
On 06/28/2013 05:44 PM, John Larkin wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:33:35 -0400, JW wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. Yikes, it's a jfet darlington! Really a weird circuit, overall. I bet a 2N7000 would work. It's just an AC amplifier. Gate currents on a 2N7000 are femtoamps. You can turn one halfway on and leave the gate open, and it will stay halfway on for hours. Fun to play with. Did you get the fA figure by measurements? The Onsemi and the Fairchild give 10 nA as the leakage value. Guess they are much better than specified... I expect they can't be bothered to test them; it would take too long to resolve fA I think. But 10nA is huge. [...] -- John Devereux |
#14
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 19:39:31 +0200, o pere o wrote:
On 06/28/2013 05:44 PM, John Larkin wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 10:33:35 -0400, JW wrote: On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 06:51:11 -0700 John Larkin wrote in Message id: : On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 08:45:19 -0400, JW wrote: Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. What's the application? Do you really need a jfet? I'm pretty sure I do, as it looks to be a fairly sensitive circuit. It's for a repair on a Keithley 220 programmable current source. http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...eEEYYk4sluspuA The schematic is on page 6-31/6-32 (4 pages from the end) location Q302 near the top of the page. It's part of circuit which uses a AD515K FET-Input Electrometer Op-amp. Thanks. Yikes, it's a jfet darlington! Really a weird circuit, overall. I bet a 2N7000 would work. It's just an AC amplifier. Gate currents on a 2N7000 are femtoamps. You can turn one halfway on and leave the gate open, and it will stay halfway on for hours. Fun to play with. Did you get the fA figure by measurements? The Onsemi and the Fairchild give 10 nA as the leakage value. Guess they are much better than specified... Pere Yes, by experimenting. Leakage seems to be modest numbers of electrons per second. That would be hard to production test, on a 3 cent part. -- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com http://www.highlandtechnology.com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom laser drivers and controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation |
#15
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
In article ,
o pere o writes: Did you get the fA figure by measurements? The Onsemi and the Fairchild give 10 nA as the leakage value. Guess they are much better than specified... If it's speced at 10 nA at max temperature, what would you expect at room temp? -- These are my opinions. I hate spam. |
#16
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
JW schrieb:
Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. ... Hi, I could send you photos (don't have access to a scanner till Monday): interested? If yes, just contact me per PM. CU Reinhard |
#17
Posted to sci.electronics.repair,sci.electronics.design,sci.electronics.components
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National PF5301 cross reference
JW wrote:
Looking for a suitable cross-reference for a National PF5301 TO-92 N channel JFET as I can't find the original part anywhere. Hell, I can't even find an original datasheet. The critical parameter for the sub is Igss which for the National part is 1pA. The only thing I've been able to find so far is a Linear Systems LS5301 which has a Ig of 1pA, but at $40 a pop (!), I'd like to find an alternate. Does anyone know of any possible substitutes? Thanks. How about this? http://www.trendsetter.com/v/vspfile...40,%20U441.pdf Around $8 but there's two in the package. -- Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/ |
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