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Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
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#1
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Smoke detector testing
We do fire alarm system inspections. To test smoke detectors we use a
spray can which contains an inocuous compound.. When sprayed a few feet below a smoke detector it emits a mist which temporarily obstucts the sense chamber in a photoelectic detector and sets it off. The mist quickly clears and the detector returns to quiescent conditions. I recently offered to do annual testing for the local church and synagogue in town as a donation. Both sanctuaries have high cathedral ceilings. The detectors cannot be reached even from ladders. I have learned that there is an extention pole assembly with a clamp on the end to hold the spray can. The basic kit takes you up to 10 feet. Then you add extention poles after that. The nozzle of the can is operated by way of a cable or linkage through the hollow fiberglass pole from below and sprays the can. I don't mind donating my time however buying the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 I was thinking of trying to adapt something but I'm not sure what. I was wondering if this has ever come up in any other trade that someone may know of. Any advice will be most sincerely appreciated. Lenny. |
#2
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Smoke detector testing
Hi Lenny,
klem kedidelhopper wrote: We do fire alarm system inspections. To test smoke detectors we use a spray can which contains an inocuous compound.. When sprayed a few feet below a smoke detector it emits a mist which temporarily obstucts the sense chamber in a photoelectic detector and sets it off. The mist quickly clears and the detector returns to quiescent conditions. I recently offered to do annual testing for the local church and synagogue in town as a donation. Both sanctuaries have high cathedral ceilings. The detectors cannot be reached even from ladders. I have learned that there is an extention pole assembly with a clamp on the end to hold the spray can. The basic kit takes you up to 10 feet. Then you add extention poles after that. The nozzle of the can is operated by way of a cable or linkage through the hollow fiberglass pole from below and sprays the can. I don't mind donating my time however buying the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 I was thinking of trying to adapt something but I'm not sure what. I was wondering if this has ever come up in any other trade that someone may know of. Any advice will be most sincerely appreciated. Lenny. I assume by "spray can" you mean "aerosol" -- like a woman's hair spray? (i.e., button on top that your fingertip depresses to release the contents of the can) What's the ceiling made out of (wallboard, wood, etc.)? Could you firmly affix can to *a* pole (wooden dowel, aluminum rod, etc.) and simply press it up *against* the ceiling (hence my concern over what the ceiling is made of -- lest you mark or damage it in the process) with its nozzle pointed towards the smoke detector? Alternatively, a tree pruning saw (the sort that uses a telescoping fiberglass pole -- $40 at Home Despot) with saw blade removed and can affixed below the "chopping blade" (different from the *saw* blade) so that tugging on the rope pulls the actuating lever down onto the spray can "button" (?) |
#3
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Smoke detector testing
On 10/26/2010 10:34 AM, klem kedidelhopper wrote:
I don't mind donating my time however buying the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 Go to a paint store or Home Depot and get a painter's extension pole. And a 4-6" strap hinge. Duct tape the can near the top of the pole along with the hinge so it lays over the push button on the can, use a string to pull the hinge and push the button. Make believe you're tagging your favorite freeway over pass. Jeff |
#4
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Smoke detector testing
On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 08:34:16 -0700 (PDT), klem kedidelhopper
wrote: I don't mind donating my time however buying the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 Nice of you to leave off the necessary length for the extension pole. Cathedral ceiling? Yeah, the pro kit can cost $400. http://www.brooksequipment.com/Fire_Alarm_Products/Fire_Alarm_Inspection%2C_Testing_and_Maintenance_P roducts/Smoke_Detector_Testing/SOLO http://www.brooksequipment.com/images/products/600/SOLOST1.jpg http://www.brooksequipment.com/Fire_Alarm_Products/Fire_Alarm_Inspection,_Testing_and_Maintenance_Pro ducts/Smoke_Detector_Testing According to some friends in the fire alarm biz, the problem is blowing the dust out of the smoke detector before running the test. I was thinking of trying to adapt something but I'm not sure what. I was wondering if this has ever come up in any other trade that someone may know of. Any advice will be most sincerely appreciated. Lenny. I use a 3 section fiberglass extension pole that's about 20ft long. About $60. (Very handy for antenna tests). Over 20ft long, they get kinda pricey. At 40ft, the aluminum versions are about $120. You can get all manner of adapters for the top, including one for spray cans. http://www.amazon.com/Spray-Close-6001-Extender/dp/B0014HBQLA http://www.gotchasprayer.com http://www.gotchasprayer.com/GotchaSprayerPro.htm Note that under "applications" it lists "smoke detector testing". Smoke Check spray is about $10/can. As an alternative, it might be easier to keep the can on the ground, and simply project the spray. Get a 20ft long soda straw or equivalent, attach it to the can nozzle, and spray from the ground. If you need additional lift, use an air compressor to help move the spray contents towards the ceiling. See if this gives you any ideas: http://www.waynesthisandthat.com/airblasters.html Fill the Wham-o Air Blaster with some magic smoke liquid, and fire away. If you're really cheap, fill a zip lock bag with a blast of your magic spray. Attach it to a mouse trap. Attach to the fiberglass extension pole. Connect a string as a trigger mechanism. When in the vicinity of the smoke alarm, pull on the string, which springs the mouse trap, which will pop the bag, and release the contents. Rube Goldberg would be proud. If you're avionically incline, purchase a remote control electric helicopter and have a it drag a plastic bag full of the magic smoke near the smoke alarm. Puncture the bag with whatever mechanism is available. While not as practical as the other suggestions, this might be the most fun. If too technically challenging, a helium balloon on a string might provide the necessary lift. Use a laser or dart gun from the ground to puncture the bag. Ummm... this has what to do with electronic repair? -- Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558 |
#5
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Smoke detector testing
On 26/10/2010 17:58, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
On Tue, 26 Oct 2010 08:34:16 -0700 (PDT), klem kedidelhopper wrote: I don't mind donating my time however buying the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 Nice of you to leave off the necessary length for the extension pole. Cathedral ceiling? Yeah, the pro kit can cost $400. http://www.brooksequipment.com/Fire_Alarm_Products/Fire_Alarm_Inspection%2C_Testing_and_Maintenance_P roducts/Smoke_Detector_Testing/SOLO http://www.brooksequipment.com/images/products/600/SOLOST1.jpg http://www.brooksequipment.com/Fire_Alarm_Products/Fire_Alarm_Inspection,_Testing_and_Maintenance_Pro ducts/Smoke_Detector_Testing According to some friends in the fire alarm biz, the problem is blowing the dust out of the smoke detector before running the test. I was thinking of trying to adapt something but I'm not sure what. I was wondering if this has ever come up in any other trade that someone may know of. Any advice will be most sincerely appreciated. Lenny. I use a 3 section fiberglass extension pole that's about 20ft long. About $60. (Very handy for antenna tests). Over 20ft long, they get kinda pricey. At 40ft, the aluminum versions are about $120. You can get all manner of adapters for the top, including one for spray cans. http://www.amazon.com/Spray-Close-6001-Extender/dp/B0014HBQLA http://www.gotchasprayer.com http://www.gotchasprayer.com/GotchaSprayerPro.htm Note that under "applications" it lists "smoke detector testing". Smoke Check spray is about $10/can. As an alternative, it might be easier to keep the can on the ground, and simply project the spray. Get a 20ft long soda straw or equivalent, attach it to the can nozzle, and spray from the ground. If you need additional lift, use an air compressor to help move the spray contents towards the ceiling. See if this gives you any ideas: http://www.waynesthisandthat.com/airblasters.html Fill the Wham-o Air Blaster with some magic smoke liquid, and fire away. If you're really cheap, fill a zip lock bag with a blast of your magic spray. Attach it to a mouse trap. Attach to the fiberglass extension pole. Connect a string as a trigger mechanism. When in the vicinity of the smoke alarm, pull on the string, which springs the mouse trap, which will pop the bag, and release the contents. Rube Goldberg would be proud. If you're avionically incline, purchase a remote control electric helicopter and have a it drag a plastic bag full of the magic smoke near the smoke alarm. Puncture the bag with whatever mechanism is available. While not as practical as the other suggestions, this might be the most fun. If too technically challenging, a helium balloon on a string might provide the necessary lift. Use a laser or dart gun from the ground to puncture the bag. Ummm... this has what to do with electronic repair? Or you could just tie a bit of smouldering rope/rag/cigar/other combustible to the end of a long pole... |
#6
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Smoke detector testing
On 10/26/2010 10:08 AM Ron spake thus:
On 26/10/2010 17:58, Jeff Liebermann wrote: As an alternative, it might be easier to keep the can on the ground, and simply project the spray. Get a 20ft long soda straw or equivalent, attach it to the can nozzle, and spray from the ground. If you need additional lift, use an air compressor to help move the spray contents towards the ceiling. Or you could just tie a bit of smouldering rope/rag/cigar/other combustible to the end of a long pole... .... and hope the smoldering stuff doesn't get caught on something combustible attached to the ceiling and set the damn church on fire. Have you ever been at the bottom of a 40-foot pole with a weight on the top, trying to guide it somewhere? It ain't easy. -- The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring, with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags. - Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com) |
#7
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Smoke detector testing
David Nebenzahl wrote:
Have you ever been at the bottom of a 40-foot pole with a weight on the top, trying to guide it somewhere? It ain't easy. I assume guiding the pole is the basic problem. The OP didn't say how high the ceiling was, which might help. I changed a 300W bulb about 40 ft up working from a tall step ladder then using a standard light bulb changing pole and extensions. Three light ropes were tied at the top to control where the bulb grabber went, with 3 people on the ground guiding. After about 1 extension, you have to guide the top as you add extensions. Working on a ladder allows adding an extension under the stack. Extensions were around 8 or 10 ft. You could probably kludge the extensions with 1/2 or 3/4" EMT and good couplings. |
#8
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Smoke detector testing
Ron wrote:
[snip] Or you could just tie a bit of smouldering rope/rag/cigar/other combustible to the end of a long pole... +42 |
#9
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Smoke detector testing
On Oct 26, 8:34*am, klem kedidelhopper
wrote: We do fire alarm system inspections. To test smoke detectors we use a spray can... high cathedral ceilings. ... the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 So, how about a smoke candle stub in a wire-cage, and one of those little RC helicopters? Or a smoke-ring blower (takes an oatmeal can and a rubber-glove and a bit of string) on a stick? You can aim the smoke-ring in still air... It doesn't have to be 'official' equipment, does it? |
#10
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Smoke detector testing
whit3rd wrote in message
... On Oct 26, 8:34 am, klem kedidelhopper wrote: We do fire alarm system inspections. To test smoke detectors we use a spray can... high cathedral ceilings. ... the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 So, how about a smoke candle stub in a wire-cage, and one of those little RC helicopters? Or a smoke-ring blower (takes an oatmeal can and a rubber-glove and a bit of string) on a stick? You can aim the smoke-ring in still air... It doesn't have to be 'official' equipment, does it? ********* A lot of air movement with helicopter but I like the vortex generator idea. Ascending to heaven in a stable interior environment should work very well, those vortexes travel great distance before distorting or deviating |
#11
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Smoke detector testing
Fix a cheapo laser pointer to the vortex barrel for sighting the target.
With cold smoke and barrel mounted vertically you are at an advantage being able to let the smoke stabilise in the barrel before triggering, for very symetrical and stable and far reaching smoke rings |
#12
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Smoke detector testing
On 10/27/2010 6:35 AM N_Cook spake thus:
Fix a cheapo laser pointer to the vortex barrel for sighting the target. With cold smoke and barrel mounted vertically you are at an advantage being able to let the smoke stabilise in the barrel before triggering, for very symetrical and stable and far reaching smoke rings Smoke rings, you say? Forget all these other ideas! Just get a man-lift and a cigar. Don't have to go all the way "up to heaven", just far enough to get a nice big fat smoke ring up to the detector. -- The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring, with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags. - Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com) |
#13
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Smoke detector testing
On Oct 27, 7:13*pm, David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 10/27/2010 6:35 AM N_Cook spake thus: Fix a cheapo laser pointer to the vortex barrel for sighting the target.. With cold smoke and barrel mounted vertically you are at an advantage being able to let the smoke stabilise in the barrel before triggering, for very symetrical and stable and far reaching smoke rings Smoke rings, you say? Forget all these other ideas! Just get a man-lift and a cigar. Don't have to go all the way "up to heaven", just far enough to get a nice big fat smoke ring up to the detector. -- The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring, with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags. - Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com) I found a site that someone posted for a company out West. Their product is actually made better than the 400.00 one and costs less than 100.00 It comes with a 24 foot extension pole With that and me on a ladder if necessary will do the job. Thanks to everyone who responded for all your ideas and suggestions. iespecially liked the hekicopter idea. It would be an interesting experiment to fasten a spray can onto the helicopter take it up to the smoke detector and have a servo depress the nozzle. Don't know if the people at the church would appreciate the creativity of this though...Lenny |
#14
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Smoke detector testing
On Oct 26, 4:16*pm, whit3rd wrote:
On Oct 26, 8:34*am, klem kedidelhopper wrote: We do fire alarm system inspections. To test smoke detectors we use a spray can... high cathedral ceilings. ... the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 So, how about a smoke candle stub in a wire-cage, and one of those little RC helicopters? Oh, I've always wanted one of the RC blimps. That would be great fun flying around in a church. "Say Deacon, it's been a month since I last tested the smoke detector better get the blimp out." George H. Or a smoke-ring blower (takes an oatmeal can and a rubber-glove and a bit of string) on a stick? *You can aim the smoke-ring in still air... It doesn't have to be 'official' equipment, does it? |
#15
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Smoke detector testing
"klem kedidelhopper" wrote in message ... We do fire alarm system inspections. To test smoke detectors we use a spray can which contains an inocuous compound.. When sprayed a few feet below a smoke detector it emits a mist which temporarily obstucts the sense chamber in a photoelectic detector and sets it off. The mist quickly clears and the detector returns to quiescent conditions. I recently offered to do annual testing for the local church and synagogue in town as a donation. Both sanctuaries have high cathedral ceilings. The detectors cannot be reached even from ladders. I have learned that there is an extention pole assembly with a clamp on the end to hold the spray can. The basic kit takes you up to 10 feet. Then you add extention poles after that. The nozzle of the can is operated by way of a cable or linkage through the hollow fiberglass pole from below and sprays the can. I don't mind donating my time however buying the equipment which is needed to reach these detectors in the sanctuaries in both buildings will cost me over 400.00 I was thinking of trying to adapt something but I'm not sure what. I was wondering if this has ever come up in any other trade that someone may know of. Any advice will be most sincerely appreciated. Lenny. **You're a fool. Churches get people to do stuff for nothing all the time. Just don't do it. They're in business to suck money away from the gullible. Charge them like any other client. Awhile ago I quote a church on a sound system. They didn't like my quote and got some idiots to do the job for free. Now I have to come in and fix it up so it works properly. It'll cost them more than the original quote. Pay peanuts, get monkeys and all that. Charge them for the job at your normal rates, plus any extra equipment. Do not be a patsy for these cults. -- Trevor Wilson www.rageaudio.com.au |
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