DIYbanter - View Single Post - 20 amp circuit/14-2 wire?

From: "TURTLE"

"HA HA Budys Here" wrote in message
...
From: "deloid"

I am planning to have an isolated ceiling fan switch as an end run of a 20
amp circuit.

I ran 14-2 wire from the fan...to the new switch...to the receptacle that
was 15 amp. As I was preparing to tie this all together I noticed that the
receptacle was fed by 12-2 wire and...sure enough there is a 20 amp
breaker.

Since the fan (no lights) hardly pulls any amperage it seems like I should
be able to run the 14-2 anyway.

Thoughts?

No it's illegal.

This is Turtle.

No Happy, A home owner can do as he pleases if he does it and never sells the

house without disclosing the problem before the sale. If he discloses it on
the
sale. he has no problem.

OK so, installing non-code compliant electrical work is not a violation if it's
done by a homeowner and it's disclosed upon the sale.

So Happy it's not illegal for a home owner to do it but only to a Electrician
it
is illegal.

You're repeating yourself. It's legal for homeowners to install electrical
wiring that does not meet the electrical code.

I suppose if this was being inspected, no violation could be issued either.

Let me ask you one here. Have you ever seen a home owner in court

because he wired his own house wrong.

Yes. Although not literally because I wasn't actually in the courtroom while
the homeowner was testfying. But I do know of a homeowner whose home burned
down due which killed his tenant, his wife, and a number of family pets.

His home, an older Cape with a 2-car garage connected by breezeway had an
apartment built over the garage and wired by the homeowner. He ran out of oil
one night and gave the tenant electric heaters until the oil company could fill
the tank the next day.

Because of his work, the wiring from the apartment through the breezeway, which
was undersized for the breakers, heated up and started a fire which destroyed 2
lives and prompted his insurer to NOT pay for the loss of the dwelling as
neither the additional uninspected wiring or the finished space above the
garage were ever inspected.

For over a year his story was on the web, and he displayed a large sign on the
now-vacant lot criticizing his homeowner's insurance company in an attempt to
warn others, and direct passers-by to his website. The website unfortunately is
gone now.

The NEC is for professional and it is
not
for home owners to be made to follow.

You are absolutely out of your freakin' mind. And if you really believed this
crap, your reply to any homeowner with an electrical question would be "do
whatever you want, homeowners don't have to comply with the NEC -only
professional licensed electricians do."

the Home owner should follow the NEC
but
there is no law that says they have to.

This from a man who thinks a heat pump with a 40a 220v feed and it's backup
duct heater requiring 60a 220v is a more efficient means of heating a home in
the Northeast with a .14 KWH rate than natural gas or home heating oil.

I think you should stick to knocking tin. After you've read 90.2 a, paragraph
1, below...

Happy your going to have to get out more and check on jobs and codes More.

TURTLE

(Assuming the OP's AHJ has adopted the NEC...)

ARTICLE 90 -- Introduction
90-1. Purpose
(a) Practical Safeguarding. The purpose of this Code is the practical
safeguarding of persons and property from hazards arising from the use of
electricity.
(b) Adequacy. This Code contains provisions that are considered necessary for
safety. Compliance therewith and proper maintenance will result in an
installation that is essentially free from hazard but not necessarily
efficient, convenient, or adequate for good service or future expansion of
electrical use.
FPN: Hazards often occur because of overloading of wiring systems by methods or
usage not in conformity with this Code. This occurs because initial wiring did
not provide for increases in the use of electricity. An initial adequate
installation and reasonable provisions for system changes will provide for
future increases in the use of electricity.
(c) Intention. This Code is not intended as a design specification nor an
instruction manual for untrained persons.

90-2. Scope

(a) Covered. This Code covers the following.

1. Installations of electric conductors and equipment within or on public and
private buildings or other structures, (continued below)

Notice Turtle, it doesn't specify installation by WHOM. It covers and is
applicable to the installation *of*, not the installer...

including mobile homes, recreational vehicles, and floating buildings; and
other premises such as yards, carnival, parking, and other lots, and industrial
substations.