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John Harmon John Harmon is offline
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Default Advice requested from those of you who have successfully checked camber at home

Bill Vanek actually said:

The old standard was always about +- 1 degree, when you had no other
specs to go by. Enthusiast cars like the BMW have different needs for
handling purposes.


I just looked that up for my two cars.

The Toyota spec for the front camber is -.6? to .9? which is exactly in the
range you suggested.

The BMW rear camber E39 I6 and 540 models with "standard," "low slung
sport" and "M-sport" suspensions spec is apparently -2 deg 10 minutes. The
tolerance varies among options: either +/- 20 minutes or +/- 25 minutes of
angle.

The M5 spec is -1 deg 50 minutes perhaps due to 275/35 section width tires
vs 225/55 for I6 cars.


I hate to say this, but you can get pretty close just eyeballing toe
and camber. Especially with camber, if you can't see any substantial
lean, the camber is probably close enough that it won't cause tire
wear. In a pinch, it works for toe, too.


For the caster on the toyota of 1.7 to 3.2 degrees, I am not yet sure how
to measure it for the Toyota but I won't have to bother for the bimmer
because caster isn't adjustable.

For the camber of -.6 to .9 degrees for the Toyota, I think I'll use a
magnetic base inclinometer such as the Husky 10-inch Home Depot electronic
level.

I think I'll just set the toe to 1/16th of an inch less in the front tread
(measured as close to centerline of the wheel as possible) than in the back
tread to centerline of the vehicle.

That will give me a total toe of 1/8th inch on the Toyota.
I'll use toe plates and a tape measure, I think.

It's not necessarily a repeatable test, though. The one time you do
that, you might have gotten lucky.


True. But it would be free if I got lucky!

They are expected to print out the readings, so it takes some effort
to lie. I'm sure they usually find something, but that's only because
cars do go out of alignment.


But if I align it first, it should be within spec, at least for what can be
aligned, which is, for the toyota, front caster, camber, and toe, and for
the bimmer, rear caster and toe and front toe.

I'm pretty sure that none of the manufacturers expect techs to load a
car before alignment anymore. The specs take into account average
occupant weights.


The 500 pound loading on a bimmer is for a different purpose.
You are supposed to put 100 pounds on the driver seat, 100 pounds on the
passenger front seat, and 200 pounds evenly spaced on the rear bench and
100 pounds in the trunk.

That artificially "lowers" the car to a specific "ride height" which all
BMW alignment specs are to.

There is much discussion of why BMW uses that artificial ride height to
normalize all their specs, but it has absolutely nothing to do with the
"typical" loading of a vehicle with a driver.

I doubt a single car tire is installed correctly, by the book, on any car
taken to the typical tire shops (wheel works, goodyear, midas, etc.).


And I doubt that it makes the least bit of difference.


I mostly agree with you that when the tire shop torques *all* lug nuts and
bolts to the same 100 foot pounds, it probably doesn't hurt anything. Nor
if they fill up all tires to the same 40 psi, again, it won't kill anyone
(even though BMW specifies different pressure for the front versus the
rear).

That they pry off the BBS hubcaps with a screwdriver just breaks the
plastic tabs. And that they don't remove all the old weights just makes
them put more on each time (and increases the chances of an imbalance from
a lost weight).

And that they don't mount the tire with the red or yellow dots to the valve
stem or match mounting mark just means they'll use more weight than
necessary.

That they don't even torque the bolts in a star pattern probably only makes
the wheel slightly crooked.

So, I agree with you that the fact that no tire is ever mounted correctly
isn't causing accidents left and right.

But it's still wrong.