On 2/8/2016 6:14 PM, OFWW wrote:
On Mon, 8 Feb 2016 16:23:06 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
On 2/8/2016 1:11 PM, OFWW wrote:
Snip
I'm not going to try to persuade you to get the Domino if you can't wrap
your head around the price yet. Notice I said yet. LOL At a certain
point Festool prices no longer seemed to be a real deterrent for me.
You are getting what you pay for a majority of the time and top quality.
The thing that made me think and rethink buying the Domino was if I
would/could justify the expense. As it turns out I use it on "every"
piece I build. I have come up with unique ways to use it other than
what you might think too.
If you are into about woodworking and it is not a faze in your life you
most likely will use the Domino on every thing you build.
On that drawing I sent you for the night stands. The drawings don't
show it but there are Domino floating tenons in every FF joint. That
includes the back FFs lap joints. All totaled so far on these night
stands there are 40 mortises and floating tenons. Now think about
cutting 40 precise mortises with a bench top mortiser. I'm not sure I
cut 40 mortises with my mortiser total. And FWIW the mortiser chisels
have to be kept sharp, and from the factory sharp is not sharp enough.
There is a lot of friction on those chisels and you want a mirror
surface on the outside surfaces. And then the smaller bits break easily
and those are special bits.
I would advise using jigs and a router over purchasing a bench top
mortiser. Mortisers are a lot like band saws. You have to buy a good
one to get good results. Cheap does not get you there.
In thinking about my cabinet doors, Freud makes a nice router set that
makes a tenon on the rails, when done properly, but the stile still
requires a way of making a mortise.
If I understand what you are talking about,,,,,
I would strongly advise against that set up. Those sets do a good job
but you can do much better with a dado set. Unless!!!! you are looking
at a cope and stick set of bits. The problem with the tennon set/bit is
that it makes a fixed thickness tenon. Your panel probably will not fit
properly in the groves that the tenon will fit onto. Most likely the
panel will be loose.
Here is a short video with the extended tenon option for cabinet
doors.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlCC9SsdMNY#t=15
OK. That will be fine, I was thinking of a simpler set.
Which requires a mortise in the stiles. Our plan was to make cathedral
style doors, and in the corner upper cabinet doors to use glass and
have a stile and rails on the face of the glass of the two doors. The
rest of the doors I would rather not have raised panels, but flush or
inset, where you can see a small grove on the back of the panel where
you can see part of the normal tenon. I hope I am clear enough on
that. I also like the hidden tenon option, but if it is not seen some
people might think the joint was just a box joint.
Would you mind post a picture of the back of your night stand to see?
Funny, but without seeing it, the project is not completed in my minds
eye. 
There now, I have not attached the backs yet but they will fit in the
rabbet recess.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb112...posted-public/
I cut a grove in my stiles and rails centered to accept the exact width
of the panel or plywood panel that I will be using. Cut a grove
slightly off center on the edge of a scrap. Flip the piece end for end
and cut again. This method will perfectly center the groove. Sneak up
on the fence setting until you have that groove perfect.
I cut that groove 1/2" deep
Next with a stacked dado set set the blade to cut 1/2" wide or a little
wider and use a sacrificial fence to partially bury the blade and to
index how long the tenon will be cut repeatedly. Cut both ends of the
rails on both sides and both ends to form a tenon to perfectly match the
width of the grooves on the rails and stiles.
You get this.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/lcb112...posted-public/
Which would make my life considerably easier. I realize that with the
doors comes the hinge options and once my drawings are completed the I
was going to focus on that part of it before I actually start building
the cases. I've been considering the options, and I know that where I
have drawers behind doors that I need to be sure they swing wide
enough open.
Typically with Euro style hinges you get enough clearance from the door
but you need to consider how much room the actual hinge takes up if it
is not mounted on the face of the face frame.
Funny, In the HVAC trader there are seven other trades that we have to
be fluent in. All the skill sets, and then interactions with
carpenters and the like. So I know I can do most any trade if needed,
but getting involved with wood working and its various options and
their integrations is a new animal to me. Hanging the cabinets should
be easy enough as I did that for our control jobs, but in this case I
am the one building the cabinets and responsible for their continued
usage.
Kudos' to all you guys, especially you and Karl, and others with their
niche's.
And as far as ff's go and reading
your posts it just seems like the domino is the way to go and the
hardwood tenon is far superior to the soft biscuit.
It is and the 5mm thick tenons are about 3/4" wide so the you don't have
to worry about the biscuit slot being too wide for the end of a rail.
So naturally I
drooled at the prospect of a domino, but at this point I also have
enough to learn and develop the proper skills that will keep be busy
for a while, and when the time comes then necessity will motivate the
move to domino's, or a suitable clone.
Understood.
On my cabinet/island I am putting in a 4 drawer bank, using your
idea's for the front end of the drawers and at the back end using a
vertical riser with notch's cut out to put the back end of the rail
that the drawer slide is mounted too. In design it looks fine. Using a
dado joint there could be useful as a "floating joint" to reduce any
stress.
Believe me I do not take your words lightly, regarding the Domino. I
appreciate your insight into all aspects of ww'ing.
A few of us have been down this road many times. ;~)
Yes, but then there are finishers, and the real finishers. Which takes
the product to a whole nut her level.