On 2/7/2016 3:11 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, February 6, 2016 at 6:05:39 AM UTC-6, Leon wrote:

Robert you might want to take a look and test drive this sander.
Oddly it is in the price range of the "for Roberts hands only"
Bosch sander. Although only considered a finish sander it is silky
smooth. I played with one at a WW show a few years ago. I was
shocked at how I could literally run and guide that sander with a
single finger resting on top of the sander.

http://www.festoolusa.com/power-tool...-sander-571817


Well, I have to say I have never seen that sander. We don't get wood
working shows here for some reason, they never have manufacturer
demos at our local equipment distributors, and I haven't been in a
Woodcraft in years. So... never seen it. My first impression was,
no... I don't want a Speedbloc type sander, but then I watched the
video and that isn't it at all. It looks pretty well though out for
the grip.

Well you should go to to Woodcraft to try it out If you put it on the
short list. I don't own it but again I was really surprised that I
could guide it with a finger on the top and it did not bounce around
like many ROS sanders if you don't have a good hold. And it is likely to
last a very long time.



I read a ton of reviews, some professional and some not, some on FOG.
They all say the same thing, this is a finish sander, and does great
finish work. In fact the only complaints I read about was that it
didn't do more than finishing.

That would be my bone of contention. The Rotex will just about keep up
with a belt sander in aggressive mode but two hands are required in
either mode. My Rotex replaced an old right angle PC ROS which was also
aggressive. BUT I do have the small rectangular Festool finish sander
and it can get into corners, something that round disk sanders do not
do. Otherwise I would strongly consider it if any of my Festool sanders
actually wear out. I did wear a PC Speedbloc out. ;~)


Users recommend to buy the next
sander up for an overall utility sander. That's not a deal breaker
for me as I have a stable of sanders for hard work, including one old
Ridgid I have used to sand concrete more than once with a 40gr pad.
With quality paper, my other sanders work fine, although they are
noisy as hell and the dust collection isn't as good compared to the
newer stuff.

I don't recall any of the Festool sanders being noisy.


The $200 isn't scary at all, another surprise. I paid that for my
Milwaukee half sheet sander 20 years ago!

Thanks for the heads up.

sure!

Have you used the Mirka gold paper?

Not on a sander. Before Festool I use a lot of 3M which I did not have
to pay for. I acquired it in 250 disk rolls. That was when I worked
for a 3M distributor. We looked into taking on Mirka way back when as
many of the GM dealerships that we sold to used that brand in the body
shops.
I do use Mirka Goldflex Soft 4.5" x 5.5" tear off pads. These come on a
roll and tear off. They are foam backed and great for easing edges and
uneven surfaces but are strictly for hand sanding. They last pretty
well and the foam backing gives them just enough stiffness to easily use
them with out a block of wood, sand with just your hands on the paper.
Several months ago 3M came out with a rubber backed paper that was
supposed to last a long time. I tried a couple of sheets and was
unimpressed. I have been using the foam back Mirka for hand sanding for
about 4 years now.



This is the stuff I usually get,
and when I do I get this package most of the time since I am really
on board (as are just about all serious finishers) of working through
the grits with no skipping.

http://goo.gl/uw2nEY

I have strictly used Festool paper since switching to the Festool
sanders. It is expensive but it lasts a long time. I started with the
Rubin "red" paper which is interned for bare wood. And used up until I
discovered the Granat which is also good for removing paint and
finishes. The Granat is very expensive by comparison. BUT the 5" disks
I bought in a 10 pack for $13.00. That was many months ago, last Spring
maybe and I think there are 6 discs left. And no kidding I have been on
a single disk on 3 different pieces of furniture that I have built
including removing a finish on all three. Expensive until you realize
that the paper lasts 4~5 times longer because it does not load up.

On another note, if you remember a customer's Mexico imported small
table in my office, the one we were talking about at Christmas and what
may have been used used as a finish and you mentioned "tar", I thought
used diesel motor oil.
I absolutely think tar was part of the finish. This was not new
furniture but it did load up the Granat paper when I sanded the legs.
No other modern finish has loaded that paper up at all after it has dried.


The only thing I don't like about the Mirka gold is that they are
stearate coated. This has on occasion fouled finishes, especially
when dying wood. Cheaper stearates can foul anything when they get
hot. Looking around at the Festool discs they say they are "coated"
but it doesn't say with what. Have you ever used the regular Festool
discs? They aren't cheap, but they really aren't that expensive when
you put them in as a "disc per project" cost.

Yes, I use/used the Ruben Festool paper. Good paper but it does
eventually wear out. LOL. If I am sanding flat surfaces I have to stop
the sander and feel how sharp the paper is to determine when to change
it. With the dust extraction the paper does not change color and there
is no dust to judge if it is still cutting or not. You literally have
to feel the paper with your fingers to determine if it has been worn out
or not. AND it does have a relatively stiff backing, stiffer than 3M gold.



Not talking about the
Granat stuff... it's expensive!

LOL, but that stuff lasts a loooong time in my shop. AND this paper
seems to be a bit more flexible than the Ruben which lead me to think it
might tear more easily. That has not been the case yet.
It does seem to be more touchy about sanding with the grain with both my
ROS and finish sander. That is the reason that I have had to sand down
and reapply the stain finish in places on the last 3 projects. I had
scratches show up at the joints. Resanding and paying attention to
grain direction instantly solved the issue. I had to be careful with
the Rubin but it did not seem to be quite so touchy at the joints.

I bought a 100 pack of 180 grit Granat for the finish sander and IIRC it
was about $58. BUT I suspect that it is going to last me for a few
years, maybe 3~6. The Ruben 50 packs were lasting me 1~2 years. Of
course that all depends on how much work I am doing. But seriously the
Granat seems to last at least three times longer than the Rubin and
sanding dried glue and finishes is not an issue at all, the paper
remains clean. I seldom wipe off glue squeeze out any more.




I miss my old sandpaper connection. When I was doing a lot of
finishing and refinishing I used sandpaper like guy with a cold uses
tissues. I got his contact info from a finishing forum. I found
that he bought all the roll ends of Klingspor and Mirka he cold, then
took them back to his machinery and punched out 5" and 6" discs on
his own. He only bought upper end paper and had some odd grit sizes,
but his price was about .35 a disc or less depending on what he had
in stock and how much you bought. Apparently the cheap sandpaper from
China a India did him in as he couldn't get as cheap as his big
production shops demanded. And he had stearated and non in most
grits. He is no longer in the paper business.

Robert