On 10/6/2015 12:33 PM, Vic Smith wrote:
On Tue, 6 Oct 2015 11:49:33 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:
On Tuesday, October 6, 2015 at 12:12:39 PM UTC-4, Moe DeLoughan wrote:
On 10/6/2015 10:49 AM, Mr.Emann wrote:
On 10/6/2015 10:30 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Tuesday, October 6, 2015 at 10:58:42 AM UTC-4, Ian Jackson wrote:
In the USA, I'm amazed to the no-priority '4-way stop' crossroads. The
rule seems to be that the guy who thinks he got there first assumes he
has priority. That said, when driving over there, driving is
normally a
pleasure, and the drivers tend to be somewhat more considerate than
here
in the UK and in Continental Europe.
--
Ian
AT 4 way stops, it's not no-priority. It's as you described. If a car
gets there first, it has the priority. If they all get there about the
same time, the the driver to your right has the right of way. Same
rule
applies for boats crossing paths, if a boat is crossing your path from
the right, it has the right of way. Boat and aircraft lights are set
up consistent with that, so one craft sees green, the other red.
If they all get there at the same time, how do you determine which is
the "right" one? Everyone has a driver to the right side of them. I
suspect that the driver who has the biggest or most beat up vehicle
gets the right-of-way.
The joke here in Minnesota: What do you get when you have four drivers
at a four-way? Answer: A picnic. That's 'cause we'll spend an
eternity trying to out-polite the others:
"After you."
"No, after you."
"Oh, no, really. I'm in no hurry. You go first."
"But I'm afraid of looking rude. You first."
"Are you sure? Really, you first."
"Actually, I think that guy gets to go first."
And on and on and on and on...cheesus, I could scream. Just GO already.
Roundabouts are FAR better than four-ways. Luckily, Minnesota is
rapidly expanding their use. They make a hell of a lot more sense and
most of the time, they shorten wait times. Of course, you still have
the idiots who insist on treating them like four-ways, stopping at
every exit while they're within the roundabout.
MythBusters did a test of 4-ways vs. roundabouts. They determined that in a
15 minute period, a 4-way intersection allowed an average of 385 cars
through while a roundabout allowed 460 cars through, an increase of about 20%.
http://www.wimp.com/testroundabout/
I've never seen a four-way stop that gets heavy traffic volume.
Such an intersection would typically have a *light*. A 4-way *stop*
allows drivers to decide when to cross the intersection -- instead of
a "dumb light" (that, even if it has sensors in the road, stands a
50% chance of making you wait, needlessly)
All of them around here are in residential areas. And I'm including
my experience in the entire Chicago metro area.
A circle would take up real estate.
I hate the 4 ways in any case when there are other cars there.
Too much out-politing each other or over-caution.
Here, too often it is a stop for only one direction of traffic.
And, that direction often neglects to stop ("I don't see anyone coming
so I'll just blow through this stop sign")
There are parts of town where the property owners haven't maintained
clear sight lanes so you can't see cross traffic until you are essentially
*in* the intersection -- too late if that cross traffic has opted
not to stop.
Many times somebody sits at the intersecting street waiting for me to
come to a full stop, when I'm obviously stopping.
I've actually stopped and continued on many times before they could
figure out what's going on.
"Hesitation", IME, is a root cause of many accidents. Don't arrogantly
assume you're always right (in the right of way) but, also, don't always
assume you *aren't*... or, that the other guy won't heed his traffic
controls.
Be vigilant and assertive.