On Sun, 19 Jul 2015 09:05:10 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Sun, 19 Jul 2015 14:09:57 +0700, John B. Slocomb
wrote:

On Sat, 18 Jul 2015 11:21:07 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

snip


While statistically you may be correct, I'm not that sure about the
relationship between gun availability and crime. For example, I read
that while criminals in England rarely used firearms in, say the '50's
- the Great Train Robbers were armed with clubs - while today, even
with more stringent firearm laws in the country, armed criminals are
more common. to the extent that arming the police seems to becoming a
more popular idea.

Yeah, they're having a hell of a wave of murders with guns in the UK.
Their rate is all the way up to 0.26/100,000. The rate for the US is
40 times higher.

They're just going to hell in a handbasket...

The point, or course, was that even with stringent gun laws the number
of armed criminals in the British Isles is increasing. What was it in
England, Scotland and Wales, say 20 - 30 years ago compared to the
present?

It's meaningless. When the numbers are so vanishingly small, even a
slight perturbation in the numbers causes a disproportionate change in
the percentages.


And, of course, in Northern Ireland where possession of a firearm
likely ensured a very unpleasant visit to the police station, at a
minimum, gun crimes were sky high for a while :-)

But as I previously mentioned, they banned alcoholic beverages in the
U.S. and that automatically stopped drinking in the entire country.
Right?

There's no connection.


I see...

Banning alcohol was thought to decrease the evils of that "Demon Rum"
and banning firearms is expected to decrease the evils of those
terribly dangerous guns.

The first didn't work and in fact is often claimed to be a major
reason that the "Mafia" grew from a little neighborhood protection
racket to a major factor in crime, but the second will be just so
effective, just like banning narcotic drugs has eliminated "dope
fiends" and outlawing cocaine had eliminated the use there of.

Prostitution and gambling has been banned for years and years, so
obviously there are no hookers walking the streets and "the numbers"
were a figment of someone's imagination.

Wake up and smell the flowers Ed. Banning something doesn't stop the
use of that thing. It just increases the cost.

Or did you think that all the evil doers running about and shooting
each other are using legally purchased guns and that all, each and
every one of them, has a State issued concealed carry permit?





Third, the reaction has been to switch the focus, and the sales of
guns, from long guns to handguns, and the most popular long guns right
now are fairly useless military-style rifles that shoot pipsqueek,
military-derived cartridges. They're focused on killing people as much
as a .40 cal. pistol is.

(grin) But I used to shoot paper targets with a .45 cal. pistol :-)

So do I. Now, the fantasy "tactical" guns, and "defense" type guns,
dominate sales. They didn't then.

Well, they had pocket pistols :-)

But I remember the first time I saw the specifications for one of the
modern pistols. My immediate thought was, "gee, it can't be very
accurate". A plastic pistol with a 4 inch barrel?



So the whole interest, culture, focus, and categories of gun sales has
devolved from hunting and target shooting to people-killing fantasies,
defensive paranoia, and fear. It's pretty ugly..
--
cheers,

John B.