On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 12:38:17 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 20:58:57 +0700, John B. wrote:

On Fri, 06 Sep 2013 07:13:25 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

John B. fired this volley in
:

I think that you are talking about the dimensions of the part of the
bullet that sticks out of the case,
which, other then overall length, isn't much of consideration, at
least for a .25 Browning.

No, John. What he wants to know is the overall length of the projectile
itself (showing that portion that's seated in the cartridge), so that he
can draw a bullet SEPARATELY from the cartridge, for the purposes of
showing it elsewhere in the firing path, besides just in the wheel, just
in a loaded cartridge.

Lloyd

That is going to be difficult to find as while the diameter is constant
the length of the bullet will depend on the weight and possible the type
point, although for a .25 auto it is likely that there are few different
bullets available.

So, the first question would be, what make of ammo and what bullet
weight as I find reference to several weights. 35, 45 and 50 gr. all of
which would be different length.

He might have a look at the SAMMI (sporting arms and ammunition
manufacturers institute) http://www.saami.org/ who publish a lot data
about commercially loaded ammunition. I downloaded a document from SAMMI
(205.pdf) that shows both the standard cartridge dimensions and the
standard chamber dimensions, including the standard throating.

Case diameter us shown as 0.278 and length is listed as 0.615 - .020".
Overall cartridge length is 0.860 min/.910 max.

The standard chamber is 0.2828 in diameter, and tapers to 0.2798 at the
front and is 0.0.638" in length. The cartridge appears to headspace on a
semi-rim.

I'm still a bit vague about the need for bullet length as it is never
really used in fitting a barrel or action. The action needs to be able
to handle the maximum cartridge length, the ejection port the maximum
case length, and the bullet is long gone down the barrel.

I've only seen Bullet length taken into consideration when deciding on
the rifling twist which in turn effects bullet rotation and ultimately
bullet stability.

It seems like it'd have a strong impact on the gun operation if it sticks
out the front of the cylinder, though.

Presumably you want to decide on what ammo you do and do not want to
support, and either accept a long cylinder, or accept that there's some
ammo that's just too long to fit.

(Is it common to have ammunition that does not fit some particular make
and model of revolver? I.e., is there some popular revolver out there
that comes with the statement "well, those bullets won't work in that
gun: everyone knows that!")

Common? No..does it happen? Yes indeed. It largely depends on the
velocity the powder charge develops in conjunction with the rate of
twist in many cases.

It may blow up the bullet shortly after leaving the barrel if too
fast..and if too slow..may tumble like a thrown dog turd off the aimed
path.

As far as one brand of ammo not fitting in place of
another..yes...that too happens. American chambering practices are
occasionally at odds with foreign practices..along with quality
control. This most often shows up in surplus military ammo made for
turd world nations. IE...9mm Parabellum ammo wont load into a normal
commercial chamber in the West...because it was wide tolerance cheap
**** made to be shot out of guns that are badly worn, poorly made or
simply out of spec.

Then we have the practice of some nations for loading some ammunition
for special purposes at much higher pressures than are proper for
normal ammo. Again ...9mm submachine gun ammo is a well known culprit
of blowing up lightly made pistols or beating them to death in a short
period of time. The ammo was made HOT for use in subguns...and never
intended for use in sporting or even military pistols.

The first time I ran into this was with my very first P-38 semiauto.
An Aluminum framed French made Walther which I purchased along with a
couple hundred rounds of surplus 9mm....which I determined to have
been sub gun ammo after the first shot not only locked the slide
back..but sheared off bits and important pieces of the guts. It was
fixable for $50..but it ****ed me off. I tried it in another stronger
9mm..and it was noticably HOT!...and after tracking the headstamp
down..determined it was to be used in Spanish Destroyer
Carbines...which were not..not normally 9mm Para. Factory chamber..no
adapter.

Gunner



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