On Apr 26, 3:01*pm, Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Fri, 26 Apr 2013 04:52:13 -0700 (PDT), "





wrote:
On Apr 26, 3:36*am, Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Wed, 24 Apr 2013 19:43:13 -0500, "Attila Iskander"

wrote:
"Tyler Durden" wrote in ...
Look what a fellow american has written about your country.

Does he "hate" america?

Will you label him as a "hater", or more absurdly - will you say he is
somehow jealous (of what I can't possibly imagine) because he makes
these critical comments and observations?

Will it be somehow different if you hear this from a fellow citizen? *Or
will you stick your head in the sand like you always do when you hear it
from me?

The most common thing among the great majority of the cities mentionnned is
that all have been long-standing Democrat Strongholds, which have encouraged
grasshoppers to come and latch on to the government tit.

And on a country wide level, the US has allowed cheap labor to compete
with US labor thru the elimination of tariffs on imports. *That drives
an ineffective consumer throwaway economy and drives wages down to
third world levels. *With wages at third world levels the US will
inevitably become a third world nation.

Except of course that US wages are nowhere near "third world level".
And that you can't just look at one side of the equation. *There is a
huge
benefit to consumers being able to buy goods that are less expensive.
If you reduced foreign competition and raised prices and someone has
to work 8 hours a week more to buy the same basket of goods, are
they better off or worse off?

Average wages? *No, of course they aren't.... yet.

Not just average wages. Any US wages are not at third world
country levels. Good grief!


*That was my point,
the net effect in the long term will be to make the US like the third
world nations our labor must compete with.

The net effect of what? Foreign competition? We have always
had foreign competition. It's nothing new. It is getting more
intense,
but that's because countries like China have become more developed
and capable of supplying a lot more of products that we all use.

We don't have to, nor should we compete directly with third world
countries. Third world countries aren't the problem. China, for
example, isn't generally considered to be a third world country.
Haiti, Kenya, Columbia, those are third world countries. And if
low wages were the determining factor in economic success, then
places like Haiti and Kenya should be economic power houses.


*Few things happen
overnight. * We have already seen how many engineering firms send out
their design work to low cost countries. *What does that do to the
jobs in the US for engineers? *It lowers the wage point.

Oh please... High tech, high paying jobs are not a problem.
Starting salaries for even entry level engineers are excellent. There
are more engineering jobs here then ever before. Sure, some
companies are going to outsource some work for a variety of
reasons. But that comes with a free economy. And any solution,
ie govt intervention to *try* to stop it is going to just make it
worse, create even more problems, more govt involvement
in business, more rules, more govt BS.



Which is better, being able to buy 3 microwaves, 2 of which you really
don't need,

who says who "needs" what? Foreign goods have helped keep
costs down on a huge amount of products, for a lot of people. Foreign
competition prevents companies from offering sub-standard,
crap products. Or do you think it would be better for example
to have Detroit still selling the crap cars of the 70s and 80s
when Japan kicked their asses? The USA is still the largest
manufacturer in the world. A lot of the manufacturing jobs have
been lost to robots and similar advances as productivity has
increased. You can't go back to 1950.


because they are cheap due to being imported, or only
being able to buy one but making enough money to actually pay for the
HOUSE that can't be imported?



There are one hell of a lot of people living in expensive houses
all over. A lot better houses than we had 20, 30, 40 years ago.










*Compounding that, the US
continues to allow millions of poor uneducated illegal's to flood the
country, also driving down wages with the same endpoint of turning the
US into a third world nation. *Anyone pointing this out is called a
racist, as if its the reporters fault that most of the immigrants
happen to be Mexican because Mexico is on our southern border. *No
other country in the world allows this.- Hide quoted text -

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The problem is that for the most part the jobs that those Mexicans
take for $8 an hour, very few Americans today would
want at even $16 hour. *A friend of mine manages construction
of golf courses. *He can't find US workers that want to be
general laborers. *He was building one in Westchester county
and even tried to recruit in areas of NYC with high unemployment
and no one was interested. * And the few you do find don't have the
work ethic like workers from Costa Rica or Mexico.

Of course they are not interested, they would have to give up their
welfare money. *People do what's in their best interest.
Unfortunately, what's in the best interest of politicians is rarely
what's in the best interest of the citizens they no longer represent.


So, you acknowledge that you couldn't fill the jobs Mexicans are
taking even if you pay $16 an hour, but you're still bitching about
foreign
competition taking these jobs away from Americans?





I agree that the loss of good, higher paying manufacturing jobs is
a real problem. *But it's not a simple problem. *The world has evolved
and countries that were once not even competitors are now competitive
and it's not being done solely on the labor cost differential.
You saw that happen first with Japan and Taiwan, then South Korea.
Today it's greatly expanded to China, India, etc. *And while it's a
problem, the US remains the worlds largest manufacturer. * A lot
of those lost jobs here are not due to foreign competition, but to
advances
in manufacturing technology where we can produce more with less
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