In article
,
DerbyDad03 wrote:

On Dec 4, 9:11*am, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In article ,
*Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:





On 12/3/2012 10:46 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
"Existential Angst" wrote in message
...
"DerbyDad03" wrote in message
..
.
This guy purposely caused kickback on his table saw to prove a point.

Make sure you watch what happens at 4:20 into the video.

He agrees with anyone who calls him an idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7sRrC2Jpp4

Excellent vid, valuable lesson.
He's not an idiot, he just didn't have the control over the situation
as
he expected. ***** happens, even with good intentions.

He proly would not have lost a digit or part thereof (as in a RAS),
but he
certainly came close to requiring a lot of stitches, and poss. nerve
damage -- which can be almost as bad as losing a digit.

How does a riving knife work? *Never saw one before this.

Apropos of this, the SawStop:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiYoB...endscreen&NR=1

He claims sumpn like 3600 accidents a year, all severed digits? *I
doubt it.
Table saws, iiuc, don't nec'ly sever digits -- RAS's do. *So I'm sure
plenty
of people get deep cuts on table saws, but not nec'ly severings.
He may have also been lumping RAS accidents with table saw accidents --
assholes aren't nec'ly careful with stats.

But, this demo was ess'ly bogus. *If the saw stop didn't work, he would
have
gotten a bit of a nick (MAYBE), before his nervous system kicked in --
ESP
the way his finger was glued to the table..... *sheeit, I'da done that
WITHOUT a saw stop.... gimme a fukn break with that bull****.....

Now, let him put his system on a RAS, and test DAT with his finger,
cutting
in climb.... *yeah, I'll hold effing breath....

Finally, the fuknCOST of this system.... *holy ****.... * God help the
home
woodworker if this thing ever becomes mandatory. *Which could happen,
given
that they now make crawling helmets for toddlers:
http://www.amazon.com/Thudguard-Baby.../dp/B001OWCOTS
Even insufferable Manhattan Yupsters have a tough time swallowing this
one.
Trader4 and Terrel would proly buy a crawling helmet, tho....

I'd love to see the system! *I wonder if it could be adapted to shapers,
routers and other cutting machines. *It would help a lot with OSHA
problems where guards make production next to impossible.

The problem with SawStop has been that each false alarm requires
replacing various mechanical components, which takes time and money. *It
doesn't make too many false alarms to make guards more economical.

My recollection is that the sensor measures resistance (not capacitance)
between saw blade and ground, so it won't work with wet wood or metal
stock. *The patents should tell the tale.

Joe Gwinn- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Do you have any figures that indicate that "false alarms" are an
issue?

Not recently, but but there were a number of complaints when SawStop
first came out. SawStop dropped out of the news, but that tells us
nothing on the issue of false alarms and it the problem was solved - the
media had moved on to other issues by then. In other words, absence of
evidence is not evidence of absence.

More generally, false alarms are and always have been a problem with
simple sensors in complex environments.


I agree that "each false alarm requires replacing various mechanical
components" but if there aren't any false alarms, then it's a moot
point.

My only point being that using the words "each false alarm" might make
the reader think that they happen often enough to negate the value of
the device. That is not something I have read or heard about the Saw
Stop device, but the info might be out there somewhere.

The intention was to raise the issue, as it is often forgotten, and yet
has a major bearing on use in a commercial workshop - the big cost is
usually the lost production while repairs are being made, not the cost
of the new parts.

So, the question was if guards were or were not a better alternative
than SawStop.

Joe Gwinn