On Jun 7, 9:25*pm, "Arfa Daily" wrote:
"hr(bob) " wrote in message

...









On Jun 7, 3:36 pm, spamtrap1888 wrote:
On Jun 7, 1:10 pm, mike wrote:

We also have a time-of-use option. *You get to pay an additional fee
for the option to pay MORE for peak use and less for off-peak.
I don't have the glossy brochure handy, but last time I did the math,
my break-even point was switching 80% of my use to 4AM.

The time of use option solution is obvious. *Switch EVERYBODY to time
of
use.
Keep the peak rate the same and lower the off-peak rate.
You can raise ALL the rates later, when nobody's looking.
EVERYBODY has the incentive to smooth out the load peaks and valleys..
EVERYBODY wins...well, there'd be less in the bonus bucket.
And all those people marching down main street in opposition to that
wind farm
or transmission line could bring along their electric bill to
demonstrate that they're washing their clothes at 4AM
and cutting their total use below norm to eliminate
the need for that new energy source.

Reminds me of some 40 years ago, after the first Arab oil shock (the
Sheik Shock? When OPEC first flexed its muscles.)

All consumers/producers of energy were trying to be more efficient.
Electric companies were looking at a thing called "pumped storage."

During the wee hours, water would be pumped uphill. During the hot
afternoons, water would be let go downhill, spinning hydroelectric
turbines as it went.

Sounded like a treadmill to oblivion, but it effectively shifted
excess capacity from the middle of the night to when it was needed.- Hide
quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

That's still in use in some parts of Colorado.

OK. Some really interesting answers there. We use some pumped here in the
UK. Take a look at

http://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/

and see the small dial at the top right area. *Not so many years back, it
used to be really simple here. The power was generated and distributed by
the Central Electricity Generating Board, and sold to you by your local area
electricity board. Mine, for instance was the EMEB which was East Midlands
Electricity Board. They were responsible for billing, meter reading, house
level maintenance, installations and local distribution over quite a large
geographical area. Similar boards handled all the other areas of the
country. The whole shebang was state owned, and the price of electricity was
fixed at a single (domestic) rate for everyone everywhere. Gas was handled
similarly by a central state-owned production and distribution company, and
sold to you by your local gas board. Both the gas and electricity boards had
shops in most major towns, that sold appliances. Same production and
distribution scheme for water and sewage. It all worked really well. You
knew where you were, and payed no more or less for your supplies than anyone
else, either next door or at the other end of the country. About the only
'complication' to this happy state of affairs was when they introduced the
'Economy 7' tariff, where the meter got changed to a one with a dual set of
dials, and a time clock (electrically wound clockwork) attached to switch
the metering over for a period of seven hours during the night. It was
originally conceived, I believe, to allow cheap heating via storage
radiators, which would hopefully mop up surplus production from the nuclear
plants, if enough people could be persuaded to use them.

Then, the government privatised all the utilities (and the railways), and
that's when it all went tits up. Every Johnny come lately and his brother
set up an electricity or gas or both billing company, and the producers
became 'energy wholesalers'. Now, there are literally dozens of companies
all in 'competition' - ha! - with one another to supply your utility
services. The government insists that this is a good thing, as it gives you
choice to find the supplier and tariff set that's best for you. In reality,
it's a bloody nightmare of attempting to compare different companies' rates
and schemes and bonuses and incentives and single fuel versus dual fuel
schemes and whether you are better to have two suppliers or one and so on.. I
actually don't know anyone who comes close to understanding it, liking it,
or being able to work out what is actually best for them. There are
literally hundreds - thousands possibly - of combinations. Even the way you
are billed or the way you pay, can affect it.

For instance, go take a look at

http://www.ukpower.co.uk/home_energy...-East%20Midlan...

and then open up some of the drop down boxes, and you'll see what I mean.
Overall, it seems to me that the last person who has actually gained from
this, is me, Joe Consumer. It looks like things are a lot simpler in the
U.S. *Actually, quite similar to how it was here. Your rates look pretty
similar, although a bit pricy at the top end. The average cost of a unit
here now, is around 12.5 pence, which is about 18 cents U.S.

Arfa

Here in New Hampshire we now have a "choice" who we get our power
from. However you would be hard pressed to find any significant
savings from any of them. The power company offers residential rate
and Business rate. These are set by the PUC, (Public Utilities
Commission) who as far as I can tell is in the pockets of all the
utilities. It's fairly obvious that the business rate is just a
license to screw you even harder. (This goes for telephone service as
well. But don't get me started on that). And in addition if the power
company feels that your residence is operating on a business level you
are surcharged for that too.

For example if you own a factory you have the business rate. And you
start up a large motor that has a large starting current, you are
assessed a "demand" charge. This is a surcharge on top of your normal
rate for, (and this is how it was explained to me) for the power
company's "ability" to meet your immediate "demand". What a load o
bull****!

I have a friend who owns a horse farm. This is a hobby and definitely
his residence. His barn is far removed from the house and so there is
a very large pump that brings water to the barn. When this water pump
comes on there is a momentary large starting current. Somehow they
have seen fit, (and have gotten away with it) to levy the demand
charge on him, a residential customer too.

Several years ago they built Seabrook Station, New Hampshire's first
nuclear power plant. We were assured of cheap efficient electricity
for years to come. Well guess what? The rates have steadily gone up
since it went on line, with no end in sight. And with all the itemized
charges for this and that on your bill now it's virtually impossible
to make any sense out of it anymore. So like another tax that can't be
avoided, we just pay it.

So now they're talking about running a transmission line down from
Canada. There is apparently cheap hydro up there, (Niagra Falls), and
once again they say we can really save some money with the completion
of this project. I have no doubts that the only ones who will benefit
from this fiasco will be the investor. The rate payers will continue
to be "raped".

I guess that the alternative is to just go right back to friggin 1840
and live like an Amish farmer. As ****ed off as I am though I'm not
ready to take it to that extreme, yet. Lenny