On 2008-03-23 01:38:11 +0000, "The Medway Handyman"
said:

I've often said that Makita stuff seems to punch above its weight. I've got
a 860w Makita router that performs better than a 1200w 'shed' own brand, a
950w circular saw that eats 38mm worktop & a 14.4v combi that I reckon would
see off a lot of 18v tools.

I wonder if this is down to the way they quote the figures.

The conventional wisdom is that the input power is quoted. That's
fine as far as it goes but what actually matters is the output
(mechanical) power at the business end. The motors in good
quality branded tools are more efficient in those of the generic
Chinese private label junk.

So if you look at it in terms of what you're getting out vs. the quoted
figure, then Makita will appear to "punch above its weight". You
will find the same from (e.g.) Bosch, DeWalt, Freud and Festool
routers. I would argue that these tools are punching *at* their
weight and that the generic junk punches at way below its apparent
weight.
We've had threads here before about products such as PPPro, which
although quoted at 2000 or 2200W are delivering a mechanical output
equivalent to about 1400W from a proper tool.

The reasons for this are cost, use and marketing. For the low end of
the market, the characteristics required are for low usage rate and in
short bursts. They can get away with a low efficiency motor that turns
the spare electrical energy into heat. They are gambling on the usage
pattern being low enough that the motor won't fail within the
(apparently generous) 3 year warranty.

This is also convenient from the marketing perspective. it looks far
more attractive to the uninitiated to be offered a router with 2200W
"power" as compared with the 1800W of the branded competition. Add in
a worthless laser guide, chunky handles for "real men" and a 3yr
warranty and they can be sold by the container load with an acceptable
percentage being returned to go in the skip.

The same has happened with cordless tools. The branded manufacturers
have gone for good mechanics, decent motor and especially decent
batteries. Makita have executed particularly well on that strategy
which has allowed them to have a comprehensively good stable of
cordless drill drivers for a number of years. Panasonic did a very
good job with battery technology a couple of years back and bravely
produced a 15.6v drill when everybody else was adding 18v products.
To the extent that they could market it, it was an interesting
differentiator. In product tests, it was not very far short of what
the 18v tools were doing mechanically, but the amount of work per
charge was way better.

At the other end of the market, the marketeers simply moved upwards in
the voltage stakes to 18v 24v, 32v, simply adding in extra cheap cells.
I can remember Screwfix advertising a 32v drill for £32 - £1 per
volt was the banner. No doubt they sold a few to the terminally stupid.

Therefore of course a Makita 14.4v product will outperform a generic
18v product.


It's for these reasons, and lack of proper backup, that I won't buy
Chinese generic tools. It simply isn't worth it.

By the time one compares the branded product of power/voltage N with
the generic of N + 50 to100% and looks at usability, precision and
service, the decision falls very obviously with the quality branded
product.




When I were in the pressure washer game there were a trade body what laid
down standards for measurement of pressure, flow rate & temperature.

At one stage I worked for a Danish manufacturer (Gerni) who quoted exact
performance figures for each machine. The standard laid down rules for
where in the pressure could be measured, how it should be measured & the
tolerance allowed. Pressure was +/- 10% and in their brochures Karcher
always used actual test pressure + 10%, whereas Gerni used actual test
pressure - which made the Gerni machines seem less powerful.

Temperature was a bit flexible in how you measured it. Gerni quoted max
temp as 135c because that was what you got at the nozzle, Karcher and all
the others quoted 150c because that was what you could measure at the
machine. The 10 metre pressure hose lost you 15c before the water got to
the nozzle, so the machines produced the same heat.

Did it actually make a difference in operation? The principle is the
same as above although not perhaps quite so stark. Why didn't Gerni
alter their specifications and test procedures to the same as those of
Kaercher or perhaps quote two sets of figures (pointing out which one
the competition uses)? This would have analogous to quoting input
and output power for a drill.

I think from what you've said before, Gerni wanted to sell a quality
product honestly to a discerning market and the market shrank.



DIY pressure washers aren't covered by the trade body & the claims are
outrageous. 'Maximum' pressure 120 bar often means 85 bar working and if it
reaches 120 bar the pump head splits!

Same thing. Nobody in the target market can measure it and the
measurement means are not described.

I haven't looked at the required set of standards for a CE declaration
on pressure washers. Undoubtedly it includes electrical safety and
electromagnetc compatibility, but probably not a lot more.



So, I wonder if a Makita 860w is another's 1200w depending on how you
measure it? Perhaps Makita quote the correct figures & others quote
'maximum' figures?


You could look at it that way.



Is there a standard measure?

Only of people's stupidity in putting purchase price and headline spec.
numbers in front of what *actually* matters.