Frank Boettcher wrote:
....

You seem to think this is consumer driven. My point is that
consumers, particularly those that might follow a forum like this,
many high end hobbiests or professional woodworkers, are not storming
the board rooms screaming that they want to save five or ten percent
on products that will make the corporation much more than that and
that they are willing to take poor quality for that savings.

I don't "think" it is consumer driven, I observe that it is...

The election is made by the choice at where the dollars are being spent.
The surest way to get the box stores to go away is for the crowds that
frequent them to go someplace else. Until they do, they won't.

It is the corporations that drive the reduction in quality, put it out
there for you to buy, and make finding a high quality alternative
difficult by, in collaboration with the large retailers, snapping up
all the shelf space. At least that is my opinion.

The "Corporate Greed" comes to bear when they are already profitable,
have a loyal customer base that depends on the quality of the product
that they supply, but feel they can squeese out a little more by
taking it to a quality risky offshore source. They are not doing this
to "survive".

Oh, but au contraire... Were it but true. In general, the "loyal
customer base" is loyal until the next bid cycle goes out and a
competitor comes in with a price a nickel lower. The few (if any) who
really would be loyal simply are not enough except in very rare
instances to even maintain a business what more grow it.

It is definitely true in all consumer/retail goods (which is what I'd
estimate at least 70-80+% of the participants here are familiar with) as
opposed to "true" industrial supply.

But, even in that environment, an example -- Have a very good friend who
is an engineer whose expertise is in management of casting foundries.
Have known him for almost 40 years now. In that time he has gone from
the small, family-owned independent single-supplier/customer mills
(brake castings, etc., for Ford, GM, Chrysler, etc.), to the
Japanese-owned multi-facilities under consolidated ownership as the
industry has changed. One of his former facilities makes high-precision
castings for the electrical transmission field amongst other things.
For almost 75 years, this particular company/mill had about 75% of the
US market. Over the last 10 years this has dropped to less than 50%
owing to--you guessed it! Chinese imports taking business from their
"loyal" customers. Quality is as good as theirs, price is competitive,
but the differential is something they can't match and produce in the
US. So much for "loyalty".

Their niche now is in fast turnaround but large bulk routine product is
now coming from suppliers to them from overseas. Needless to say, this
isn't a choice they have made on their own. Their revenues are roughly
equivalent but margins are _way_ down. Revenues are helped
significantly in the present market climate by the huge expansion in
generation capabilities in China and India and the ensuing
infrastructure expansion. When that slows as it eventually will, it's
anybody's guess as to what their future holds. At present it certainly
doesn't look rosy for the long term unless/until they find new
markets/products.

It IS a global economy for good or ill and wishing it weren't isn't
going to make it so. In the long run it will probably work out for the
better. In the short run, there's going to be yet more upheaval and
restructuring.

But, unless there is a _MAJOR_ shift in the US publics' buying habits,
the days of the box stores and all seem ahead of them...

IMO, ymmv, $0.02, etc., etc., etc., ...

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