On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 10:42:08 -0700, charlieb
wrote:

Maybe its what's between you, the tool that does the cutting,
and the wood - as well as the precision required. Trying to
cut a curve with a cutter in an XY cutter table is tough
- Etch-A-Sketch type thing. Maybe it's having the tactile feed
back that a hand held cutting tool provides.

Then there's CNC machines - no tactile feed back but curves
are no problem - not much fun either.

But back to routering in flutes, spirals and the like. Are you
actually turning with a Legacy machine - or machining?

Some would argue that when you're machining something on a metal
lathe, you're turning.

Seriously, though- there is one thing here that you're missing, which
I have lately been reminded of when spending a lot of time on the knee
mill making my little metal lathe. While you're correct that there is
no tactile feedback from a CNC machine, the argument simply doesn't
hold up when you're talking about a manual metalworking machine.
Rather than holding a handle, you are turning cranks, but the
vibration is transmitted through the handles, the feed has greater or
lesser resistance, cuts can climb and jerk the table around if you
feed in the wrong direction, etc.

It's also interesting to note that you can turn steel with a handheld
graver much the same as you can turn a wooden blank with a gouge.
The differences are in how the tool is made and ground, and in the
fact that metal peels while wood shears.

Now, there's also nothing wrong with routing spirals and grooves.
There seems to be a big hangup about machining (and I confess that
I've occasionally trapped myself into defending the "everything
freehand" position) that probably should not be there. The biggest
difference that I can tell, and the one that always seems to get my
goat is that wood simply cannot be held to the same tolerances as
metal or plastic. A guy can mill or turn something perfectly to begin
with, but there is always swelling and contraction with changes in
humidity and temperature, and if you're having a bad day, cracking and
distortion to boot. When you run any machine, you're machining. I
don't cut freehand on my table saw- I use the fence, miter gauge or a
jig.

If you're concerned about the routed spirals lacking something because
you used a jig to keep them even, there is always room to embellish
them after roughing them in- and that can be done by hand. We don't
have the same workholding, material feed systems and degree of
precision in woodworking as there is in a metalworking shop because it
simply is not needed- wood is soft compared to a hunk of steel, and
it's not nearly as likely to catch on a drill bit or mill and tear out
of your hands. They're just geared towards different materials.

And beyond that, there is the question of commerical woodworking- if
you've ever been in a modern cabinet shop or furniture manufactuer,
you'll see the same types of machines you'd expect to find in a metal
shop. CNC isn't limited to metal- it's just simply beyond the
financial reach of most people who don't require it to make a living.

There's a similar issue with dovetails. Handcut and you have
an infinite range of possibilities. With a router and jig you
have a limited number of possibilities. And when you handcut
them you can make the pins smaller than any affordable
machine/jig combo can make.

Maybe it's a practicality thing. Use whatever you've got to
get close to where you want to be - then do the part that
requires the finesse turning that's best done by hand.

Bingo! I've been making a lot of custom carved pistol grips lately,
and the fine tuning is done with hand tools- but to rough them into
shape, I favor a pnuematic die-grinder with a 40 or 60 grit sanding
disk. It's not a matter of skill with the chisels- it's a matter of
doing the job efficiently enough to actually turn a profit on the
things. Rather than spending time searching for the carving gouge
with just the right profile to pare away the inside of a concave
curved surface, I can use one tool that stays in my hand, does not
require sharpening, and will leave a surface that makes sanding and
hand-tuning that much easier.

As for Bin Pho - he's one of those guys that uses turning
as a part of the art he creates - one medium as a part of
a greater whole. His stuff "speaks" to me and I like what
I hear. Others may have completely different opinions of
course.

Turning sure has gone in a lot of different directions - most
in an interesting and good direction. Room for everyone!

charlie b