On Sun, 30 Nov 2003 10:23:56 -0800, "Gary Bosin"
wrote:



" its pretty clear to me.

Gunner
"25 States allow anyone to buy a gun, strap it on,
and walk down the street with no permit of any kind:
some say it's crazy. However, 4 out of 5 US murders
are committed in the other half of the country: so who is crazy?" --
Andrew Ford


Maybe only 1/5 of the population live in the 25 states not requiring
permits?

Which invalidated the quote how?
G
That by the way..is called using AntiGun or Liberal tactics.

But seriously......


.....open carry is far different than CCW. California, in theory, does
have open carry. You cant be arrested for it. They will however arrest
you for creating a disturbance, brandishing, high mopery in a low
mopery zone, etc. Once you get out of a city, open carry is quite
legal, except on some parklands.

There is only one state that has no restrictions for carrying openly
or concealed without state papers.
Vermont
Now there is a real hotbed of crime and mayhem, hey?


A good source for CCW state information is www.packing.org
As several others have indicated..the cites and states with the most
restrictive gun laws are indeed the ones on whole with the highest
murder and gun crime rates.

There are only 7 states in the US that do not issue CCW permits
(carrying a concealed weapon). Of those 43 states, I believe the
number of Shall Issue states are now up to 38 or so. Even in those 7
states, some form of open carry is legal.


Shall Issue, means that if you go to apply for a permit to carry a
concealed weapon, and you are not a felon, ever been ajudicated
mentaly ill, etc etc..the powers that be HAVE to give you that permit.
Its not dependant on how much you kicked into the local campaign
coffers, how anti gun the local government is, etc etc. They HAVE to
issue, or show damned good cause as to why they refused. And each have
set up an appeals process for refusals.

California is a May issue state. A number of counties are virtually
Shall issue, while others, such as L.A county will not issue period,
or only if you are a significant campaign contributor to the Sheriffs
etc election fund.

Then you have Vermont, which has no prohibitions against carrying a
concealed weapon.

Here is a map of the current states and how they are rated on CCW

http://www.moccw.org/map.html

BTW..this map is GREATLY different from 15 yrs ago.

Here is an animated map of the changes since 1986

http://www.gun-nuttery.com/rtc.php

Ohio is currently a very interesting state to study. A large
bipartisan grassroots effort to make Ohio a Shall Issue state passed
all the hurdles and hoops, and was presented to the Governor to sign,
whom has refused to do so, repeatedly. The Ohio Supreme court was
presented with the case, and it found that CCW is not a right in the
Ohio constitution, but that carrying a weapon openly at any time, is
indeed legal. In Arizona for example, its quite legal to simply strap
on a handgun and go about your business in public, and for those who
have been there..its very common. I do it all the time when in
Arizona. I think the most number of armed citizens I saw at one time
was 9 people (several women) at the checkout line at an AM-PM, all
just hard working citizens from different walks of life. The only
comment Ive ever heard was along the lines of "how do you like the
such and such holster?".


So now in Ohio, we have a case of huge numbers of people
saying..ok..if its legal, Im gonna carry..and its driving the anti gun
extremists in Ohio, absolutly bonkers. The pro activists are staging
very large "defense walks" where they all get together, and openly
carrying, do a civil rights type demonstraton parade. Gov. Taft is
gonna have to fish or cut bait really soon, else his days in political
office are numbered.


Another interesting aspect is Reciprocity of concealed weapons
permits. Lets say a snowbird from Michigan, with a valid permit to
carry concealed, is traveling. Is his permit recognized in other
states? Some yes, some not. Here is a pretty current listing, with
more states reaching agreements monthly.

http://gunownersca.com/GOCRecip.htm

I live in California, which like Ed's Joisey..recognizes no one elses
CCW. This of course is greatly dependant on which cop inquires and
why. I see many of them simply looking the other way, if a lawful CCW
holder from another state is passing through. However..my California
CCW permit is recognized by at least 10 other states minimum. Then
there is Arizona, which issues Non Resident CCW permits, largely
because of the Retiree or snow bird population

As to the Ford quote, Ill have to check the current Crime index and
take a look. But as others have pointed out, if the 25 states with
open carry laws, only commit 1/3 the crimes..looks like a pretty good
record to me.
You anti-gun nuts would have us to believe that the mear carrying of a
weapon leads to disaster and mayhem..and it appears that the stats
prove you wrong, no matter how much you spin them.

I recall the bruha that was raised by the Antis when Florida went to
Shall issue. Blood in the streets, Wild West blablablah.

Seems that once again..they were wrong. Shrug..and that animated map
above, proves that once again, common sense is overcoming the Anti-gun
nutballs best efforts.


Gunner

"25 States allow anyone to buy a gun, strap it on,
and walk down the street with no permit of any kind:
some say it's crazy. However, 4 out of 5 US murders
are committed in the other half of the country: so who is crazy?" -- Andrew Ford