On Sun, 09 Nov 2003 16:44:49 GMT, "Peter Grey" wrote:
My question is: what models of mills should I be looking for? I'm looking
for used equipment of a size and price similar to a new RF30 ($1,000 to
$1,500 without tooling). Also, who are the trustworthy dealers out there?

There are several people who frequent this newsgroup who I'd buy from
in a heartbeat. I won't name names, but stay here a while and you'll get
to know them. Buying one on one like that is often the best way to buy.
Someone else will have to help you with commercial dealer names and
reputations in your area, I'm on the other side of the country.

IOW, if I can't find what I'm looking for locally, is there a dealer who I
can call that will give me the straight scoop on something I can buy sight
unseen. Even knowing nothing about mills, but having - I think - good
mechanical intuitiveness, buying sight unseen makes me nervous... One
poster suggested a Centec mill and it looks cool but I can't find one for
sale in the States.

Mills are heavy beasts, and in general, the heavier they are, the better
they'll work (and ironically, often the heavier they are, the cheaper they
are, because of the large relocation costs). Shipping costs can often
make or break a deal. It is often worth it to pay a bit more to buy local
just for this reason.

For used equipment particularly, it almost always pays to examine the
machine in person before you buy. There are so many things that can
be wrong with a used piece of equipment, you want to know before
paying that big freight bill. Even if the dealer is good, and will accept
a return, you're still stuck with a large freight bill (both ways).

Note too that an honest dealer can have an honestly different opinion
of the condition of a machine than you do. Things he might consider
no big deal might be heartbreakers to you. Hidden defects that he
might not have caught in a visual inspection can also rare up and
bite you in the wallet. He might have the necessary repair parts, he
might not. (Often as not, the company who made the machine is
no longer in business, or no longer supports that model.)

If possible, see the machine run, check all its features to make sure
the ones essential to your tasks work. Check for wear in critical areas
(know what the critical areas *are*). Etc. And remember, the machine
won't look nearly as large in the dealer's warehouse as it will in your
small garage. Take a tape measure, make sure you know just how big
it really is, and how much open space you need around it to run it.
(Don't slight the latter, if you can't get around the machine, you can't
run it or service it. Remember how heavy these machines are, once
you set it in place, it is *there* for the duration.)

Go he http://www.lathes.co.uk/page21.html to do your homework
before going to see a machine. This is the most comprehensive list
of machine tools on the web. Also haunt ebay. That'll at least give
you an idea of the going price for various machines. (I'm a bit
hesitant to actually *buy* a big ticket item on ebay unless the seller
is local and I can do an inspection, but it is a good place to get the
feel of the market.)

There's also a good series of web articles on buying a used lathe
which would also largely apply to buying a used mill. I can't remember
the URL off hand, but I think it is on Dave Fricken's site. Perhaps
someone else can provide a pointer.

One of the points made in those articles is that someone else's
clunker may be just the machine you need. Or conversely, what
someone else considers a machine in good shape may be a
clunker to you. Only you can determine which is which, and you
need to be educated to the qualities of the machine which apply
to the tasks to which you'll put the machine in order to make
that determination.

(In other words, some qualities of a machine are important to
a particular set of tasks. For a different sort of task, different
qualities are important. You have to determine if the machine
you're examining has the qualities you need, and any other
qualities you don't need can then be derated accordingly.)

That probably means you need to read some books on the
fundamentals of machining, ask some questions here, and
in general find out a lot more about how and why things are
done before spending a big chunk of change (don't forget
shipping) on some heavy iron.

A machining class, if it uses the type of machine you're
considering, might also be a worthwhile investment. But
with most such classes today heavily weighted toward
operating CNC machining centers, you might have some
difficulty finding the right sort of class to attend. You
might do better joining a local hobby club and partner
up with one of the more experienced members who can
give you some practical hands on with his machines.

Gary