"That's something I can't do very quickly. But it's
something I could practice as much as I like because when
I'm in the shop I'm pretty much always in front of my mill."
How about
:
Ask someone who you think has talent and works with manual
machines for a living in a job shop if they think it's
important.
Ask others in this newsgroup what their opinion is.
Consider the opinions of those you decide know what
their doing.
Ask someone by e-mail that you respect if they agree
with my opinion.
"We've been told that unless we're just drilling or reaming
we should move the knee instead of using the quill because
of rigidity issues with the quill."
When roughing with an endmill you want to do everything
possible to get as much rigidity as possible. I do not agree
that when drilling or reaming you should be concerned about
how much of the quill is exposed. IMO, the quill is much
more accurate, in Z travel compared to raising and lowering
the knee. Consider the following. :)
Ask someone who you think has talent and works with manual
machines for a living in a job shop if they think it's
important.
Ask others in this newsgroup what their opinion is.
Consider the opinions of those you decide know what
their doing.
Ask someone by e-mail that you respect if they agree
with my opinion.
:)
"Not yet. I'm not even sure if we'll be covering that.
I've seen it in a few videos I've watched, but haven't done
it myself."
IMO, also very important to be able to do quickly. If you
wish I can provide an aerospace example of why it is
important and why a manual knee mill is often used to do
this kind of work in many CNC machine shops.
"If I understand your question, there's no lead screw on it.
It's just a couple of set screws that you loosen to slide
the middle section out."
If you get a chance try and look at any commercial boring
head so you can see how it is designed so that it can move
short distances accurately. Does your school have something
like a Bridgeport or a Criterion boring head that you can
examine so that you can see how they have been designed to
accomplish this task ?
"We won't be doing CNC until after Christmas, but I'm sure
I'll have questions about it then."
Perhaps before... depends on you and how much you can or
want to absorb. :)
"Hey, cool with me. Thanks for showing so much interest!"
IMO you will find others, like I have, that will give you
"the shirt off their back" when it comes to sharing their
knowledge. After you have found others like this you may
notice, like I have, that they all fit a pattern that others
don't.
"Yeah, money's pretty tight right now with school and all,
so I'm all for making a few things."
If you don't you will either have to buy them or spend your
time hunting for the shop tools / asking to use someone
else's. I never felt I had the time to do this as I wanted
to use my time on other things. I also like knowing what my
tools can do rather than being surprised by a tool that I
don't know. All depends on what your comfortable with and
willing to accept or not accept.
"Angle blocks - well, I don't even know what they're for"
Here are just a few possible uses:
Instead of "throwing" the head on a knee mill, use an angle
block.
It's can be very hard to "throw" the head on a surface
grinder. ;)
"Height stand - They don't have us make one in school
anyway, but I'm curious about this one. How complicated is
it to make? Do you use a dial indicator with it?"
Not very complicated. It's all in the design and most
designs suck because they don't have a precise enough
adjustment to *easily* allow you to move in tenths. The
concept of how to do this is similar to controlling movement
of a boring head. The most complex thing you would need is a
piece of spring steel. Yes, you use a dial indicator with
it.
"I've already asked the instructor about making my own
parallels - not a problem."
Think about making some large ones. They can be very, very
handy.
"If you have plans for a work stop I'd like to see them."
All you need to do is look at a few in tool catalogs or see
them in person. Then just copy them or design them to how
you prefer they should be made. :)
"Most of the stuff about the horizontal mill... Well, I
could understand most of the terminology, but I couldn't
catch it all."
Ask them directly in the newsgroup or find someone you can
e-mail that you suspect / knows what they are doing and is
good at explaining their thoughts.
"From what I understand though, horizontal mills aren't all
that common anymore anyway. Am I right?"
IMO manual horizontal mills are not that popular but often
still have their place. CNC horizontals are *very* popular
for damn good reason. :)
Besides what has already been mentioned in this thread,
why ? LOL :)
"We have a few skills we have to get on them anyway. I can
see how other people wanted to jump in on that one because,
hey, when I know about something I like to talk about it
too.
"
Then do it !!!
Just a few of my observations over I think 5 or 6 years of
posting he
You might want to make sure before you do that your prepared
to take the heat and / or watch the bad vibes go down as the
fighting starts. At times the bad vibes will carry from
thread to thread and the level of hate will know no limits.
"Well... This week in class I'll be working with the rotary
table. I'll be starting with a 6" round piece of aluminum,
1" thick. On one side I have to make 6 flats around the
outside, and on the other 8 flats, with a 1/8" thickness of
the original 6" dimension between the two. On both sides
I'll have to drill equally spaces holes. Am I making sense
here?"
You doing what I would call indexing with a rotary table. I
have a lot of stuff I would like to convey to you about
rotary tables. As you start to use them, and if your still
interested, I will have more to say. :)
"Thanks again for wanting to help out."
Thanks for appreciating the effort :) Along the way I'm sure I
will learn plenty from / about you as well.
jon
"chem" wrote in message
...
jon banquer wrote:
IMO, I think it is very important to be able to check and
tram the head *very quickly* in a small machining job shop.
That's something I can't do very quickly. But it's something I could
practice as much as I like because when I'm in the shop I'm pretty much
always in front of my mill.
Also, very often on older knee mills if you move the knee up
or down, the head will not be in alignment with the table
at the new position you cranked the knee to ! If your doing
a critical part you really will want to use the spindle
travel rather than move the knee. If you must move the knee,
depending on what operation your doing, it's very often a
good idea to check if the head is still in alinement with
the table.
We've been told that unless we're just drilling or reaming we should
move the knee instead of using the quill because of rigidity issues with
the quill. I move the quill when I'm finding the edges of my workpiece,
but other than that I've only used it a couple of times.
Have they shown you how to set an angle or a compound angle
by tilting the head of a knee mill yet ?
Not yet. I'm not even sure if we'll be covering that. I've seen it in
a few videos I've watched, but haven't done it myself.
How about moving the Ram in and out ?
I've moved the ram out, and swiveled the head of the mill over to the
right to reach the end of a workpiece.
Will they be showing you how to use a rotary table ?
My next couple of projects use a rotary table (more on that below).
What is the TPI on the lead screw that moves your boring
head in and out?
If I understand your question, there's no lead screw on it. It's just a
couple of set screws that you loosen to slide the middle section out.
There's a pic of it up on my page now so you can see what I mean. You
may be talking about something that will be on the other half of it, but
I don't really know much about that yet.
I also think it's a good idea if I
keep my comments to manual machining rather than CNC
machining at this point. Of course, if you feel you have a
specific question on CNC I would be more than happy to try
an answer it.
We won't be doing CNC until after Christmas, but I'm sure I'll have
questions about it then.
Does this approach seem like a good idea to you ?
Hey, cool with me. Thanks for showing so much interest!
A lot of the things that you can make in school can save you
money and are really needed and very frequently used when
you go to work in a job shop. 1-2-3 blocks, (I have 4 pairs)
2-4-6 blocks, (I have 2 pairs) jack screws ( I have 3 of
them), angle blocks, height stand (Not the design they have
you make in school !), the V blocks you mentioned (various
sizes), vise work stops, parallels, etc. The more time you
can spend at the machine making stuff like this the better,
IMO.
Yeah, money's pretty tight right now with school and all, so I'm all for
making a few things.
Jack screws = machinist's jack? I've seen a couple of simple little
plans for them.
1-2-3 and 2-4-6 blocks - I'll have to see how much time I can get on the
grinder before I plan on making them. It shouldn't be a problem though
- the grinder doesn't seem to be getting a whole lot of use so far.
Angle blocks - well, I don't even know what they're for. Do you use
them like parallels, but for cutting on an angle? Or are they used for
layout? Or both?
Height stand - They don't have us make one in school anyway, but I'm
curious about this one. How complicated is it to make? Do you use a
dial indicator with it?
I've already asked the instructor about making my own parallels - not a
problem.
If you have plans for a work stop I'd like to see them.
When I typed what I typed about horizontal milling my
thoughts were and still are on helping you to understand
what a knee mill with a knuckle head joint is very, very
weak at as well as what it is good at. A manual horizontal
mill is much more rigid in it's design than a knee mill with
a knuckle head joint. As a result of this *alone* it can
"hog off" more material. As has been mentioned by others
horizontal milling has other advantages, which at this
point unless you want to, I don't feel is appropriate to go
into. Further, some of the many advantages of horizontal
milling have still not been mentioned, yet.
Most of the stuff about the horizontal mill... Well, I could understand
most of the terminology, but I couldn't catch it all. From what I
understand though, horizontal mills aren't all that common anymore
anyway. Am I right? We have a few skills we have to get on them
anyway. I can see how other people wanted to jump in on that one
because, hey, when I know about something I like to talk about it too.
My comments to you are and will be based on augmenting what
you doing in class right now. My comments are designed to
help you get the most out of your class and how to apply it
to what I have labeled above as the real world. IMO, this
will benefit you the most. Others, as well as yourself, may
disagree. :) LOL
Well... This week in class I'll be working with the rotary table. I'll
be starting with a 6" round piece of aluminum, 1" thick. On one side I
have to make 6 flats around the outside, and on the other 8 flats, with
a 1/8" thickness of the original 6" dimension between the two. On both
sides I'll have to drill equally spaces holes. Am I making sense here?
I never have this problem drinking a quality single malt
scotch and making sure I don't mix drinks. It is quite an
expensive way to go though if you favor a Scotch such as
Glenfiddich like I do.
Lol, I'm not picky about what I drink. Not that I drink $5/gallon wine,
but rum and coke or Keiths (beer, not sure if it's sold outside of
Canada) is fine by me. But like I said, I leave enough time between
that I forget about the hangover by the next time around.
I have a lot of other questions that I would like to ask you
about your very creative website but I will wait awhile and
see if you find what I have typed helpful.
If you've got questions about the page, go ahead. It's pretty much just
a template that I plugged my own colors and a couple of pictures into
though.
Thanks again for wanting to help out. 
chem
--
www.xanga.com/chemgurl