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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions.

Rewire Lighting Circuits



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 15th 06, 03:16 PM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Sep 2005
Posts: 22
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

I have been informed that both the upstairs and downstairs lighting circuits are not earthed, the property was built in 1961.

The property has the following lighting fitting

Downstairs -

3 wall lights frontroom
Ceiling rose fitting light dining room,hall,downstairs wc, 3xceiling lights in kitchen.

Upstairs

landing,Bathroom, 4x bedrooms.

The consumer unit was replaced in 2001 and on the paperwork it shows there recommendations then to rewire lighting, we moved in property last year.
Could people answer on what would the estimated cost would be to replace these circuits and what would entail please. I see this as an issue were outside parties are neededto be sourced.
I live in the northwest if this helps and if anyone can recommend an electrician please.

Thanks in advance

Mark
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  #2  
Old February 15th 06, 04:40 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

I have been informed that both the upstairs and downstairs lighting
circuits are not earthed, the property was built in 1961.

Could people answer on what would the estimated cost would be to
replace these circuits and what would entail please. I see this as an


Don't bother if it is PVC and you have no non-double insulated metallic
fittings. If you are ever redecorating a room, you could then run earthed
cables for that room then, but the disruption of rewiring lighting circuits
to add earths is all out of proportion to any safety benefit you will
obtain, which is pretty well a fat zero if you have plastic or double
insulated metallic fittings.

Christian.


  #3  
Old February 15th 06, 05:29 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

In article ,
mark harrison wrote:
Could people answer on what would the estimated cost would be to
replace these circuits and what would entail please. I see this as an
issue were outside parties are neededto be sourced.
I live in the northwest if this helps and if anyone can recommend an
electrician please.


This is a DIY group where you'll get advice on DIY. You might do better on
a local group for advice on decent tradesmen.

The biggest cost in re-wiring is labour. Getting at the wiring and making
good afterwards. Both of which impossible to assess without a site survey.

--
*The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
  #4  
Old February 16th 06, 07:44 AM
Junior Member
 
First recorded activity by DIYBanter: Sep 2005
Posts: 22
Default


Thankyou for the replies Gents. I understand what you say Dave, but to be told that your wiring circuit is unsafe as it was put to us was a cause of concern. Thats why the wife and I went into panic mode and made the presumption that it was something that we could not do ourselves.
The wiring is PVC coated 2 core, so running an external earth wire could do the trick as Christian inferred ?
Getting to the upstairs lighting would be fine from the loft space, ground floor ceiling lighs would be accessed by lifting floor boards in the bedrooms , but what would we do about wall lights (would they need chasing out ??)
Thats something that we can do ourselves and would undertake.

Thanks for the replies

Regards

Mark
  #5  
Old February 16th 06, 12:55 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

mark harrison wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) Wrote:
In article ,
mark harrison
wrote:
Could people answer on what would the estimated cost would be to
replace these circuits and what would entail please. I see this as an
issue were outside parties are neededto be sourced.
I live in the northwest if this helps and if anyone can recommend an
electrician please.

This is a DIY group where you'll get advice on DIY. You might do better
on
a local group for advice on decent tradesmen.

The biggest cost in re-wiring is labour. Getting at the wiring and
making
good afterwards. Both of which impossible to assess without a site
survey.

--
*The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up *

Dave Plowman
London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.



Thankyou for the replies Gents. I understand what you say Dave, but to
be told that your wiring circuit is unsafe as it was put to us was a
cause of concern. Thats why the wife and I went into panic mode and
made the presumption that it was something that we could not do
ourselves.
The wiring is PVC coated 2 core, so running an external earth wire
could do the trick as Christian inferred ?


I don't think Christian was intending you to run separate earths, but to
replace the runs of cable with new twin and earth. AIUI it isn't
permissible under the current regs to run the CPC separately unless you
are using single cables in conduit.

Getting to the upstairs lighting would be fine from the loft space,
ground floor ceiling lighs would be accessed by lifting floor boards in
the bedrooms , but what would we do about wall lights (would they need
chasing out ??)
Thats something that we can do ourselves and would undertake.


I think the best approach would maybe be to do bits as and when
appropriate. As you say, the loft should be fairly easy to do for a
start, and maybe you could do the downstairs rooms as and when you need
to take up carpets/floorboards upstairs for other reasons. If any of
the wall lights are not double insulated and require earths then I would
probably do them as a priority as they are probably within easy reach of
most people so are more likely to be touched than ceiling lights.

Worth pointing out also that you should obviously not have any metal
light switches such as the chrome ones you can get as these require
earthing.

Thanks for the replies

Regards

Mark


  #6  
Old February 16th 06, 01:04 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
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Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits



I think the best approach would maybe be to do bits as and when
appropriate


Though it may complicate matters beyond what is contemplated, if you
plan on
re-running cables then perhaps now is the time to think about any extra
switches or lights that would enhance your house?
The extra cost of three-core-and-earth cable beyond two-core-and-earth
is minimal, hence
when running lighting cable to switches and such I usually install the
former
cable as a contingency for the future.


HTH

Mungo

  #7  
Old February 16th 06, 01:04 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

In article ,
mark harrison wrote:
Thankyou for the replies Gents. I understand what you say Dave, but to
be told that your wiring circuit is unsafe as it was put to us was a
cause of concern. Thats why the wife and I went into panic mode and
made the presumption that it was something that we could not do
ourselves.
The wiring is PVC coated 2 core, so running an external earth wire
could do the trick as Christian inferred ?


Ah - right. So it's unlikely to be unsafe as such but simply doesn't
conform to modern regs.

But to be perfectly honest running just an earth wire is likely to be
nearly as much work and only save maybe 30 quids worth of cable - and at
the end of the day isn't going to impress a survey etc if you sell.

Getting to the upstairs lighting would be fine from the loft space,
ground floor ceiling lighs would be accessed by lifting floor boards in
the bedrooms , but what would we do about wall lights (would they need
chasing out ??)
Thats something that we can do ourselves and would undertake.


If you don't feel capable of doing the wiring, giving the electrician a
clear run by doing the donkey work will save a great deal of money.

--
*Nostalgia isn't what is used to be.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
  #8  
Old February 16th 06, 01:18 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

mark harrison wrote:

Thankyou for the replies Gents. I understand what you say Dave, but to
be told that your wiring circuit is unsafe as it was put to us was a
cause of concern. Thats why the wife and I went into panic mode and
made the presumption that it was something that we could not do
ourselves.


Do you believe everything you're told?

The wiring is PVC coated 2 core,


so theres no reason to think its disintegrating.

so running an external earth wire
could do the trick as Christian inferred ?
Getting to the upstairs lighting would be fine from the loft space,
ground floor ceiling lighs would be accessed by lifting floor boards in
the bedrooms , but what would we do about wall lights (would they need
chasing out ??)
Thats something that we can do ourselves and would undertake.

Thanks for the replies

Regards

Mark


Youre not listening Mark. Do you have metal light switches? Do you have
metal light fittings that are not double insulated, ie with no [[]]
symbol? If the answer is no to both those, then adding an earth will
achieve absolutely nothing.

I'm presuming this isnt bell wire... its been known.


NT

  #9  
Old February 16th 06, 03:17 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits


mark harrison wrote:
I have been informed that both the upstairs and downstairs lighting
circuits are not earthed, the property was built in 1961.

....
The consumer unit was replaced in 2001 and on the paperwork it shows
there recommendations then to rewire lighting, we moved in property
last year.


It sounds as if the previous owners fell for one of those scams, er I
mean free wiring inspections whose standard ploy is to create FUD over
grey PVC, unearthed lighting circuits, and rewirable fuses ("may cause
sparks and fire" is the standard phrase). Subject to the conditions
others have already given you about metal fittings and provided you
don't intend to knock nails into the cabling at the precise point where
an earth might protect you -- forget about it.

Chris

  #10  
Old February 16th 06, 03:38 PM posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Rewire Lighting Circuits

Richard Conway wrote:

mark harrison wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) Wrote:
In article ,
mark harrison
wrote:
Could people answer on what would the estimated cost would be to
replace these circuits and what would entail please. I see this as an
issue were outside parties are neededto be sourced.
I live in the northwest if this helps and if anyone can recommend an
electrician please.

This is a DIY group where you'll get advice on DIY. You might do better
on
a local group for advice on decent tradesmen.

The biggest cost in re-wiring is labour. Getting at the wiring and
making
good afterwards. Both of which impossible to assess without a site
survey.

--
*The sooner you fall behind, the more time you'll have to catch up *

Dave Plowman
London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.



Thankyou for the replies Gents. I understand what you say Dave, but to
be told that your wiring circuit is unsafe as it was put to us was a
cause of concern. Thats why the wife and I went into panic mode and
made the presumption that it was something that we could not do
ourselves.
The wiring is PVC coated 2 core, so running an external earth wire
could do the trick as Christian inferred ?


I don't think Christian was intending you to run separate earths, but to
replace the runs of cable with new twin and earth. AIUI it isn't
permissible under the current regs to run the CPC separately unless you
are using single cables in conduit.


I've seen it written that it is OK, provided that the CPC follows the route
of the cable/circuit it's protecting - but there has been much debate about
this.

Agreed that replacing with T+E would be better and neater with less cause
for confusion.

But I'm not qualified so you should take this with a pinch of salt ;-

Tim

 




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