Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
wrote:

Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam



of the two the miter saw looks more like a real machine, to me.

they're both sort of toys, though. expect inadequate power and short
service life.

take some time, save your money and look for good older equipment. the
older and heavier the better.

Obviously it depends on what you want to use them for!
For woodworking a table saw is much much much more important than a table
saw; while for carpentry a miter saw might be better.
However, a crappy table saw (and your link looks like a crappy table saw) is
a curse forever. A crappy miter saw (and I own a crappy miter saw, so I
know) is simply unpleasant.

This one any better?

SB


"SB" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam

On Sat 20 Nov 2004 05:01:39p, "SB" wrote in
:

I'm in the colonies and I don't know what you're going to be using them
for, so use a fairly large grain of salt.

Of the bunch, the miter saw looks to be the better tool. Of course, being
8-inch, it would cut a max of 8 inches wide at 90 degrees, and less than
that as you started to cut angles. So for me it would be too limiting.

I sincerely think you'd be better off with a good circular saw than you
would be with that benchtop table saw.

But if your purpose is creating small stuff, like boxes or models, then
perhaps both of them would serv you just fine. The circular saw wouldn't be
very good for cutting smaller, thinner stock, but that little tablesaw
would do it just fine. The tablesaw looks like it's intended for modelers,
the miter saw looks like it's intended for stock of almost any length but
only about an inch thick and six or seven inches wide.

But then, it looks like you've only got 40 or 50 pounds to spend. If you
want the most bang for the... if you want the most you can get for what you
spend, I lean towards the miter saw.

My two pence. :-)

Dan

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
wrote:

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

They're both rubbish.

The chop saw is fitted with a 24 tooth blade that's only fit for crude
ripping (and you can't rip with a chop). It also has a bizarre 20mm
bore, so you'll not find a better blade to fit it.

The table saw is just pitiful. I don't even want to talk about it.

I thought either a mitre or table saw.

If you don't know which one you need, then you're either hopelessly
confused about their function, or you've just got money burning a hole
in your pocket. What do you want them _for_ ? What do you want to
cut, and will this saw do that type of cut ?

The chop saw is only fit for crude crosscuts, probably just in
softwood. This is the very easiest (simplest and less tiring) cut to
make by hand. It has no slide or stop, so it can't even cut a halved
joint. It can "mitre", which is a feature of near-total uselessness.
It's too crude to make picture frame, and what else uses a crude butt
joint ? If you're going to make a very poor dog kennel, or maybe some
shopfitting, then it might have a function (which it will probably
fail to fulfill, but it might try).

A "table saw" isn't such a bad idea. If you get one that works, then
it will do useful things for you. But this piece of junk is just
taking 40 quid and burning it on rubbish.

200 quid (IMHO) gets you a decent table saw. 100 quid gets you one
that has some pretence to usefulness, for the cruder sort of work. 500
quid gets you old industrial iron that will last forever. 40 quid
just gets you grief.

You already have a jigsaw and a router. Presumably you also have 40
quid. That's some useful hand tools and some timber. Come back when
you've done something more with what you _have_now_. You've got enough
to make something with already, you certainly don't _need_ a table saw
right this minute.

One of the best things to use a table saw for is ripping stock down to
size. This takes a big cheap chunk of wood and turns it into usable
sizes. But you can nearly always avoid this by having the timberyard
do it for you. It's cheaper to have your own saw, and more convenient
- but you can work around not having it. Where you are at the moment,
you're not even needing to do much ripping. Buy your timber as ready
sawn and surfaced, it's easier and quicker - you can manage with that
for the moment.

I want to get a new power saw

That's the problem. 40 quid does not buy you a new saw that you would
want to use.

Most tools are rubbish. Nearly all modern tools are. Argos sell
junk, to stupid people. Look at their jewellery - for this is where
their inherent and inescapable chaviness is most obvious. Now ask
yourself why the store that could offer us this:
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name
Is somehow any further up-market when it comes to woodworking ?


As an alternative, do you know anyone who already has a suitable saw
and will either let you use it, or will cut stock down for you ?
--
Smert' spamionam

(Pssst) Andy,

SB is 13 years old, just starting out. He is also a Brit.

cheers,

Greg

In article 1100999663.G+xiYfMd/0KwOb/zzZRtiw@teranews, Greg Millen
wrote:

SB is 13 years old, just starting out. He is also a Brit.

Then he's getting good advice at the start, isn't he?

One man's opinion only. If I could only have one, for the kinds of
things I do it would have to be the table saw. Save up for both. :-)

bob g.

SB wrote:
Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
wrote:

Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Neither look really good, if you're going to get one, get the mitre
saw, IMO. A bad mitre saw is just going to bog down and annoy you,
but a bad table saw can be really dangerous.
Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
wrote:

Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Sam,

Why don't you try out a nice japanese-style handsaw? You can get a
nice tool that will last you a long time for the same price you'd pay
for a junk power tool that is more likely to be dangerous than useful
or fun to use. Power tools can be really nice, and great to use, but
if you're just learning woodworking, it's a good idea to start off
with the basics. A table saw can be a dangerous tool, especially if
it is underpowered, the fence is not square, or the top is not sturdy
enough- and I'd bet that the saw you're looking at is guilty of all
three of these things.

A mitre saw is not nearly as dangerous when it is low-quality, but a
good handsaw and a mitre box is just as easy to use. I made a living
as a carpenter for several years without many power tools at all, and
my work was just as nice as any of the guys with every power tool
under the sun. If you want a powered saw, try looking at a handheld
circular saw first, but save up your money a little bit, and get a
nice one that will do what you want it to. Later on, when you've got
a little more money and some more practice, you'll be able to get
tools that are nicer and are *able* to make projects that you'll be
proud of for years to come.

If you've got a friend around that knows about tools, maybe a neighbor
or an instructor at your school, you might want to sit down with them
and go over some of your options before you buy anything. I think
it's great that you're so interested in woodworking, and I'm not
trying to discourage you at all- I'd just hate to hear that you gave
it up because you were frustrated by trying to use the wrong tools for
the job.

Good Luck!


Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
wrote:

Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.


You seem to have your heart set on buying a power saw for straight
cuts (that is, something other than your jig saw). For the general
amount of money that you appear to have available, I think that your
best bet, if you just *have* to buy something, is a handheld circular
saw. You have to be *very* careful with these. I personally think
that you would find something like the following pretty useful:


http://www.lowes.com/lkn?action=prod...79992-FS1800CS

It's reasonably light and it's easier to handle than the typical
circular saw. And I suspect that for the type of cutting you are
likely to do in the next year or two, it will be fine: I've cut 1"
oak with one of these and ripped an 8' soft wood 2X4. You will
have to concentrate, or use a guide, to obtain decent straight
cuts. You may also want to replace the blade when you scrounge
up some more money. I have no idea how long it is likely to
last: I haven't had mine very long and I use other saws most of
the time. I also don't know if you can get one or how much it
would cost in England, but there should be something like it
from another company. I would want to actually pick one up
and get a feel for it before committing myself to buying it.

Thanks Andy,

I will save for a better one, but for little things like my glasses box,
getting those diagonals right really is a pain..

Thanks for the Argos picture lol

Sam


"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
wrote:

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...ay?storeId=100
01&langId=-1&catalogId=2501&productId=110592&clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...ay?storeId=100
01&langId=-1&catalogId=2501&productId=110571&clickfrom=name

They're both rubbish.

The chop saw is fitted with a 24 tooth blade that's only fit for crude
ripping (and you can't rip with a chop). It also has a bizarre 20mm
bore, so you'll not find a better blade to fit it.

The table saw is just pitiful. I don't even want to talk about it.

I thought either a mitre or table saw.

If you don't know which one you need, then you're either hopelessly
confused about their function, or you've just got money burning a hole
in your pocket. What do you want them _for_ ? What do you want to
cut, and will this saw do that type of cut ?

The chop saw is only fit for crude crosscuts, probably just in
softwood. This is the very easiest (simplest and less tiring) cut to
make by hand. It has no slide or stop, so it can't even cut a halved
joint. It can "mitre", which is a feature of near-total uselessness.
It's too crude to make picture frame, and what else uses a crude butt
joint ? If you're going to make a very poor dog kennel, or maybe some
shopfitting, then it might have a function (which it will probably
fail to fulfill, but it might try).

A "table saw" isn't such a bad idea. If you get one that works, then
it will do useful things for you. But this piece of junk is just
taking 40 quid and burning it on rubbish.

200 quid (IMHO) gets you a decent table saw. 100 quid gets you one
that has some pretence to usefulness, for the cruder sort of work. 500
quid gets you old industrial iron that will last forever. 40 quid
just gets you grief.

You already have a jigsaw and a router. Presumably you also have 40
quid. That's some useful hand tools and some timber. Come back when
you've done something more with what you _have_now_. You've got enough
to make something with already, you certainly don't _need_ a table saw
right this minute.

One of the best things to use a table saw for is ripping stock down to
size. This takes a big cheap chunk of wood and turns it into usable
sizes. But you can nearly always avoid this by having the timberyard
do it for you. It's cheaper to have your own saw, and more convenient
- but you can work around not having it. Where you are at the moment,
you're not even needing to do much ripping. Buy your timber as ready
sawn and surfaced, it's easier and quicker - you can manage with that
for the moment.

I want to get a new power saw

That's the problem. 40 quid does not buy you a new saw that you would
want to use.

Most tools are rubbish. Nearly all modern tools are. Argos sell
junk, to stupid people. Look at their jewellery - for this is where
their inherent and inescapable chaviness is most obvious. Now ask
yourself why the store that could offer us this:

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name
Is somehow any further up-market when it comes to woodworking ?


As an alternative, do you know anyone who already has a suitable saw
and will either let you use it, or will cut stock down for you ?
--
Smert' spamionam

Sam Berlyn states:

I will save for a better one, but for little things like my glasses box,
getting those diagonals right really is a pain..

For miters in small work, there must be a company in Blighty that makes and
sells something like these Jorgenson maple miter boxes. Use these with a good
handsaw and you'll be doing miters the way carpenters and woodworkers have done
them for a couple centuries or more. And it works. And is low in cost.

http://www.adjustableclamp.com/mb-62000.htm

Charlie Self
"Health nuts are going to feel stupid someday, lying in hospitals dying of
nothing."
Redd Foxx

Is this mitre saw any better?

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/produc...5&r=2119&g=115

Sam

P.S. Can a table saw actually be DANGEROUS I mean wouldn't that be illegal?
If they are both not much good on quality, I'm happy, because I won't use it
like a professional, will I.



"SB" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40

http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam

Ah -- the joys of being 13 -- and what's wrong with being a Brit :-)

A proud Brit,
Malcolm Webb

B & Q do a nice range of circular saws at a decent price in their
Performance Power range for less than the cost of a poor table saw.

Malcolm Webb

What's *wrong* with being a Brit? Well, being an Aussie, where do start?
:-)

I mean't that by being a Brit, he will be stubborn enough to whittle a chair
with a blunt penknife!

--

Greg


"Malcolm Webb" wrote in message
o.uk...
Ah -- the joys of being 13 -- and what's wrong with being a Brit :-)

A proud Brit,
Malcolm Webb

On 21 Nov 2004 09:58:33 GMT, otforme (Charlie Self)
wrote:

For miters in small work, there must be a company in Blighty that makes and
sells something like these Jorgenson maple miter boxes.

Emir, in beech. Well worth having. There are cheap plastic ones
too, which aren't so good (the slots wear)

Having looked at Sam's plan though, it would still be hard to cut with
a mitre box. It's a mitred rip, so that's too long a mitre to cut in a
typical mitre box. When I've needed similar things (or board mitres on
the ends of skirting boards) I've made my own "tall and narrow" miitre
boxes to suit the job. If you have some good timber (beech is good,
elm or oak are good too) and you take your time on the cut, then you
can make an accurate box. A deep box probably needs to be used with
a bow saw, unless you have a very deep tenon saw to hand.

--
Smert' spamionam

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 09:26:05 -0000, "Sam Berlyn"
wrote:

for little things like my glasses box,
getting those diagonals right really is a pain..

Ideally you'd cut those mitres with a table saw, either by tilting the
blade or by using a sled (it carries the timber at an angle, past a
vertical blade).

It would be dangerous to cut them on that "mitre" saw. It's designed
to cut mitres the other way.


On the whole though, I wouldn't make your glasses box with mitres.
Mitres are a pain - I hate the things. My last mitres were a
compound-mitred casket which I cut on the table saw and I splined
those (inserted a "feather" of thin timber into a groove) to hold them
in place while I assembled them. An unsplined mitre is always a
nuisance to assemble because there's nothing positive to hold it
accurately in place.

You have a router, so why not try a rebated lap ? Routers are good at
rebates. This is just like a butt joint, but you cut a rebate
(removing one corner by a square groove) so that the rebate is the
width of the board and half the depth. It's easy to glue up because
just wrapping the box with elastic bands pulls it tight against the
rebate as a "stop".

Rebated laps are a bit ugly, because they expose some end grain (if
you make a box that's bigger and shallower). But for your box, you're
working with two long grain edges, so that's OK. You can also make
the joint, then cut a little chamfer on the outside edge to hide this.


Some very good books (you'll find at least one in the library) are the
introductory joinery books by Tage Frid, Ernest Joyce, Robert Wearing
and maybe Charles Hayward.
--
Smert' spamionam

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 10:12:33 -0000, "Sam Berlyn"
wrote:

Is this mitre saw any better?

No, it's a chop saw. The general problems with chop saws still apply
- they're just not much use.

They're _great_ for shopfitting. Lots of quick crosscuts and crude
butt joints in ready-finished softwood. For anything else though,
they're too inflexible. You just don't need to cut all the way
through narrow timber very often, and if you do, a handsaw is lighter,
nearly as quick, and keeps you warmer.

If you go "up a notch"
http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.a...210854&lkid=49
(Bosch has a clearer picture)
http://www.axminster.co.uk/product.a...=22754&recno=1

you find the "sliding mitre saw". This is much more useful. There's a
horizontal slide mechanism so they can cut wider timber, but also
there's usually a depth stop so that they can cut halfway through
something and leave a flat surface. With that, you can start making
the complex joints that take real time and effort otherwise.

P.S. Can a table saw actually be DANGEROUS

Yes. There's no way they can be otherwise. It's for slicing up trees!
What do you _think_ it's going to do to you ?

This is one good reason why I don't want you to go out and buy a table
saw. You're far too likely to injure yourself with it. There are a
whole load of 99 quid table saws in the big DIY sheds that I just
don't think are safe for untrained new users to carry home and use, or
that they're particularly safe for anyone to use.

Table saws are dangerous. To use it safely you need to know how to do
so - now we're not _born_ knowing this, so we need to learn it. How ?
Usenet is good, but it has limits ! Really you need to be shown by
someone who does know (most users don't) and who can show you how to
do this with a good saw. It's always easier to learn with good tools,
then you can better appreciate what's good or bad about the cheaper
ones.

There are two main risks with a table saw. One is sticking your hand
in the blade. This is hard to do with modern saws, because the guards
(even on cheap saws) are pretty good. Cheap modern DIY saws are often
better equipped than older commercial saws.

The best remaining way to stick your hand into a blade is by putting
your hand on the timber and pushing _both_ into the blade. Very common
mistake, particularly when the blade is hidden halfway in the timber
and not visible through the top. You avoid this by using a push
stick, not your hands. I feed timber by hand, but _never_ let my
hands leave the edge of the saw's table (on my saw this keeps them a
safe distance from the blade, even at most stretch)

The second risk is much less obvious. It's called kickback. The saw
turns into a catapult and throws the timber at you. This is too
complicated to explain in text, because there are several reasons it
might happen. Some of the causes are _not_ obvious and as you don't
know them already (how could you ?) I'd be concerned about setting you
loose armed with a saw and no knowledge. If you can find a copy, Ian
Kirby's "The Accurate Table Saw" is a good book to start by reading.

In general, I wouldn't like to use a small table saw. As I posted a
few days ago, I want something powerful enough to just cut the timber,
not turn it into a wrestling match. Predictable power is much safer
than unpredictability.


I won't use it like a professional, will I.

I'd rather you used it like a good amateur. "Professional" means
you're getting paid for it, not that you're any good. There's a lot
of dodgy stuff done on building sites and most "professionals" are
working at the low end, not the high end.



--
Smert' spamionam

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 09:26:05 -0000, "Sam Berlyn"
wrote:

for little things like my glasses box,
getting those diagonals right really is a pain..

Ideally you'd cut those mitres with a table saw, either by tilting the
blade or by using a sled (it carries the timber at an angle, past a
vertical blade).

It would be dangerous to cut them on that "mitre" saw. It's designed
to cut mitres the other way.



Agreed on the use of the table saw as the preferred method Andy, but I
disagree on the danger and the intended use of the miter saw. It's designed
to cut down through wood at any angle. It does not care nor does it know
which direction the wood is oriented in. The saw is equally well suited to
cross cut miters through the width of a board as it is across the width of
one. There's no increase in danger in this operation. It's a common use of
a miter saw and a very reasonable use as well.
--

-Mike-

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 15:01:46 GMT, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

It does not care nor does it know
which direction the wood is oriented in.

The problem is that for Sam's box, you're going to have a long mitre
on a short piece (actually narrow, along the board). This piece is
even shorter than the length of the cut. As it's a compound mitre saw
you could do this, but you've an awkward problem in holding it down.

--
Smert' spamionam

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 15:01:46 GMT, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

It does not care nor does it know
which direction the wood is oriented in.

The problem is that for Sam's box, you're going to have a long mitre
on a short piece (actually narrow, along the board). This piece is
even shorter than the length of the cut. As it's a compound mitre saw
you could do this, but you've an awkward problem in holding it down.


Correct. Ignore that brain fart Andy. Thank you.
--

-Mike-

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 10:12:33 -0000, "Sam Berlyn"
wrote:

P.S. Can a table saw actually be DANGEROUS I mean wouldn't that be illegal?
If they are both not much good on quality, I'm happy, because I won't use it
like a professional, will I.

Sam-
woodworking is dangerous. accept this.

hardwood is about as dense as bone- so any tool that can cut wood can
cut bone. keep your fingers away from the cutters.

power tools do stuff real fast. faster than your nervous system can
react to- so when things go wrong they happen before you can realize
it and pull your hand away, or duck, or dodge.

that router you bought can kill you. one of the worst shop accidents
I've had was with a router. I still have the scars 12 years later.
when a router bites you it turns flesh into hamburger- there's nothing
to stitch back in, because it's spread all over the walls.

so how come there are any woodworkers left alive to post on this
newsgroup?

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 13:12:24 +0000, Andy Dingley
wrote:

On 21 Nov 2004 09:58:33 GMT, otforme (Charlie Self)
wrote:

For miters in small work, there must be a company in Blighty that makes and
sells something like these Jorgenson maple miter boxes.

Emir, in beech. Well worth having. There are cheap plastic ones
too, which aren't so good (the slots wear)

Having looked at Sam's plan though, it would still be hard to cut with
a mitre box. It's a mitred rip, so that's too long a mitre to cut in a
typical mitre box. When I've needed similar things (or board mitres on
the ends of skirting boards) I've made my own "tall and narrow" miitre
boxes to suit the job. If you have some good timber (beech is good,
elm or oak are good too) and you take your time on the cut, then you
can make an accurate box. A deep box probably needs to be used with
a bow saw, unless you have a very deep tenon saw to hand.


I suspect his best-bang-for-the-buck solution will be a block plane
and a shooting board.

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 13:26:37 +0000, Andy Dingley
wrote:

On the whole though, I wouldn't make your glasses box with mitres.

Thanks to an email from Sam I now realise this isn't what he's making
at all. Sorry about that - I thought you were mitring the side
joints. The top edges of the box sides _are_ cut at an angle though.

OK, so the saw is still a bad idea 8-) I'm all for buying
specialist tools, but with 30 quid of chop saw just to make two cuts,
you could _hire_ someone to come and saw it for you!

Yes, for the cut you are making, the chop saw would do it, But so
would a hand saw, particularly when you're making 45° cuts and you can
use a mitre box.

For your joints, butts have a similar problem to mitres - there's no
positive location, so they're a nuisance to clamp up. Investigate
cutting the rebated lap with your router.

This is also quite a small box you're making. Small stuff is tricky
because errors show up as larger. Things about a foot or two on each
side are often easier.

--
Smert' spamionam

"SB" wrote in message ...
Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam

What are these? The Nu-Tool's "budget line"?

I have my own rule: when something very sharp travels at X thousand
r.p.m. - DON'T buy the cheapest one there is!

FoggyTown

At today's exchange rates, those are tremendous bargains if they are good
quality machines; buy them both. Otherwise, which one you want depends on
what you want to do. You can't use a miter (US spelling) saw for ripping.
You can crosscut with the table saw, but setup is a nuisance. There is also
a question of space; a table saw is a big space hog needing lots of room for
infeed and outfeed, and probably on one side. Try to match the tool to the
task. By the way, if they are cheap (as opposed to inexpensive) buy the
miter saw - less chance to hurt yourself.

Steve


"Mike Girouard" wrote in message
m...
"SB" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam

What are these? The Nu-Tool's "budget line"?

I have my own rule: when something very sharp travels at X thousand
r.p.m. - DON'T buy the cheapest one there is!

FoggyTown

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 21:28:04 +1100, "Greg Millen"
vaguely proposed a theory
.......and in reply I say!:

remove ns from my header address to reply via email

What's *wrong* with being a Brit? Well, being an Aussie, where do start?
:-)

I mean't that by being a Brit, he will be stubborn enough to whittle a chair
with a blunt penknife!

Great! Let go of the bloody cheap **** power tools, and get better
hand tools.

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 22:07:21 -0000, "SB"
vaguely proposed a theory
.......and in reply I say!:

remove ns from my header address to reply via email

OK. I thought you were a troll. But you have started replying to
answers to your questions without calling names G. So you appear not
to be a troll. My apologies.

But I feel you keep chasing the wrong things.

You appear to be starting out, and/or on a limited budget.

Unless you simply want :
- nice toys
OR
- a shed full of stuff that impresses your friends (and they would
not want to know much, if they were impressed by what you are asking
about) and then either clutters up the shelves or gets thrown out
later,

let go of the idea of all these cheap mounted power tools, and
especially the bench/table ones. If you are just starting woodwork,
then get other tools.

Clamps, chisels, more clamps, a hand saw, maybe even a circular saw,
later, a hand mitre saw, glue(s). Plane(s) and a shooting board. An
orbital sander. A mounted circular sander or maybe belt/circular
sander for finishing mitres. Make jigs. And there are three very
important tools. Skill, knowledge and patience.

First power tools should be a handheld circ saw, and a router. Learn
to use them properly, and treat them with respect approaching, but not
entering, fear. You can do a lot of work with straight edges and these
tools.

There are hand mitre saws around that cut really nice mitres. Crikey!
I have cut quite reasonable mitres with a hacksaw, by eye! There was a
time when all work was done without any power tools at all.

Learn the work. Wait until you can afford at least decent table saws
etc. All you are showing is crappy, dangerous, inaccurate junk.

Table saws and other specialty saws should be special. They also do
_NOT_ make the woodworking job _that_ much easier. They make a very
small portion of the total job of wood selection, design, cutting,
fitting, gluing, sanding, finishing etc a bit easier, sometimes. Take
for instance a table saw. Unless you have good, straight wood, you
will simply be frustrated, or have a fight to get a good result. Read
all the posts about why the cut was wrong, or the edges not parallel
etc.

You are not doing dozens of cuts here, if you are making projects at
the start. Getting the wood, fitting, clamping and gluing, then
finishing a project will mean that you make maybe ten cuts, then spend
days finishing the job off. In addition, each of those cuts will
probably be different and you have to reset the machinery anyway.

Also, the idea of making woodwork, as a hobby, as fast and cheap as
possible is crazy. I know. I have done it, and have seen many other
DIY guys do the same. The magazines used to encourage the "build a
whole dining setting from scrap in a weekend" idea a bit. Now the
"DIY" shows on TV let you do it in 5 minutes! Using no materials at
all! G.

That should not be the point of woodwork. You will make a mess, get
frustrated, and not be fast anyway. The doing of the thing is the
point, at least until you turn pro. Then making enough money is the
point.

Hi,

I want to get a new power saw and I thought either a mitre or table saw.

Below is

a) a mitre saw - £30
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name

b) a table saw - £40
http://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/st...clickfrom=name


Cheers,

Sam