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author:radovanic

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Search Result 2
From: Paul T. Radovanic )
Subject: Do you lift or drag your plane back at the end of a
stroke?
View: Complete Thread (16 articles)
Original Format
Newsgroups: rec.woodworking
Date: 2001-09-02 07:34:08 PST


I rarely mention this, but I stopped lapping plane soles to perfection
a long time ago.

This is only my own personal experience, so take it for what it is
worth.

I found that soles lapped to a mirror finish caused *more*
friction/resistance, or whatever you want to call it.

Stopping at 320 grit seems just about perfect. The sole doesn't get
as warm, and the plane is easier to use.

I have no clue as to the "injuneering" reasons for this. I'm strictly
an "empirical Galoot" -- I believe my own eyes and experience. This
works for me.

Paul Rad


Regards,
Tom.

"People funny. Life a funny thing." Sonny Liston

Thomas J.Watson - Cabinetmaker (ret.)
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (real email)
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1

"Tom Watson" wrote in message
Groups Search result 2 for group:rec.woodworking authoraul
author:radovanic

I rarely mention this, but I stopped lapping plane soles to perfection
a long time ago.

This is only my own personal experience, so take it for what it is
worth.

I found that soles lapped to a mirror finish caused *more*
friction/resistance, or whatever you want to call it.

Stopping at 320 grit seems just about perfect. The sole doesn't get
as warm, and the plane is easier to use.

I have no clue as to the "injuneering" reasons for this. I'm strictly
an "empirical Galoot" -- I believe my own eyes and experience. This
works for me.

Paul Rad

And what the wreck should strive to be.

The mirror finish will make for more friction as thee is more surface
contact between the plane and the wood. Something to be aware of.
Ed

In article , Tom Watson
wrote:

snip ancient wisdom

Tom,

Here's the secret of the universe, just for you:

"Things Change"

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 19:51:15 -0600, Dave Balderstone
wrote:

In article , Tom Watson
wrote:

snip ancient wisdom

Tom,

Here's the secret of the universe, just for you:

"Things Change"



Politicians love to pigeonhole us.

I use the terms "liberal" and "conservative" in their true sense, not
in the sense that the current crop of politicians have defined them.
IOW, liberal means to embrace change, conservative means to resist
change. I'm fer changing some things, agin changing others, as I see
fit.

When Winston Churchill said (paraphrased) that we are all liberal at
20 and conservative at 40, he was not using the modern definitions.
IMHO, he was saying that youth is for experimentation, but as we get
older, we tend to want to preserve (conserve) the good things we found
along the way. It's human nature.

As for the politicians' current definitions of the terms, this too
shall pass. A hundred+ years ago, the Democratic Party was made up of
conservative plantation owners, while the other side was referred to
as the "Radical Republicans", who were interested in rapid change.
The pols will continue to use whatever definitions that advance their
agendas. Nowadays, they even debate what your definition of "is" is
-- not to mention "vote" and "count" and "trust". ;^

Paul Rad
Regards,
Tom.

"People funny. Life a funny thing." Sonny Liston

Thomas J.Watson - Cabinetmaker (ret.)
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (real email)
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 20:56:06 -0500, Tom Watson wrote:


As for the politicians' current definitions of the terms, this too shall
pass. A hundred+ years ago, the Democratic Party was made up of
conservative plantation owners, while the other side was referred to as
the "Radical Republicans", who were interested in rapid change. The pols
will continue to use whatever definitions that advance their agendas.
Nowadays, they even debate what your definition of "is" is -- not to
mention "vote" and "count" and "trust". ;^

Paul Rad
Regards,

With all due respect for Paully (and I have the utmost respect), todays
version seems to be rooted in the definition of equality - whether you see
it as concerning equal oportunity or equal outcome.

Practice your finish on scraps or you will practice on your project

-Paully Rad

It really gets me that everyone in the country can operate an ATM --
even those who can't program their VCR's know how to operate an ATM.
It would be a simple matter to install ATM-like machines for voting --
at far less than $10K a pop, I should think.

Why the hell are we using punch cards? Didn't Ross Perot make his
billions off them? Is he still involved here?

Paul Rad



Doug Winterburn writes:

Hopefully, before the next four years
passes, we can get some entirely objective, understandable, accurate,
affordable and reliable voting methodology and technology and render
recounting completely unnecessary. If local government needs some
assitance with the change, I can think of no better partial use of our
"surplus".

Regards,
Tom.

"People funny. Life a funny thing." Sonny Liston

Thomas J.Watson - Cabinetmaker (ret.)
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (real email)
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1

Tom Watson wrote:
It really gets me that everyone in the country can operate an ATM --
even those who can't program their VCR's know how to operate an ATM.
It would be a simple matter to install ATM-like machines for voting --
at far less than $10K a pop, I should think.

Why the hell are we using punch cards? Didn't Ross Perot make his
billions off them? Is he still involved here?

Paul Rad

[snip]
There is a group of true experts with lots of experience in providing a
truly simple, easy to use and understand user interface for those
communicating in a public place to a remote facility. The data involved
is more precious than mere votes, but it is all carried out with the
complete confidence of the user community. I am, of course, talking
about the horse racing betting community.
mahalo,
jo4hn

Edwin Pawlowski suggested...
The mirror finish will make for more friction as there is more surface
contact between the plane and the wood.

In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged. Since this constant normal force is now distributed
over a larger area, the force per unit area is lower. It can be shown
that the increase in friction from the larger contact area is exactly
offset by the decrease in friction due to the lower normal force per unit
area.

Nonetheless, my own empirical experience does seem to match Paul's. I
thought I had a reasonably good grasp of the sciences, and of physics in
particular, but I readily admit to being baffled by this phenomenon.
Anyone have another explanation? Perhaps it's just psychological???

Jim

"Jim Wilson" wrote in message
In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged. Since this constant normal force is now distributed
over a larger area, the force per unit area is lower. It can be shown
that the increase in friction from the larger contact area is exactly
offset by the decrease in friction due to the lower normal force per unit
area.

Nonetheless, my own empirical experience does seem to match Paul's. I
thought I had a reasonably good grasp of the sciences, and of physics in
particular, but I readily admit to being baffled by this phenomenon.
Anyone have another explanation? Perhaps it's just psychological???

Jim

You also have the "vacuum" factor. (I'm sure there is a real term for it but
cannot think of it at the moment.) If you take two highly polished pieces of
metal, or sheets of glass, they tend to stick to each other. OTOH, you can
usually slide them apart even if you can lift one away from the other.
Perhaps this is over riding what I think of as friction?

Origins lost, but there is indeed a difference with the "me" generation.:

According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids
in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's probably shouldn't have survived.
Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint.
We had no child proof lids on medicine bottles, doors or cabinets, and when
we rode our bikes, we had no helmets. (not to mention the risks we took
hitchhiking.)
As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or air bags. Riding in
the back of a pickup truck on a warm day was always a special treat, as well
as sitting on the rear edge of the station wagon and hanging onto the roof.
We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle. Horrors!
We shared one soft drink with four friends, from one bottle, and no one
actually died from this. We ate cupcakes, bread and butter, and drank soda
pop with sugar in it, but we were never overweight because we were always
outside playing. We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as
long as we were back when the street lights came on.
No one was able to reach us all day. No cell phones. Unthinkable!
We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then rode down
the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes, after running into the
bushes a few times, we learned to solve the problem.
We did not have playstations, nintendo 64, x-boxes, no video games at all,
no 99 channels on cable, video tape movies, surround sound, personal cell
phones, personal computers, or internet chat rooms. We had friends! We went
outside and found them. We fell out of trees, got cut and broke bones and
teeth, and there were no lawsuits from these accidents.
We made up games with sticks and tennis balls and ate worms, and although we
re told it would happen, we did not put out very many eyes, nor did the
worms live inside us forever.
We rode bikes or walked to a friend's home and knocked on the door, or rang
the bell or just walked in and talked to them.
Little league had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those who didn't
had to learn to deal with disappointment.
The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke a law was unheard of.they
actually sided with the law. Imagine that!
This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers and problem
solvers and inventors, ever. The past 50 years have been an explosion of
innovation and new ideas. We had freedom, failure! Lure, success and
responsibility, and we learned how to deal with it all.

Greg Millen writes:

..Origins lost, but there is indeed a difference with the "me" generation.:

According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids
in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's probably shouldn't have survived.
Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint.
We had no child proof lids on medicine bottles, doors or cabinets, and when...
snip

I always wonder how my parents' generation, and their parents' generation, made
it past 25. Hell, my grandfather (maternal) died in his early 70s--but from a
mule kicking him in the head as he got ready for another day's work. I've got
an aunt who will be 90 in February, and who is still in good condition, alert
and ready to go. My wife's first mother-in-law is pushing 93, IIRC. She's not
all that healthy, but she is alert.

Wrong diet, wrong surroundings, raised without electricity or running water,
worked their butts off--I can remember one uncle stating (not complaining) that
his father didn't really care for kids (he had 13 born live) until they were 8
or and could help on the farm, so the poor little kids had to actually WORK for
their self-esteem.

Things change, as someone else said.

Charlie Self
"It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of
common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever
ineligible for public office." H. L. Mencken

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 03:09:55 GMT, Jim Wilson
wrote:

In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged.

"Friction is independent of area"

Regularly voted "least convincing physical law in lab demonstrations".
We know the theory, but the practice is such that friction varies
considerably depending on surface condition and the overall area
involved.

Friction between plane soles and timber is complicated. It does vary,
I certainly don't understand why.
--
Smert' spamionam

"Charlie Self" wrote in message

Wrong diet, wrong surroundings, raised without electricity or running
water,
worked their butts off--I can remember one uncle stating (not complaining)
that
his father didn't really care for kids (he had 13 born live) until they
were 8
or and could help on the farm, so the poor little kids had to actually
WORK for
their self-esteem.

Things change, as someone else said.

Yessir ... the shirt that I wore to the first day of school was made out of
a flower sack, and the collar hung to the end of my shoulders, but my Sears
Roebuck "Roy Rogers" sweat shirt, with the picture of Trigger reariing up,
made the whole thing "uptown".

... and now my kids can't be clothed without Abercrombie and Fitch, or a
trip to the Galleria.

My hat's off to anyone who, immediately after church, had to pick the
feathers off the Sunday dinner ... can you imagine a kid having to do that
to eat these days?

We were just too damn busy with living to get fat.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 11/06/04

On 12 Nov 2004 09:31:38 GMT, otforme (Charlie Self)
calmly ranted:

Greg Millen writes:

.Origins lost, but there is indeed a difference with the "me" generation.:

According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids
in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's probably shouldn't have survived.
Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint.
We had no child proof lids on medicine bottles, doors or cabinets, and when...
snip

Wrong diet, wrong surroundings, raised without electricity or running water,
worked their butts off--I can remember one uncle stating (not complaining) that
his father didn't really care for kids (he had 13 born live) until they were 8
or and could help on the farm, so the poor little kids had to actually WORK for
their self-esteem.

Things change, as someone else said.

Excellent discourse, Grogs; good followthrough, Charlie.
I believe it was the hard work which saved them all, both physically
and mentally, especially self-esteem.

This was gleaned from rec.crafts.metalworking and fits right in:

--snip--
As an explaination for the decline in the US's tech edge, James
Niccol wrote "It used to be that the USA was pretty good at
producing stuff teenaged boys could lose a finger or two playing
with."
--snip--


-------------------------------------------------
- Boldly going - * Wondrous Website Design
- nowhere. - * http://www.diversify.com
-------------------------------------------------

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 19:41:19 +1100, "Greg Millen"
wrote:

According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids
in the 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's probably shouldn't have survived.
snip...
when we rode our bikes, we had no helmets.

And I used to ride mine helmet-less behind the DDT truck that used to
spray every day in the summer to knock down the mosquito population.

Rode in huge white cloulds of the stuff as it spewed out of the back
of that truck, because, you see...

I had a _mission._

Rode fast, rode lungs-pumping-to-the-bursting-point hard, 'cause when
you're a seven-year-old Navy jet pilot swerving in and out of the
clouds so you don't get shot down, that's just what you gotta do.

Damn the helmets _and_ the DDT. Full throttle.

Michael "Ace" Baglio

Larry Jaques responds:


This was gleaned from rec.crafts.metalworking and fits right in:

--snip--
As an explaination for the decline in the US's tech edge, James
Niccol wrote "It used to be that the USA was pretty good at
producing stuff teenaged boys could lose a finger or two playing
with."

Even as chicken as I've always been, I've come close a time or six. And when I
think of the set-up my grandfather had at his sawmill! Jeez, OSHA would have a
green-eyed **** fit. Big old open circular blade (no replaceable tips in those
days; sharpen with a file), on a belt from a stationary Model A (I think)
engine. The only guards in those days were inside banks keeping an eye on the
vaults.

Charlie Self
"It is inaccurate to say that I hate everything. I am strongly in favor of
common sense, common honesty, and common decency. This makes me forever
ineligible for public office." H. L. Mencken

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 03:09:55 GMT, Jim Wilson wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski suggested...
The mirror finish will make for more friction as there is more surface
contact between the plane and the wood.

In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged. Since this constant normal force is now distributed
over a larger area, the force per unit area is lower. It can be shown
that the increase in friction from the larger contact area is exactly
offset by the decrease in friction due to the lower normal force per unit
area.

What about not being able to get air under the polished surface?
Jo blocks stick together rather well, I've always been told this is
due to the very smooth surfaces and absence of air (vacuum) between them.

Nonetheless, my own empirical experience does seem to match Paul's. I
thought I had a reasonably good grasp of the sciences, and of physics in
particular, but I readily admit to being baffled by this phenomenon.
Anyone have another explanation? Perhaps it's just psychological???

See above, maybe?

snipped 4 BW
Here's the secret of the universe, just for you:

"Things Change"

Amazing how many miss the point.
Tom
maker of Fine sawdust and Thin shavings

Andy Dingley wrote in
:

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 03:09:55 GMT, Jim Wilson
wrote:

In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged.

"Friction is independent of area"

True for substances sufficiently hard not to deform under load. Of
which there are very few (one might think steel wheels on steel rails,
but even railroads have to deal with it).

John

On 12 Nov 2004 14:46:10 GMT, otforme (Charlie Self)
calmly ranted:

Larry Jaques responds:


This was gleaned from rec.crafts.metalworking and fits right in:

--snip--
As an explaination for the decline in the US's tech edge, James
Niccol wrote "It used to be that the USA was pretty good at
producing stuff teenaged boys could lose a finger or two playing
with."

Even as chicken as I've always been, I've come close a time or six. And when I
think of the set-up my grandfather had at his sawmill! Jeez, OSHA would have a
green-eyed **** fit. Big old open circular blade (no replaceable tips in those
days; sharpen with a file), on a belt from a stationary Model A (I think)
engine. The only guards in those days were inside banks keeping an eye on the
vaults.

OSHA and Lawyers are 2 main reasons we have so MANY total idiots
in our midst nowadays. Darwin woulda got 'em if OSHA hadn't taken
all the fun out of machinery, etc.


-------------------------------------------------
- Boldly going - * Wondrous Website Design
- nowhere. - * http://www.diversify.com
-------------------------------------------------

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 14:38:37 GMT, Michael Baglio
calmly ranted:

Damn the helmets _and_ the DDT. Full throttle.

Goodonya, Ace. We USAF kids used to chase the DDT-spraying skeeter
fogger trucks on LRAFB back in the 60s. We'd stay in the mist until
someone's mother came out and screamed at us.


-------------------------------------------------
- Boldly going - * Wondrous Website Design
- nowhere. - * http://www.diversify.com
-------------------------------------------------

otforme (Charlie Self) wrote in
:

snip
Things change, as someone else said.

I had a flash of insight, and appreciation, when, way too early this
morning I wondered what my predecessors did, before aspirin and Advil?

Gave me a whole new appreciation for what they accomplished...

Patriarch

"Swingman" wrote in message
...
"Charlie Self" wrote in message

Wrong diet, wrong surroundings, raised without electricity or running
water,
worked their butts off--I can remember one uncle stating (not
complaining)
that
his father didn't really care for kids (he had 13 born live) until they
were 8
or and could help on the farm, so the poor little kids had to actually
WORK for
their self-esteem.

Things change, as someone else said.

Yessir ... the shirt that I wore to the first day of school was made out
of
a flower sack, and the collar hung to the end of my shoulders, but my
Sears
Roebuck "Roy Rogers" sweat shirt, with the picture of Trigger reariing up,
made the whole thing "uptown".

... and now my kids can't be clothed without Abercrombie and Fitch, or a
trip to the Galleria.

My hat's off to anyone who, immediately after church, had to pick the
feathers off the Sunday dinner ... can you imagine a kid having to do that
to eat these days?

We were just too damn busy with living to get fat.

Naaaahhh! We did the chicken plucking Sat. night & let it "hang" overnight.

Flour sack towels! Split the side seams & hem them, stitch the top back
together to make an "endless" towel hung over a dowel in a bracket. Just
pull it around to a dry spot to use.

Got to pass on a personal story. I was about 6 or 7, Mom & I lived upstairs
over Grandpa & Grandma. He had an "egg route" in Jamestown 3 days a week.
Out back we had a good sized garden and a "brooder house" for chicks, plus 2
hen houses. Sometimes Gramp would let the chickens out in the Spring to pick
in the back yard. Mom sent me down with a pan of potato peelings, etc. to
give the chickens. I gave the stuff a fling to spread it around a little and
turned to go back to the house . . .that dam*ed Rhode Island Red rooster
went right up my back, scratching & clawing. I was screaming, Mom came down
& beat him off with a broom. Few days later he did the same thing when I
went in the henhouse to collect eggs. Gramp said to take big stick in and
"discuss his behavior" with him. We had about three "discussions" and he
decided he didn't want to bother me any more. He apparently transferred his
"affections" to Gramp, because about a week later, I saw the carcass hanging
under the back porch ceiling for dinner the next day.

He was tasty!
--
Nahmie
The law of intelligent tinkering: save all the parts.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote...

You also have the "vacuum" factor. (I'm sure there is a real term for it but
cannot think of it at the moment.) If you take two highly polished pieces of
metal, or sheets of glass, they tend to stick to each other.

I think the correct term is wringing or wringability. I've also heard
stiction used to mean this. IIRC, stiction is short for static friction.
Sorta makes sense.

Jim

Andy Dingley wrote...
We know the theory, but the practice is such that friction varies
considerably depending on surface condition and the overall area
involved.

In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in
practice, there is. Jan L.A. van de Snepscheut

Friction between plane soles and timber is complicated. It does vary,
I certainly don't understand why.

Me, neither. The deformability idea might have some merit. I just
wondered whether anyone had ever taken the time to seriously investigate
it.

Jim

On 12 Nov 2004 16:50:07 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 03:09:55 GMT, Jim Wilson wrote:
Edwin Pawlowski suggested...
The mirror finish will make for more friction as there is more surface
contact between the plane and the wood.

In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged. Since this constant normal force is now distributed
over a larger area, the force per unit area is lower. It can be shown
that the increase in friction from the larger contact area is exactly
offset by the decrease in friction due to the lower normal force per unit
area.

What about not being able to get air under the polished surface?
Jo blocks stick together rather well, I've always been told this is
due to the very smooth surfaces and absence of air (vacuum) between them.


If you are talking about gauge blocks, the physics is entirely different,
the blocks physically bind together. They are ground to a precision of
several tens of micro-inches -- there is actual molecular binding occuring
(at least as it was explained during sophomore physics lab). I doubt that
his the phenomena being observed with a plane and wood.

Nonetheless, my own empirical experience does seem to match Paul's. I
thought I had a reasonably good grasp of the sciences, and of physics in
particular, but I readily admit to being baffled by this phenomenon.
Anyone have another explanation? Perhaps it's just psychological???

See above, maybe?

Jim Wilson wrote:

Edwin Pawlowski wrote...

You also have the "vacuum" factor. (I'm sure there is a real term for it but
cannot think of it at the moment.) If you take two highly polished pieces of
metal, or sheets of glass, they tend to stick to each other.

I think the correct term is wringing or wringability. I've also heard
stiction used to mean this. IIRC, stiction is short for static friction.
Sorta makes sense.

If the two surfaces are sufficiently smooth, then there won't be
any (significant amount of) air between them. Atmospheric
pressure will hold them together.

I've heard that a pair of metal blocks so polished are called
"Johansen (sp?) Blocks".

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto, Iowa USA

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 21:48:44 -0600, Morris Dovey
wrote:

If the two surfaces are sufficiently smooth, then there won't be
any (significant amount of) air between them. Atmospheric
pressure will hold them together.

A quick experiment shows that you can get more than 15psi of force
retaining these blocks together. It's not just air pressure.

I've heard that a pair of metal blocks so polished are called
"Johansen (sp?) Blocks".

I think Johansen was one of the makers for sets of gauge blocks. The
name has probably become generic, like "Hoover".

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 03:09:55 GMT, Jim Wilson
wrote:

Edwin Pawlowski suggested...
The mirror finish will make for more friction as there is more surface
contact between the plane and the wood.

In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged. Since this constant normal force is now distributed
over a larger area, the force per unit area is lower. It can be shown
that the increase in friction from the larger contact area is exactly
offset by the decrease in friction due to the lower normal force per unit
area.

Nonetheless, my own empirical experience does seem to match Paul's. I
thought I had a reasonably good grasp of the sciences, and of physics in
particular, but I readily admit to being baffled by this phenomenon.
Anyone have another explanation? Perhaps it's just psychological???

Your arms aren't as tired from lapping the sole all day?

Jim

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 03:47:01 GMT, "Edwin Pawlowski"
wrote:


"Jim Wilson" wrote in message
In general, that is not the case. The greater contact area should not
increase the total friction because the total downward ("normal") force
remains unchanged. Since this constant normal force is now distributed
over a larger area, the force per unit area is lower. It can be shown
that the increase in friction from the larger contact area is exactly
offset by the decrease in friction due to the lower normal force per unit
area.

Nonetheless, my own empirical experience does seem to match Paul's. I
thought I had a reasonably good grasp of the sciences, and of physics in
particular, but I readily admit to being baffled by this phenomenon.
Anyone have another explanation? Perhaps it's just psychological???

Jim

You also have the "vacuum" factor. (I'm sure there is a real term for it but
cannot think of it at the moment.) If you take two highly polished pieces of
metal, or sheets of glass, they tend to stick to each other. OTOH, you can
usually slide them apart even if you can lift one away from the other.
Perhaps this is over riding what I think of as friction?

Cohesion is the term (the tendancy of like molicules to cling
together). But I'm guessing that what you're experiencing there is
not cohesion in the strictest sense of the word- it sounds more like
the water present in the general environment is collecting in small
quanities on your metal or glass, and the water's adhesive property is
what is holding the two pieces together. Friction is the force that
works against you when you slide the two pieces apart- not when you
pull them apart.

Aut inveniam viam aut faciam