Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young professionals.
Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools). Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

On Wednesday, January 27, 2016 at 11:34:40 AM UTC-6, Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young professionals.
Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools). Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

No doubt in my mind, it would be laminate. Today's laminates are not your parents style. They are affordable, the good stuff (stick with Formica brand, Wilsonart, and one more that they don't sell around here)and you will be very surprised at how extensive your decorative options are.

A few thoughts. Go to a real laminate or "countertop" company to get your product. However, no one beats the selection of colors and textures at the big box stores, so find your selections there and take them to the countertop guys. I would a provider and ask them which prefixes on the reference # indicate it is a premium or special order piece.

With the size of your island, you will need to have the top for that cabinet specially made if you stay with laminate. Flat work can be expensive, but again, if the tenants take any kind of care with it, the tops will wear like iron so it could be worth it to you. At any rate, you can get a quote from most of those places free as they bid by the universal inch, then add for the sink cut out.

Personally, for rent unit I wouldn't make a selection that had the hard, shiny finish like their faux granite patterns. While that looks great when installed, every little scratch shows. The more satin your reflective finish is the less wear it will show. I have a client that had me install the shiny, faux granite a couple of years ago and they love it, but they don't do things that could scratch it up.

I like the laminates because they provide great bang for the buck, and you aren't limited to solid colors and those awful butcher block colors that were in every tract home built for 25 years. The good news is that if something awful does happen to the top, if the pattern select is still made, the top can simply be replaced. Repair maintenance is always a big consideration with rental properties, no matter who the tenant might be.

Robert

Robert, thank you so much for your thoughtful comprehensive reply.
Ivan Vegvary

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance
and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young
professionals. Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools).
Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

You haven't gotten a lot of replies so I'll chime in too.

First of all, I pretty much agree with all Robert said about laminate. I
would also like to mention post formed counter tops. Those are the one with
integral back splash and rolled front edge. I have no idea about the
variety available and they are made on particle board but that would suffice
for other than wet areas.

There are two downsides to laminate...
1. There is normally a dak edge. Not terribly important and they used
to make "color through" laminate, don't know if they still do.

2. A hot pot can ruin it in a hurry. After all, it is paper & plastic.

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

1. It is pretty much impervious to anything. True, it can be broken but
one has to work at it

2. It is easy to do. Tiles that are 6x6 can work out well for normal
width countertops with minimal cutting. Ditto 12x12 and 4x4.

3. It can be cheaper than laminate. Here's a sampling from a good
supplier...
http://www.southcypress.com/Flooring...n-Bright-Matte

One problem with tile are the edges...they need to be finished in some
manner. The conventional way is with bullnose tiles, for which the
suppliers extract healthy sums. A good - and less expensive - alternative
is Schutler Rondec...
http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/...ONDEC/p/RONDEC

People have two complaints about tile...

1. It isn't flat. If it isn't flat it wasn't laid correctly. True, the
joints are slightly recessed but what does it matter?

2. The grout gets dirty. Answer is, don't use light grout. And seal
it.
__________________________________

You didn't indicate whether you intend to do the work yourself. If so, and
if you use tile, forget about diamond saws. An inexpensive ($30+-) score
and snap cutter will do a better job, especially on smooth tiles. Diamond
blades ALWAYS chip the edges; so do the score and snap but much less so and
what chipping there is is easily removed with a stone or even wet or dry
paper around a wood block which is also the way one removes the sharp edge.

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 16:16:34 -0500, "dadiOH"
wrote:

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance
and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young
professionals. Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools).
Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

You haven't gotten a lot of replies so I'll chime in too.

First of all, I pretty much agree with all Robert said about laminate. I
would also like to mention post formed counter tops. Those are the one with
integral back splash and rolled front edge. I have no idea about the
variety available and they are made on particle board but that would suffice
for other than wet areas.

There are two downsides to laminate...
1. There is normally a dak edge. Not terribly important and they used
to make "color through" laminate, don't know if they still do.

2. A hot pot can ruin it in a hurry. After all, it is paper & plastic.

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

1. It is pretty much impervious to anything. True, it can be broken but
one has to work at it

2. It is easy to do. Tiles that are 6x6 can work out well for normal
width countertops with minimal cutting. Ditto 12x12 and 4x4.

3. It can be cheaper than laminate. Here's a sampling from a good
supplier...
http://www.southcypress.com/Flooring...n-Bright-Matte

One problem with tile are the edges...they need to be finished in some
manner. The conventional way is with bullnose tiles, for which the
suppliers extract healthy sums. A good - and less expensive - alternative
is Schutler Rondec...
http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/...ONDEC/p/RONDEC

People have two complaints about tile...

1. It isn't flat. If it isn't flat it wasn't laid correctly. True, the
joints are slightly recessed but what does it matter?

2. The grout gets dirty. Answer is, don't use light grout. And seal
it.
__________________________________

You didn't indicate whether you intend to do the work yourself. If so, and
if you use tile, forget about diamond saws. An inexpensive ($30+-) score
and snap cutter will do a better job, especially on smooth tiles. Diamond
blades ALWAYS chip the edges; so do the score and snap but much less so and
what chipping there is is easily removed with a stone or even wet or dry
paper around a wood block which is also the way one removes the sharp edge.


I disagree 100%. Tile is the *wrong* surface for a kitchen. Even if
you seal it, grout is porous (it won't stay sealed forever) and is a
great breeding ground for bacteria. It would be a big strike against
a rental, IMO.

I much prefer granite over any other surface but understand why a
landlord wouldn't want to spring for it. However, I think it depends
on the unit. If it's an upscale rental, it has to have an upscale
kitchen. Otherwise, I think laminate is best. If necessary it can be
replaced between tenants.

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:45:17 -0500, krw wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 16:16:34 -0500, "dadiOH"
wrote:

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance
and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young
professionals. Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools).
Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

You haven't gotten a lot of replies so I'll chime in too.

First of all, I pretty much agree with all Robert said about laminate. I
would also like to mention post formed counter tops. Those are the one with
integral back splash and rolled front edge. I have no idea about the
variety available and they are made on particle board but that would suffice
for other than wet areas.

There are two downsides to laminate...
1. There is normally a dak edge. Not terribly important and they used
to make "color through" laminate, don't know if they still do.

2. A hot pot can ruin it in a hurry. After all, it is paper & plastic.

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

1. It is pretty much impervious to anything. True, it can be broken but
one has to work at it

2. It is easy to do. Tiles that are 6x6 can work out well for normal
width countertops with minimal cutting. Ditto 12x12 and 4x4.

3. It can be cheaper than laminate. Here's a sampling from a good
supplier...
http://www.southcypress.com/Flooring...n-Bright-Matte

One problem with tile are the edges...they need to be finished in some
manner. The conventional way is with bullnose tiles, for which the
suppliers extract healthy sums. A good - and less expensive - alternative
is Schutler Rondec...
http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/...ONDEC/p/RONDEC

People have two complaints about tile...

1. It isn't flat. If it isn't flat it wasn't laid correctly. True, the
joints are slightly recessed but what does it matter?

2. The grout gets dirty. Answer is, don't use light grout. And seal
it.
__________________________________

You didn't indicate whether you intend to do the work yourself. If so, and
if you use tile, forget about diamond saws. An inexpensive ($30+-) score
and snap cutter will do a better job, especially on smooth tiles. Diamond
blades ALWAYS chip the edges; so do the score and snap but much less so and
what chipping there is is easily removed with a stone or even wet or dry
paper around a wood block which is also the way one removes the sharp edge.


I disagree 100%. Tile is the *wrong* surface for a kitchen. Even if
you seal it, grout is porous (it won't stay sealed forever) and is a
great breeding ground for bacteria. It would be a big strike against
a rental, IMO.

I much prefer granite over any other surface but understand why a
landlord wouldn't want to spring for it. However, I think it depends
on the unit. If it's an upscale rental, it has to have an upscale
kitchen. Otherwise, I think laminate is best. If necessary it can be
replaced between tenants.

What about the solid tops that are supposedly able to be handled by
normal tools? (although for jointing I think it might require a
special tool to make it seamless)

On Thursday, January 28, 2016 at 3:16:42 PM UTC-6, dadiOH wrote:

First of all, I pretty much agree with all Robert said about laminate. I
would also like to mention post formed counter tops. Those are the one with
integral back splash and rolled front edge. I have no idea about the
variety available and they are made on particle board but that would suffice
for other than wet areas.

To mention it is to undercut its value. That is exactly the product I was talking about, but didn't have the sense to say it. I like the post formed, and now with the different styles of rolled edges, including wood edge, you can get some nice looking stuff. All of the post formed laminates are bonded to medium density particle board, and it works fine as you pointed out.

There are two downsides to laminate...
1. There is normally a dak edge. Not terribly important and they used
to make "color through" laminate, don't know if they still do.

I don't know if they make that stuff anymore or not. I remember it, but never used it anywhere as it was nasty expensive and no one would pay for it. The good news is that darker counter colors are in style, so with the last kitchen I did that had dark laminate, I found the side benefit was that you couldn't see the joints.

2. A hot pot can ruin it in a hurry. After all, it is paper & plastic.

Ahh... those were the days. I did well 30 years ago with a cutting board called a "counter saver". Folks would set down a hot pan, something that would stain the surface, or damage it in some way and I would cut out the damage and install a cutting board. I found a source for a board that had a rabbet around the underside perimeter and a little piece of hardware to be used to pick the board up from the top to wash it. The rabbet allowed the board to sink securely to about 1/2 its thickness, but be easily removable for cleaning.

Today's laminates are much more heat resistive, but you are right, a hot pan will damage them in seconds with no problem.

I guess the biggest thing I have seen as an improvement to the laminates besides all the new colors and patterns is that the surfaces are harder, and MUCH more stain resistant. I wouldn't know how to measure how much more, but the better grades are really great at laughing off fruit juices and coffee. Of course, the shinier the finish, the more stain resistant they will be.

Robert

Ivan Vegvary was heard to mutter:

Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young professionals.
Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools). Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

Casper wrote:
Ivan Vegvary was heard to mutter:

Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance
and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young
professionals. Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools).
Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

Not particularly because...

1. You can't buy Corian sheet stock to fabricate yourself unless you go to
Corian scholl (and are a licensed contractor?). Don't know about other man
made products.

2. It (all) are relatively expensive.

3. All are various minerals with a plastic - usually acrylic - binder;
therefore, heat sensitive and subject to scratching, some more, some less

Not the stuff for a rental IMO..

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 18:50:26 -0800, OFWW wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:45:17 -0500, krw wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 16:16:34 -0500, "dadiOH"
wrote:

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance
and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young
professionals. Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools).
Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

You haven't gotten a lot of replies so I'll chime in too.

First of all, I pretty much agree with all Robert said about laminate. I
would also like to mention post formed counter tops. Those are the one with
integral back splash and rolled front edge. I have no idea about the
variety available and they are made on particle board but that would suffice
for other than wet areas.

There are two downsides to laminate...
1. There is normally a dak edge. Not terribly important and they used
to make "color through" laminate, don't know if they still do.

2. A hot pot can ruin it in a hurry. After all, it is paper & plastic.

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

1. It is pretty much impervious to anything. True, it can be broken but
one has to work at it

2. It is easy to do. Tiles that are 6x6 can work out well for normal
width countertops with minimal cutting. Ditto 12x12 and 4x4.

3. It can be cheaper than laminate. Here's a sampling from a good
supplier...
http://www.southcypress.com/Flooring...n-Bright-Matte

One problem with tile are the edges...they need to be finished in some
manner. The conventional way is with bullnose tiles, for which the
suppliers extract healthy sums. A good - and less expensive - alternative
is Schutler Rondec...
http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/...ONDEC/p/RONDEC

People have two complaints about tile...

1. It isn't flat. If it isn't flat it wasn't laid correctly. True, the
joints are slightly recessed but what does it matter?

2. The grout gets dirty. Answer is, don't use light grout. And seal
it.
__________________________________

You didn't indicate whether you intend to do the work yourself. If so, and
if you use tile, forget about diamond saws. An inexpensive ($30+-) score
and snap cutter will do a better job, especially on smooth tiles. Diamond
blades ALWAYS chip the edges; so do the score and snap but much less so and
what chipping there is is easily removed with a stone or even wet or dry
paper around a wood block which is also the way one removes the sharp edge.


I disagree 100%. Tile is the *wrong* surface for a kitchen. Even if
you seal it, grout is porous (it won't stay sealed forever) and is a
great breeding ground for bacteria. It would be a big strike against
a rental, IMO.

I much prefer granite over any other surface but understand why a
landlord wouldn't want to spring for it. However, I think it depends
on the unit. If it's an upscale rental, it has to have an upscale
kitchen. Otherwise, I think laminate is best. If necessary it can be
replaced between tenants.

What about the solid tops that are supposedly able to be handled by
normal tools? (although for jointing I think it might require a
special tool to make it seamless)

Not sure what materials you're talking about but I'd be afraid of them
being too soft. I like "quartz" tops as well as granite but (I think)
they're even more expensive. Corian I wouldn't have (in the kitchen)
if they gave it away.

On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 12:05:53 PM UTC-6, dadiOH wrote:

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

Not particularly because...

1. You can't buy Corian sheet stock to fabricate yourself unless you go to
Corian scholl (and are a licensed contractor?). Don't know about other man
made products.

2. It (all) are relatively expensive.

3. All are various minerals with a plastic - usually acrylic - binder;
therefore, heat sensitive and subject to scratching, some more, some less

Not the stuff for a rental IMO..

Exactly what he said. Just add in not very stain resistant in the lighter colors and you have the whole picture.

Robert

"dadiOH" wrote in :

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

Without getting into the good idea/bad idea question, I
am curious what you'd recommend as a substrate to put
the tile on.

John

On 2016-01-29 2:44 PM, John McCoy wrote:
"dadiOH" wrote in :

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

Without getting into the good idea/bad idea question, I
am curious what you'd recommend as a substrate to put
the tile on.

Anything but cement board is a waste of time, but do use a good quality
grout.


--
Froz...

Quando omni flunkus, moritati

John McCoy wrote:
"dadiOH" wrote in
:

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

Without getting into the good idea/bad idea question, I
am curious what you'd recommend as a substrate to put
the tile on.

John

If bonding with mastic, 3/4" ply. If with thinset, the same + 1/4" or1/2"
cement board. I prefer 1/4".

Some will say you GOTTA use cement board. Well,one upon a time it didn't
exist and mastic over ply was a norm. My tiled kitchen counters are now 20
years old...they are mastic on ply and none have ever popped.

On 1/29/2016 2:51 PM, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 2016-01-29 2:44 PM, John McCoy wrote:
"dadiOH" wrote in :

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

Without getting into the good idea/bad idea question, I
am curious what you'd recommend as a substrate to put
the tile on.

Anything but cement board is a waste of time, but do use a good quality
grout.


I'd not use tile on a counter, but I I did, it would be epoxy grout.
I've heard there are not urethane grouts too.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 11:12:08 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 12:05:53 PM UTC-6, dadiOH wrote:

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

Not particularly because...

1. You can't buy Corian sheet stock to fabricate yourself unless you go to
Corian scholl (and are a licensed contractor?). Don't know about other man
made products.

2. It (all) are relatively expensive.

3. All are various minerals with a plastic - usually acrylic - binder;
therefore, heat sensitive and subject to scratching, some more, some less

Not the stuff for a rental IMO..

Exactly what he said. Just add in not very stain resistant in the lighter colors and you have the whole picture.


Wondering if any one has a poured in place concrete counter top?
Thoughts and opinions about are of course encouraged.

On 1/29/2016 11:24 AM, Casper wrote:
Ivan Vegvary was heard to mutter:

Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young professionals.
Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools). Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

I cause many many kitchen counter and bath vanity tops to be put in,
lots of them.

I have to go with what the client prefers, which these days is a toss up
between granite and quartz.

My personal preference the past few years is quartz. AAMOF, put quartz
in my own lake house kitchen this past year, which is a rental property.

The trend these past few years in multi-million dollar homes, and high
dollar kitchens, has tended to shy away from the 1 1/2" bull nosed
granite, to thinner, quartz (3/4 to 5/4) counter tops.

Often with laminate, or glass mosaic tile, backsplashes.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 13:07:25 -0500, krw wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 18:50:26 -0800, OFWW wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:45:17 -0500, krw wrote:

On Thu, 28 Jan 2016 16:16:34 -0500, "dadiOH"
wrote:

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance
and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young
professionals. Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools).
Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

You haven't gotten a lot of replies so I'll chime in too.

First of all, I pretty much agree with all Robert said about laminate. I
would also like to mention post formed counter tops. Those are the one with
integral back splash and rolled front edge. I have no idea about the
variety available and they are made on particle board but that would suffice
for other than wet areas.

There are two downsides to laminate...
1. There is normally a dak edge. Not terribly important and they used
to make "color through" laminate, don't know if they still do.

2. A hot pot can ruin it in a hurry. After all, it is paper & plastic.

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

1. It is pretty much impervious to anything. True, it can be broken but
one has to work at it

2. It is easy to do. Tiles that are 6x6 can work out well for normal
width countertops with minimal cutting. Ditto 12x12 and 4x4.

3. It can be cheaper than laminate. Here's a sampling from a good
supplier...
http://www.southcypress.com/Flooring...n-Bright-Matte

One problem with tile are the edges...they need to be finished in some
manner. The conventional way is with bullnose tiles, for which the
suppliers extract healthy sums. A good - and less expensive - alternative
is Schutler Rondec...
http://www.schluter.com/schluter-us/...ONDEC/p/RONDEC

People have two complaints about tile...

1. It isn't flat. If it isn't flat it wasn't laid correctly. True, the
joints are slightly recessed but what does it matter?

2. The grout gets dirty. Answer is, don't use light grout. And seal
it.
__________________________________

You didn't indicate whether you intend to do the work yourself. If so, and
if you use tile, forget about diamond saws. An inexpensive ($30+-) score
and snap cutter will do a better job, especially on smooth tiles. Diamond
blades ALWAYS chip the edges; so do the score and snap but much less so and
what chipping there is is easily removed with a stone or even wet or dry
paper around a wood block which is also the way one removes the sharp edge.


I disagree 100%. Tile is the *wrong* surface for a kitchen. Even if
you seal it, grout is porous (it won't stay sealed forever) and is a
great breeding ground for bacteria. It would be a big strike against
a rental, IMO.

I much prefer granite over any other surface but understand why a
landlord wouldn't want to spring for it. However, I think it depends
on the unit. If it's an upscale rental, it has to have an upscale
kitchen. Otherwise, I think laminate is best. If necessary it can be
replaced between tenants.

What about the solid tops that are supposedly able to be handled by
normal tools? (although for jointing I think it might require a
special tool to make it seamless)

Not sure what materials you're talking about but I'd be afraid of them
being too soft. I like "quartz" tops as well as granite but (I think)
they're even more expensive. Corian I wouldn't have (in the kitchen)
if they gave it away.

They are something along the lines like this
http://www.todayshomeowner.com/video...ertops/#tabs-1

A couple weeks ago I was looking to see what options there are and
several "solid tops" were installable by anyone with the ability to
use tools.

I haven't done any serious looking yet as I am concentrating on
cabinet design. I have it all laid out in my head, and it would
probably be faster if I just laid it out on paper, but I am using
SketchPro and have a lot of loose ends to get into sync.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 19:44:20 -0000 (UTC), John McCoy
wrote:

"dadiOH" wrote in :

A viable alternative to laminate - IMO - is tile. There are several
reasons...

Without getting into the good idea/bad idea question, I
am curious what you'd recommend as a substrate to put
the tile on.

Hardi-backer screwed to ply, with thinset on both sides of of the HB.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 12:24:27 -0500, Casper
wrote:

Ivan Vegvary was heard to mutter:

Finishing daughter's basement rental.
What materials are advised for counter tops that are low maintenance and good life? This is a rental. Tenants probably young professionals.
Sink in 4'x5' island with seating around. (Stools). Remaining counter tops are prep areas along the wall.
Thank you!

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

For a bathroom, perhaps. It's too soft for kitchens.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 16:27:11 -0600, Markem
wrote:

On Fri, 29 Jan 2016 11:12:08 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 12:05:53 PM UTC-6, dadiOH wrote:

No one likes Corian or other similar surfaces?

Not particularly because...

1. You can't buy Corian sheet stock to fabricate yourself unless you go to
Corian scholl (and are a licensed contractor?). Don't know about other man
made products.

2. It (all) are relatively expensive.

3. All are various minerals with a plastic - usually acrylic - binder;
therefore, heat sensitive and subject to scratching, some more, some less

Not the stuff for a rental IMO..

Exactly what he said. Just add in not very stain resistant in the lighter colors and you have the whole picture.


Wondering if any one has a poured in place concrete counter top?
Thoughts and opinions about are of course encouraged.

Not for a kitchen but I did a ~2z3' x2" mantle sort of thing with
marble tile on a concrete slab. The flue from a wood stove passed
about an inch underneath and I couldn't think of another material that
would take the heat.

On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 4:26:31 PM UTC-6, Markem wrote:

Wondering if any one has a poured in place concrete counter top?
Thoughts and opinions about are of course encouraged.

Locally, I have had a couple of folks I know try this. Not incompetent people, both have some skills.

Here's my take. Impossible for them to get the tops dead flat. Anyone using cutting boards or large bowls will get the meaning of that. They used a specialized concrete mixed for this application (I didn't even know there was one...) and it was difficult to work. I looked at it, and to me it looked like about a 3500psi mix with #2 sand as aggregate. It was difficult for them to work and smooth. Cure strength was that of regular concrete, 21 days before active, regular use. The top developed spider cracks (normal for concrete) well before that.

There are sealers to be used, but non are hard enough to give an abrasion resistant, washable surface that will last without renewal. One reported back to me that he sealed with a urethane sealer and it had a reaction to the concrete and started to amber. He also told me that he didn't like the look of the sealed product. So he sanded the top, and painted it with epoxy garage floor coating. A hard finish no doubt, but the end product looks like painted wood/concrete/plywood/crap and he is completely unhappy. However, at this point he doesn't want to tear it out because of his huge commitment to the process and the mess it will make in his house.

Amigo #2 was advised to use some kind of oil/paraffin sealer, and it gave no protection. He colored the concrete and gave it some shading, but as with amigo #1 it didn't look anything like the stuff they show on TV. His cracked a bit as well, but he liked the rustic look. He poured his backsplash in place and of course it cracked all along the backsplash to top detail, so it has an ugly caulk line. The oil finish looked OK, but he found out via his 8 year old that it wasn't the slightest bit stain resistant to Koolaid. It isn't the slightest bit abrasion resistant. He found that if he sets a hot pan on the oiled concrete it leaves a ring where the oil reacts to the heat.

He is going to break all of his out and have me put laminate in and be done with it. He worked on that project for about 3 weeks and had money in prep, shoring up the cabinets, materials, all his labor, the inability to use the kithen for a couple of weeks, and now complete frustration and unhappiness. My cost for the laminate he wanted was $800, and at this time I think he would pay triple that to make it go away.

Robert

wrote:
On Friday, January 29, 2016 at 4:26:31 PM UTC-6, Markem wrote:

Wondering if any one has a poured in place concrete counter top?
Thoughts and opinions about are of course encouraged.
Locally, I have had a couple of folks I know try this. Not incompetent people, both have some skills.

Here's my take. Impossible for them to get the tops dead flat. Anyone using cutting boards or large bowls will get the meaning of that. They used a specialized concrete mixed for this application (I didn't even know there was one...) and it was difficult to work. I looked at it, and to me it looked like about a 3500psi mix with #2 sand as aggregate. It was difficult for them to work and smooth. Cure strength was that of regular concrete, 21 days before active, regular use. The top developed spider cracks (normal for concrete) well before that.

There are sealers to be used, but non are hard enough to give an abrasion resistant, washable surface that will last without renewal. One reported back to me that he sealed with a urethane sealer and it had a reaction to the concrete and started to amber. He also told me that he didn't like the look of the sealed product. So he sanded the top, and painted it with epoxy garage floor coating. A hard finish no doubt, but the end product looks like painted wood/concrete/plywood/crap and he is completely unhappy. However, at this point he doesn't want to tear it out because of his huge commitment to the process and the mess it will make in his house.

Amigo #2 was advised to use some kind of oil/paraffin sealer, and it gave no protection. He colored the concrete and gave it some shading, but as with amigo #1 it didn't look anything like the stuff they show on TV. His cracked a bit as well, but he liked the rustic look. He poured his backsplash in place and of course it cracked all along the backsplash to top detail, so it has an ugly caulk line. The oil finish looked OK, but he found out via his 8 year old that it wasn't the slightest bit stain resistant to Koolaid. It isn't the slightest bit abrasion resistant. He found that if he sets a hot pan on the oiled concrete it leaves a ring where the oil reacts to the heat.

He is going to break all of his out and have me put laminate in and be done with it. He worked on that project for about 3 weeks and had money in prep, shoring up the cabinets, materials, all his labor, the inability to use the kithen for a couple of weeks, and now complete frustration and unhappiness. My cost for the laminate he wanted was $800, and at this time I think he would pay triple that to make it go away.

At least give him enough for a beer on me--it was a good story!

Bill


Robert

On 1/28/16 2:16 PM, dadiOH wrote:

People have two complaints about tile...

1. It isn't flat. If it isn't flat it wasn't laid correctly. True, the
joints are slightly recessed but what does it matter?

2. The grout gets dirty. Answer is, don't use light grout. And seal
it.
__________________________________


For #2 I always use epoxy grout. It's impervious to staining and lasts
forever. Problems are limited colors and it tends to have a glossy
appearance, it also is like smearing warm bubblegum around when applying.


-BR

On Wed, 27 Jan 2016 09:34:30 -0800 (PST)
Ivan Vegvary wrote:

Finishing daughter's basement rental.

you finished the gear shift knob then i guess