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On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote:
Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! -- Make awkward sexual advances, not war. |
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Larry Jaques wrote in
: On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... -- Best regards Han email address is invalid |
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On 8/15/2012 5:43 AM, Jack wrote:
On 8/14/2012 11:39 AM, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/13/2012 2:31 PM, Han wrote: I find it funny that those who say that voter fraud is rampant never seem to be able to get a link to established facts. Please read this and you may be enlightened to why you don't get any "established facts". Sorry Han, I somehow left out the link to what I wanted you to read. http://tinyurl.com/3dv729h Please read it, and perhaps you will get an inkling as to what sort of corruption is going on, and has been going on in this country. It is difficult to establish "facts" if you can't get the wolves to investigate their own duplicity. The facts that are "established" as in court convictions are not reported much in the lame stream media. If voter fraud is so rampant, surely you can find some convictions ... A simple google search will turn up a bunch. 113 were convicted just in Minnesota since the last election, and if you read the article I posted, you should be totally amazed anyone ever gets convicted of voter fraud. The freaking politicians make it almost impossible to uncover the fraud, and when it is, the refuse to do anything about it. Acorn has had a slew of crooks convicted of voter fraud, but again, it is totally amazing that anyone ever gets convicted, considering the politicians do everything in their power to ignore what is going on, and generally refuse to do anything about it when thrown in their face, as the above referenced article clearly addresses. That would be turning their backs on their constituents. There's no way they would do that. |
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On 8/15/2012 6:13 AM, Jack wrote:
On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... I've read the federal statute. It is not a crime to enter the country illegally. The consequences are all civil, not criminal. For example, an illegal alien can be deported, but without more cannot be sentenced to a prison term. |
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Larry Jaques wrote:
I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! |
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On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... Who is John Galt? basilisk |
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"Mike Marlow" wrote: You are being an ass Larry. ------------------------------------ Just doing what comes naturally. Lew |
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On 8/15/2012 12:20 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. There's a geographical disconnect on that comparison. Most of the unemployed live in cities. Most of the agricultural jobs are out in the country. There's no easy way physically for the urban unemployed to get to and from the fields. But without illegal aliens doing the low-paying urban jobs (fast food, janitorial, etc.), the urban unemployed could take those jobs. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! |
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On 8/15/2012 12:22 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote: 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. Either you don't know a damned thing about unemployment, or things must run very differently out there than they do here in NY. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Yeah - sounds good to spout that kind of **** when you are talking about other people. You are being an ass Larry. What is your proposal? Do you have some other means to induce those folk to find productive work? If so, how would you do it? If not, do you propose to force Larry and me through our taxes to support those people indefinitely while they sit home and watch TV all day? |
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Just Wondering writes:
On 8/15/2012 12:22 PM, Mike Marlow wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. Either you don't know a damned thing about unemployment, or things must run very differently out there than they do here in NY. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Yeah - sounds good to spout that kind of **** when you are talking about other people. You are being an ass Larry. What is your proposal? Do you have some other means to induce those folk to find productive work? You seem to be under the somewhat mistaken assumption that "those folk" aren't doing everything in their power to _find_ work. If so, how would you do it? If not, do you propose to force Larry and me through our taxes to support those people indefinitely while they sit home and watch TV all day? You've a seriously warped understanding of the unemployed. You also seem to be unaware of the fact that unemployment insurance is not indefinite, nor is welfare. You seem to be one of the lucky ones that hasn't lost a job and found it difficult to find another. My SO sells capital medical equipment to hospitals and clinics (MRI, CT, XRay, etc). She lost her job over 18 months ago now[*], and cannot find another in that field, in general medical device sales, or in other non-related sales opportunities. She spends 6 to 8 hours daily responding to want-ads, on-line resume farms, every medical device company in the western half of the US, and is frankly miserable about the whole thing. Telling someone who has spent 20 years in medical device sales to go pick tomatoes is the type of republican lack of respect for the individual that is characteristic of the modern republican politician. [*] company went out of business. |
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On 8/15/2012 1:37 PM, basilisk wrote:
I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... Who is John Galt? basilisk Appropriate question... |
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Han wrote:
Yes it would get much more expensive. Much more equitable to the workers as well. And I would be hugely in favor of legalizing immigrant workers, of course with some regulation. That's how I got here after all. Fill out the paperwork ... +1 -- www.ewoodshop.com |
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On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 14:20:13 -0400, "Mike Marlow"
wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Basically I agree with you, but hopefully some fairness should apply. Try to put yourself in their situation. Some traumatic medical condition has left you unable to do your former job, is it fair to go make you pick crops for minimum wage. I don't see a lot of us on this group surviving many days of agricultural work at our age. Mike M Mike M |
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Just Wondering wrote:
On 8/15/2012 12:20 PM, Mike Marlow wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. There's a geographical disconnect on that comparison. Most of the unemployed live in cities. Most of the agricultural jobs are out in the country. There's no easy way physically for the urban unemployed to get to and from the fields. Correct - but that's only because most of the population is centered in and around cities. I contend that even in rural areas, where unemployment is high, there are not lines of people trying to get that kind of job. But without illegal aliens doing the low-paying urban jobs (fast food, janitorial, etc.), the urban unemployed could take those jobs. Could - yes. Would - I believe... not so much. Part of the reason that those illegals can get those jobs is because legals here did not take them. -- -Mike- |
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Just Wondering wrote:
On 8/15/2012 12:22 PM, Mike Marlow wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. Either you don't know a damned thing about unemployment, or things must run very differently out there than they do here in NY. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Yeah - sounds good to spout that kind of **** when you are talking about other people. You are being an ass Larry. What is your proposal? Do you have some other means to induce those folk to find productive work? If so, how would you do it? If not, do you propose to force Larry and me through our taxes to support those people indefinitely while they sit home and watch TV all day? You and Larry? I pay those same taxes so I am as burdened by it as you. It is easy to say that someone else should take any job at any pay rate, when you are talking about someone else. Even easier when one says that from a position where they are comfortable with what they are earning. That however, does not take into consideration the very real financial needs of people. There are tens of thousands of people who are out there looking for any kind of decent work after having lost good paying jobs. People at all levels. To just say they should take any minumum wage job is a bit presumptuous. Sit home and watch TV all day? I'm sure there is some percentage of the unemployed population that does just that, but there is a huge population of unemployed who were very successful, contributing members of society. Do you really understand what the unemployed roles even look like today? -- -Mike- |
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Mike M wrote:
On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 14:20:13 -0400, "Mike Marlow" wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Basically I agree with you, but hopefully some fairness should apply. Try to put yourself in their situation. Some traumatic medical condition has left you unable to do your former job, is it fair to go make you pick crops for minimum wage. I don't see a lot of us on this group surviving many days of agricultural work at our age. The only problem with agreeing with Larry's point is that there is no such thing as unlimited unemployment checks. Sounds good if you want to close with a statement like "Get 'em off their asses", but it's only rhetorical. Those two sentences only serve to show a lack of understanding for what the world of the unemployed really looks like today. -- -Mike- |
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On 8/15/2012 4:33 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Just Wondering wrote: On 8/15/2012 12:20 PM, Mike Marlow wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. There's a geographical disconnect on that comparison. Most of the unemployed live in cities. Most of the agricultural jobs are out in the country. There's no easy way physically for the urban unemployed to get to and from the fields. Correct - but that's only because most of the population is centered in and around cities. I contend that even in rural areas, where unemployment is high, there are not lines of people trying to get that kind of job. But without illegal aliens doing the low-paying urban jobs (fast food, janitorial, etc.), the urban unemployed could take those jobs. Could - yes. Would - I believe... not so much. Part of the reason that those illegals can get those jobs is because legals here did not take them. That's a result of supply and demand. If the crops had to come in, and the illegals were not there to do the job, farmers would have to pay what the market demanded for their labor costs. Which would make your and my grocery bill that much higher, but that's another story. |
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On 8/15/2012 7:42 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
That's a result of supply and demand. If the crops had to come in, and the illegals were not there to do the job, farmers would have to pay what the market demanded for their labor costs. Which would make your and my grocery bill that much higher, but that's another story. No, actually that's the entire story in a nut shell. |
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On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 18:42:32 -0600, Just Wondering
That's a result of supply and demand. If the crops had to come in, and the illegals were not there to do the job, farmers would have to pay what the market demanded for their labor costs. Which would make your and my grocery bill that much higher, but that's another story. And worse than that, a number of those farmers might go out of business because they couldn't make enough profit ~ resulting in even higher prices for the consumer. |
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On 8/15/12 8:01 PM, Dave wrote:
On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 18:42:32 -0600, Just Wondering That's a result of supply and demand. If the crops had to come in, and the illegals were not there to do the job, farmers would have to pay what the market demanded for their labor costs. Which would make your and my grocery bill that much higher, but that's another story. And worse than that, a number of those farmers might go out of business because they couldn't make enough profit ~ resulting in even higher prices for the consumer. They already don't make enough money which is why we subsidize them. I don't know about you, but I don't need a artificially low priced can of corn. We're paying the higher price already, through our taxes, so why not just pay a buck a can and lower our taxes. Oh that's right, once the government takes your money, there's no going back. -- -MIKE- "Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life" --Elvin Jones (1927-2004) -- http://mikedrums.com ---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply |
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Just Wondering wrote:
That's a result of supply and demand. If the crops had to come in, and the illegals were not there to do the job, farmers would have to pay what the market demanded for their labor costs. Which would make your and my grocery bill that much higher, but that's another story. Agreed on that point, but that is a different scenario. It's not what exists now. So - while we agree on what you say above, it's a bit removed from what we were previously discussing. -- -Mike- |
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On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. Did you mean Georgia? The farmers should have known that was coming and made sure they had workers lined up beforehand, don't you think? Or, if the state gov't pushed the deadline or hit them without warning, they should have helped find workers for the farmers, don't you think? I'm thinking the two groups bent -themselves- over this time. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... That's just it. Unemployment isn't running out. Some people have been on it for over three years, Han! I think that after whatever the initial run is (I think it was 13 weeks when I last used it, back in the '70s) and the unemployed person hasn't found work, they should be forced to take whatever job IS available in their town, at their unemployment office. If the wages are less than their unemployment check (usually for very highly paid people), maybe cover the difference? But the unemployment office isn't forcing anything. That should change. Forcing unearned money on people isn't good for anyone involved: Not the worker, not the EDD office, and not the taxpayers. -- Make awkward sexual advances, not war. |
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On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 15:32:37 -0700, Mike M
wrote: On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 14:20:13 -0400, "Mike Marlow" wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Basically I agree with you, but hopefully some fairness should apply. Try to put yourself in their situation. Some traumatic medical condition has left you unable to do your former job, is it fair to go make you pick crops for minimum wage. I don't see a lot of us on this group surviving many days of agricultural work at our age. You totally overlooked my qualification there. I said "which they qualify for", meaning that neither you 90 year olds nor the 1-legged folks have to pick cotton...much. -- Make awkward sexual advances, not war. |
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Larry Jaques wrote in
: On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote: Larry Jaques wrote in m: On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. Did you mean Georgia? The farmers should have known that was coming and made sure they had workers lined up beforehand, don't you think? Or, if the state gov't pushed the deadline or hit them without warning, they should have helped find workers for the farmers, don't you think? I'm thinking the two groups bent -themselves- over this time. Alabama. This is a site that promotes the law that says you have to be legal grin and led to the harvesting problems http://www.alipac.us/f12/ala-governo...eting-illegal- immigrants-257760/ 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... That's just it. Unemployment isn't running out. Some people have been on it for over three years, Han! I think that after whatever the initial run is (I think it was 13 weeks when I last used it, back in the '70s) and the unemployed person hasn't found work, they should be forced to take whatever job IS available in their town, at their unemployment office. If the wages are less than their unemployment check (usually for very highly paid people), maybe cover the difference? But the unemployment office isn't forcing anything. That should change. Forcing unearned money on people isn't good for anyone involved: Not the worker, not the EDD office, and not the taxpayers. I'm not familiar with all the laws about unemployment, especially since they seem to change often in terms of time periods covered. The problem is not unemployment compensation in general, but the way the US (in general) fails to generate employment and educational opportunities, especially when the economy turns sour. I think that covering the difference between previous high wages and the lower wages in current opportunities has been considered in some places. But that can get dicey very fast, especially in the middle income ranges. Example: Your previous job had generous benefits and pension arrangements, but you were RIF'ed. There is a new job somewhere else, but at 60% of your previous wages, with less benefits and pension arrangements. If you do take that, not only will you have to really limit your expenditures (including probably selling your house at a moment it isn't advantageous), but your resume will show that precipitous decrease. Not good for the next job. Maybe that scenario isn't too important for farm workers and others, but it is a very important point to a large portion of currently unemployed middle income people. -- Best regards Han email address is invalid |
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On 15 Aug 2012 21:46:57 GMT, Scott Lurndal wrote:
Just Wondering writes: On 8/15/2012 12:22 PM, Mike Marlow wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. Either you don't know a damned thing about unemployment, or things must run very differently out there than they do here in NY. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! Yeah - sounds good to spout that kind of **** when you are talking about other people. You are being an ass Larry. What is your proposal? Do you have some other means to induce those folk to find productive work? You seem to be under the somewhat mistaken assumption that "those folk" aren't doing everything in their power to _find_ work. If so, how would you do it? If not, do you propose to force Larry and me through our taxes to support those people indefinitely while they sit home and watch TV all day? You've a seriously warped understanding of the unemployed. You also seem to be unaware of the fact that unemployment insurance is not indefinite, nor is welfare. You seem to be one of the lucky ones that hasn't lost a job and found it difficult to find another. My SO sells capital medical equipment to hospitals and clinics (MRI, CT, XRay, etc). She lost her job over 18 months ago now[*], and cannot find another in that field, in general medical device sales, or in other non-related sales opportunities. She spends 6 to 8 hours daily responding to want-ads, on-line resume farms, every medical device company in the western half of the US, and is frankly miserable about the whole thing. Telling someone who has spent 20 years in medical device sales to go pick tomatoes is the type of republican lack of respect for the individual that is characteristic of the modern republican politician. [*] company went out of business. Picking tomatoes is honorable work that pays real dollars. basilisk |
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On 08/15/2012 10:47 AM, Han wrote:
" wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them It wouldn't cease at all. It might get more expensive, or, *perhaps* Congress could come up with some great idea to allow *legal* seasonal workers. Legalizing and regulating; what a concept. Nah, then it would be too hard to get them to vote. Yes it would get much more expensive. Much more equitable to the workers as well. And I would be hugely in favor of legalizing immigrant workers, of course with some regulation. That's how I got here after all. Fill out the paperwork ... Tall fences, wide gates. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim Daneliuk |
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On Aug 15, 2:08*pm, Just Wondering wrote:
On 8/15/2012 5:43 AM, Jack wrote: On 8/14/2012 11:39 AM, Han wrote: Jack wrote : On 8/13/2012 2:31 PM, Han wrote: I find it funny that those who say that voter fraud is rampant never seem to be able to get a link to established facts. Please read this and you may be enlightened to why you don't get any "established facts". Sorry Han, I somehow left out the link to what I wanted you to read. http://tinyurl.com/3dv729h Please read it, and perhaps you will get an inkling as to what sort of corruption is going on, and has been going on in this country. It is difficult to establish "facts" if you can't get the wolves to investigate their own duplicity. The facts that are "established" as in court convictions are not reported much in the lame stream media. If voter fraud is so rampant, surely you can find some convictions ... A simple google search will turn up a bunch. *113 were convicted just in Minnesota since the last election, and if you read the article I posted, you should be totally amazed anyone ever gets convicted of voter fraud. *The freaking politicians make it almost impossible to uncover the fraud, and when it is, the refuse to do anything about it. Acorn has had a slew of crooks convicted of voter fraud, but again, it is totally amazing that anyone ever gets convicted, considering the politicians do everything in their power to ignore what is going on, and generally refuse to do anything about it when thrown in their face, as the above referenced article clearly addresses. That would be turning their backs on their constituents. *There's no way they would do that. No one cares about the self-centered, moronic comments of an absolute nobody who is a few beers short of a six pack. Just shy of 60 years old, how come you are are already suffering from age-related dementia? |
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On 15 Aug 2012 15:47:39 GMT, Han wrote:
" wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them It wouldn't cease at all. It might get more expensive, or, *perhaps* Congress could come up with some great idea to allow *legal* seasonal workers. Legalizing and regulating; what a concept. Nah, then it would be too hard to get them to vote. Yes it would get much more expensive. Much more equitable to the workers as well. And I would be hugely in favor of legalizing immigrant workers, of course with some regulation. That's how I got here after all. Fill out the paperwork ... Equitable? Are you saying that you weren't paid what you were worth? Obviously that's not true because you took the job. |
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On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. Perhaps if government didn't pay half the people to do nothing, someone would decide that work wasn't all bad. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... Where "insufficient wages" == "less than the government steals for me" |
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On 8/15/2012 5:46 PM, Scott Lurndal wrote:
You seem to be under the somewhat mistaken assumption that "those folk" aren't doing everything in their power to _find_ work. You seem to be the one mistaken. If so, how would you do it? If not, do you propose to force Larry and me through our taxes to support those people indefinitely while they sit home and watch TV all day? You've a seriously warped understanding of the unemployed. I think he has it spot on. Telling someone who has spent 20 years in medical device sales to go pick tomatoes is the type of republican lack of respect for the individual that is characteristic of the modern republican politician. Telling someone that they have to give their hard earned money to support someone not willing to take a job in another field after 18 months of looking for work in their field is the type of disrespect that drives Americans to detest the modern day democrat (socialist) politician. -- Jack Got Change: More Unemployment! More Debt! More Fraud! Less Freedom! http://jbstein.com |
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On 16 Aug 2012 11:27:21 GMT, Han wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote: Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. Did you mean Georgia? The farmers should have known that was coming and made sure they had workers lined up beforehand, don't you think? Or, if the state gov't pushed the deadline or hit them without warning, they should have helped find workers for the farmers, don't you think? I'm thinking the two groups bent -themselves- over this time. Alabama. This is a site that promotes the law that says you have to be legal grin and led to the harvesting problems http://www.alipac.us/f12/ala-governo...eting-illegal- immigrants-257760/ You're both right (I live in both states ;-). There was no surprise, here. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... That's just it. Unemployment isn't running out. Some people have been on it for over three years, Han! I think that after whatever the initial run is (I think it was 13 weeks when I last used it, back in the '70s) and the unemployed person hasn't found work, they should be forced to take whatever job IS available in their town, at their unemployment office. If the wages are less than their unemployment check (usually for very highly paid people), maybe cover the difference? But the unemployment office isn't forcing anything. That should change. Forcing unearned money on people isn't good for anyone involved: Not the worker, not the EDD office, and not the taxpayers. I'm not familiar with all the laws about unemployment, especially since they seem to change often in terms of time periods covered. The problem is not unemployment compensation in general, but the way the US (in general) fails to generate employment and educational opportunities, Absolute nonsense. Everyone is offered an education, some several times. Because they choose not to participate isn't my problem. It shouldn't be the (federal) government's either. especially when the economy turns sour. I think that covering the difference between previous high wages and the lower wages in current opportunities has been considered in some places. That's absurd. Why the hell would I work at a high-stress job if the government (you) is going to pay me to loaf? But that can get dicey very fast, especially in the middle income ranges. Example: Your previous job had generous benefits and pension arrangements, but you were RIF'ed. There is a new job somewhere else, but at 60% of your previous wages, with less benefits and pension arrangements. If you do take that, not only will you have to really limit your expenditures (including probably selling your house at a moment it isn't advantageous), but your resume will show that precipitous decrease. Not good for the next job. Maybe that scenario isn't too important for farm workers and others, but it is a very important point to a large portion of currently unemployed middle income people. If you want a life with no risk (but also with no reward), why did you move to the US, Han? Freedom to succeed is also the freedom to fail. You *can't* have one without the other. |
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On Wed, 15 Aug 2012 18:33:01 -0400, "Mike Marlow"
wrote: Just Wondering wrote: On 8/15/2012 12:20 PM, Mike Marlow wrote: Larry Jaques wrote: I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. Not so sure Larry. There have been more times when I've hears "i would not work for that wage", or "I would not do that", than would cause me to believe that the unemployment roles are filled with people willing to do that agricultural work. In fact - if that were the case, those people could be right at work besides the migrant workers even as we speak. How many unemployed people have you heard say that they would take those crop jobs? I am calling BULL**** on your comment. There's a geographical disconnect on that comparison. Most of the unemployed live in cities. Most of the agricultural jobs are out in the country. There's no easy way physically for the urban unemployed to get to and from the fields. Correct - but that's only because most of the population is centered in and around cities. I contend that even in rural areas, where unemployment is high, there are not lines of people trying to get that kind of job. But without illegal aliens doing the low-paying urban jobs (fast food, janitorial, etc.), the urban unemployed could take those jobs. Could - yes. Would - I believe... not so much. Part of the reason that those illegals can get those jobs is because legals here did not take them. That theory falls apart in places like Iowa, where after raiding a meat packaging plant (Hormel?), they had *no* problem hiring locals at the same wage. |
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On 16 Aug 2012 11:27:21 GMT, Han wrote:
Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote: Larry Jaques wrote in : On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. Did you mean Georgia? The farmers should have known that was coming and made sure they had workers lined up beforehand, don't you think? Or, if the state gov't pushed the deadline or hit them without warning, they should have helped find workers for the farmers, don't you think? I'm thinking the two groups bent -themselves- over this time. Alabama. This is a site that promotes the law that says you have to be legal grin and led to the harvesting problems http://www.alipac.us/f12/ala-governo...eting-illegal- immigrants-257760/ Jesus, Han. You really -are- a liberal. sigh OK, how long did farmers (and others who employ illegals) have to comply with laws which were already on the books? How long did they have between the time the bill was introduced and passed? The time frame is likely _years, not just months. Why hadn't they rehired _legal_ replacements during those many months and years, hmm? 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... That's just it. Unemployment isn't running out. Some people have been on it for over three years, Han! I think that after whatever the initial run is (I think it was 13 weeks when I last used it, back in the '70s) and the unemployed person hasn't found work, they should be forced to take whatever job IS available in their town, at their unemployment office. If the wages are less than their unemployment check (usually for very highly paid people), maybe cover the difference? But the unemployment office isn't forcing anything. That should change. Forcing unearned money on people isn't good for anyone involved: Not the worker, not the EDD office, and not the taxpayers. I'm not familiar with all the laws about unemployment, especially since they seem to change often in terms of time periods covered. The problem is not unemployment compensation in general, but the way the US (in general) fails to generate employment and educational opportunities, especially when the economy turns sour. You're absolutely right. Since CONgress is all about power and money, that's the way they think. They have no idea what honesty, truth, integrity, or good work feel like. I think that covering the difference between previous high wages and the lower wages in current opportunities has been considered in some places. But that can get dicey very fast, especially in the middle income ranges. Example: Your previous job had generous benefits and pension arrangements, but you were RIF'ed. There is a new job somewhere else, but at 60% of your previous wages, with less benefits and pension arrangements. If you do take that, not only will you have to really limit your expenditures (including probably selling your house at a moment it isn't advantageous), but your resume will show that precipitous decrease. Not good for the next job. Maybe that scenario isn't too important for farm workers and others, but it is a very important point to a large portion of currently unemployed middle income people. If people hadn't been living so _far_ above their means in the first place, the reduction wouldn't hurt nearly as bad and wouldn't cause many of them to lose their homes, etc. I also believe that many, if not most, middle management jobs shouldn't have ever existed, so don't get me started there. ;) It'll hurt, with millions losing their jobs, but we need to shear off all the unnecessary governmental divisions NOW. Duplication is really rampant when as many as 30 agencies cover the same tasks. I don't even want to hear about deficits when they can be immediately reversed by cutting the minions who spend them. I want to see the US -debt- start going down and down in my lifetime, please! -- All of us want to do well. But if we do not do good, too, then doing well will never be enough. -- Anna Quindlen |
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On 8/15/2012 2:10 PM, Just Wondering wrote:
On 8/15/2012 6:13 AM, Jack wrote: On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... I've read the federal statute. It is not a crime to enter the country illegally. It is illegal (legally prohibited, a crime) to enter the country illegally. The first offense is a misdemeanor the first time and no jury trial is needed, but is a crime and the criminal is supposed to be deported. The feds ignore that crime. The second offense is a felony, and the criminal can go to jail. The federal government is ignoring most all crimes related to illegal entry, and they are ignoring it hoping to garner votes to keep their sorry asses in power, the same reason the ignore voter fraud. Obummer is not alone, although his audacity is no less than spectacular. The consequences are all civil, not criminal. For example, an illegal alien can be deported, but without more cannot be sentenced to a prison term. Yes, some crimes are civil, some are criminal, but are crimes by definition. crime noun 1. an action or an instance of negligence that is deemed injurious to the public welfare or morals or to the interests of the state and that is legally prohibited. -- Jack A Nation of Sheep Breeds a Government of Wolves! http://jbstein.com |
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" wrote in
: On 15 Aug 2012 15:47:39 GMT, Han wrote: " wrote in m: On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them It wouldn't cease at all. It might get more expensive, or, *perhaps* Congress could come up with some great idea to allow *legal* seasonal workers. Legalizing and regulating; what a concept. Nah, then it would be too hard to get them to vote. Yes it would get much more expensive. Much more equitable to the workers as well. And I would be hugely in favor of legalizing immigrant workers, of course with some regulation. That's how I got here after all. Fill out the paperwork ... Equitable? Are you saying that you weren't paid what you were worth? Obviously that's not true because you took the job. Opinions versus facts. What I say are my opinions. I think I was paid what I was worth at most if not all points in my career. I know that others in similar positions and with similar capabilities were paid less and others more, but that is besides the point. My point is that many people in lower positions, tomato pickers, clerks, whatever, are paid insufficient wages, and yes paying them more would make everything more expensive. You may or may not agree, but my opinion is that more income equality would benefit our society. -- Best regards Han email address is invalid |
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On 08/16/2012 09:56 AM, Han wrote:
SNIP Opinions versus facts. What I say are my opinions. I think I was paid what I was worth at most if not all points in my career. I know that others in similar positions and with similar capabilities were paid less and others more, but that is besides the point. My point is that many people in lower positions, tomato pickers, clerks, whatever, are paid insufficient wages, and yes paying them more would make everything more expensive. You may or may not agree, but my opinion is that more income equality would benefit our society. You're missing the point. Unless force it brought to bear to MAKE you take a job, you're always "paid what you're worth" because you are "worth" what the market will bear. If a job is offered at a price, it is because the buyer (employer) values the work more than the money they pay for it. If the seller (you) accepts the job, then you value the money more highly than you do your time to do the work. Everyone wins. You may not be making as much as you would LIKE or THINK you should get, but that doesn't make you "worth" it. Again, this is true as long as no one is pointing a gun at your head. Relevant: http://jwh.fastmail.fm/essaysfolder....ays_market.htm -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Tim Daneliuk |
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" wrote in
: On 16 Aug 2012 11:27:21 GMT, Han wrote: Larry Jaques wrote in m: On 15 Aug 2012 17:51:20 GMT, Han wrote: Larry Jaques wrote in m: On 15 Aug 2012 12:51:07 GMT, Han wrote: Jack wrote in : On 8/14/2012 7:49 PM, HeyBub wrote: It is a federal crime for a non-citizen to vote for a federal office. It's a federal crime to break into our country and be here illegally, and the Feds ignore that crime as well... Agriculture as we know it would cease if we didn't have illegal aliens harvesting ... Guess who hires them I call BULL**** on that one, Han. With so many people out of work right now, I'd bet not one of those jobs went empty for very long if we were to finally deport all the illegals. I'm going by reports of harvest gone unharvested when Alabama or Arizona or both decided to let illegals deport themselves, and they did. Did you mean Georgia? The farmers should have known that was coming and made sure they had workers lined up beforehand, don't you think? Or, if the state gov't pushed the deadline or hit them without warning, they should have helped find workers for the farmers, don't you think? I'm thinking the two groups bent -themselves- over this time. Alabama. This is a site that promotes the law that says you have to be legal grin and led to the harvesting problems http://www.alipac.us/f12/ala-governo...rgeting-illega l- immigrants-257760/ You're both right (I live in both states ;-). There was no surprise, here. 'Course, I also believe that folks on unemployment should be given only a limited time of being able to turn down jobs not in their particular line of expertise. After 6 months (or less?), they should be required take any job they might qualify for (a couple days training or less?) to get off the unemployment roles. Unlimited unemployment checks breed worse things. Get 'em off their asses! I think that much unemployment or underemployment stems from insufficient wages. But then, we have gotten used to cheap food and other things cheap, so we're not willing to pay what we in all likelihood should. I agree that people should take a job, almost any job once their unemployment runs out. Who (OTOH) is in charge of generating jobs for those whose prior jobs have disappeared? All this is hugely easy for me to say, because I don't need a job anymore ... That's just it. Unemployment isn't running out. Some people have been on it for over three years, Han! I think that after whatever the initial run is (I think it was 13 weeks when I last used it, back in the '70s) and the unemployed person hasn't found work, they should be forced to take whatever job IS available in their town, at their unemployment office. If the wages are less than their unemployment check (usually for very highly paid people), maybe cover the difference? But the unemployment office isn't forcing anything. That should change. Forcing unearned money on people isn't good for anyone involved: Not the worker, not the EDD office, and not the taxpayers. I'm not familiar with all the laws about unemployment, especially since they seem to change often in terms of time periods covered. The problem is not unemployment compensation in general, but the way the US (in general) fails to generate employment and educational opportunities, Absolute nonsense. Everyone is offered an education, some several times. Because they choose not to participate isn't my problem. It shouldn't be the (federal) government's either. True, as well as false. My son-in-law teaches high school math in Paterson, NJ (read ghetto school). He delights in the observation he is making a difference there. He also is shown daily the deficiencies of the local school system (Paterson isn't exactly an example of how to educate kids), the indifference of parents, as well as the (lack of) culture among the kids. So, yes, if you are gung-ho to get educated AND get a committed mentor, you can get educated anywhere in the US. But it is really tough in some environments. especially when the economy turns sour. I think that covering the difference between previous high wages and the lower wages in current opportunities has been considered in some places. That's absurd. Why the hell would I work at a high-stress job if the government (you) is going to pay me to loaf? I wasn't loafing, and the high-stress job I had, I eventually ditched. Before that, though, I saw the high-stress job as a challenge, plus I was paid enough to live. I was able to buy my first home, and now have little debt on that home left. On the salary I made last, it would be really, really tough to buy this house now with just a meager deposit. But that can get dicey very fast, especially in the middle income ranges. Example: Your previous job had generous benefits and pension arrangements, but you were RIF'ed. There is a new job somewhere else, but at 60% of your previous wages, with less benefits and pension arrangements. If you do take that, not only will you have to really limit your expenditures (including probably selling your house at a moment it isn't advantageous), but your resume will show that precipitous decrease. Not good for the next job. Maybe that scenario isn't too important for farm workers and others, but it is a very important point to a large portion of currently unemployed middle income people. If you want a life with no risk (but also with no reward), why did you move to the US, Han? Freedom to succeed is also the freedom to fail. You *can't* have one without the other. I moved to the US because upon finishing my masters in Holland I got offered a job as a technician in a Harvard lab, with the promise from my Dutch professor (Laurens van Deenen) that if my work was good enough there, I would get a (Dutch) PhD. My alternative was compulsory military service (in 1969, there was a draft in Holland). I got a J-1 visa, later converted to a green card by reason of me being indispensable for the lab's work. My wife got an interview with a highly regarded professor at the Mass General Hospital for a technician's job, so we could live in Cambridge, Mass, not the cheapest place on earth. I took the chance because it seemed the way to start a career. I was unemployed for a 3 months (long story), but found a job in New York that I stayed with for 34 years. So yes, I did "fail" at some point, but was lucky/capable enough to get going again. So, one thing led to another, and as many, but not all in similar positions, I stayed in the US, not too far from where my grandchildren live. My son-in-law and daughter-in-law think we might the right choice, did and do the right things. Now I got pertussis and have to overcome that cough ... -- Best regards Han email address is invalid |
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Larry Jaques wrote in
: Jesus, Han. You really -are- a liberal. sigh OK, how long did farmers (and others who employ illegals) have to comply with laws which were already on the books? How long did they have between the time the bill was introduced and passed? The time frame is likely _years, not just months. Why hadn't they rehired _legal_ replacements during those many months and years, hmm? This was sprung on them fairly fast. Perhaps they had hoped that the law would be overturned and gambled wrong. -- Best regards Han email address is invalid |
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Larry Jaques wrote in
: If people hadn't been living so _far_ above their means in the first place, the reduction wouldn't hurt nearly as bad and wouldn't cause many of them to lose their homes, etc. Yes, and yes. They believed what were essentially slick second hand car salesmen, both with their extravagant homes and mortgages. The homeowners and construction workers got punished, but some other equally guilty ones didn't. Did you read that the higher-ups in MFGlobal were punished? Not criminally, they weren't. And they were in my opinion criminally negligent as were many other banking execs, but as my buddy the ex-New York banking inspector says, there was plausable denial (my words). No provable offenses. As the Germans used to say "Das habe ich nicht gewusst". I also believe that many, if not most, middle management jobs shouldn't have ever existed, so don't get me started there. ;) Aw, shucks, really? grin. It'll hurt, with millions losing their jobs, but we need to shear off all the unnecessary governmental divisions NOW. Duplication is really rampant when as many as 30 agencies cover the same tasks. I don't even want to hear about deficits when they can be immediately reversed by cutting the minions who spend them. I want to see the US -debt- start going down and down in my lifetime, please! I'm with you there. But that is a job for Congress. And you know what? I'm afraid it'll never happen. -- Best regards Han email address is invalid |
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