It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.

I suppose Autodesk has entered the ring with Sketchup. I down loaded the
enormous file and installed the program. Lots of bells and whistles
during install, typical Autodesk procedure.

I screwed around with it for about an hour and am contemplating removing
the program. I would say at this point that 123D, the program that I am
talking about, is about 8 years behind Sketchup.

I will say that this is a Beta program, 4.x and Autodesk is still asking
for suggestions, wish lists, and wants.

I would have thought that by now some one would have wanted a dimension
tool. Graphics are primitive, they remind me of pre Windows DOS
graphics.

Orbiting is clunky at best, and works a lot like Google Earth.

NO shortcut keys! I know a lot of people like icons for drawing
commands but I prefer a single quick keystroke for the actions that are
repeated over and over. I like typing an L to draw a line, D to
dimension, CTRL D for length, width, and height of a component.
I would not want to be stuck with icons only.

There are some neat features, line distances appear at the cursor
instead of a data, bar but I am not sure that is an advantage as it
seems to clutter up the drawing in the spots that you are trying to snap to.

There seem to be darn few tool available so far and only a hand full of
program tweaks.

So there you have it, I had a similar impression when Sketchup 3.x and
4.x were available.

Now Uninstalled

On Jun 17, 10:39*pm, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
Now Uninstalled

Once in a while, I will try a new piece of software, and I keep
finding out that I want to stick to what I know.
I'm always uninstalling.

On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:39:02 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:
Now Uninstalled

I didn't reply when you asked if I'd tried the program out. I should
have said that I was waiting for someone else to volunteer as guinea
pig.

Thanks! g

On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 20:21:03 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy
wrote:

On Jun 17, 10:39Â*pm, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
Now Uninstalled

Once in a while, I will try a new piece of software, and I keep
finding out that I want to stick to what I know.
I'm always uninstalling.

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to
find that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less)
and a crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place.
This trend makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

--
Happiness comes of the capacity to feel deeply, to enjoy
simply, to think freely, to risk life, to be needed.
-- Storm Jameson

On 6/17/2011 7:58 PM, Leon wrote:
It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.

There is also another directed at woodworkers in particular:

http://www.sketchlist.com/dev/


Trouble is, you rent it for $100/mo, or buy it outright for $2400, AND
"Upgrades to improvements and developments - charges to be determined at
the time of release".

While it might be the cat's meow in 3d woodworking software (it
apparently has cutlist and proposal functions), this guy musta been a
gummit lawyer/lobbyist/politician, or stood next to one too long ...
it'll take more than a well designed website with pictures of big titted
bimbos hawking the product (with a serious amount of personal
information gathering), and much more actual information on the program,
to get me interested in even trying it.

Another under 30 something thinking packaging _is_ the product? ...
makes you wonder, in any case.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On 6/17/2011 10:21 PM, Robatoy wrote:
On Jun 17, 10:39 pm, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
Now Uninstalled

Once in a while, I will try a new piece of software, and I keep
finding out that I want to stick to what I know.
I'm always uninstalling.

Prior to getting Win 7 I used a program called GoBack. I had been using
it since Win 98 IIRC, 10+ years. I did not have to uninstall, I simply
restored my computer to an earlier state. Viruses could be gotten rid
of in the same manor although my virus SW took care of that.
You could actually delete the Windows OS from the HD and have it back up
and running in a matter of minutes.
So, I would some times install 3-4 programs a day and then restore if I
did not like them.,


I have not used it yet however I have been told from more than one
reliable source that the restore program in Vista and 7 are both
reliable and work.

The restore in XP was a joke, kinda like an icon you click that does
nothing.

On 6/17/2011 11:03 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:39:02 -0500, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
wrote:
Now Uninstalled

I didn't reply when you asked if I'd tried the program out. I should
have said that I was waiting for someone else to volunteer as guinea
pig.

Thanks!g

LOL Your dog!

On 6/18/2011 7:59 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 6/17/2011 7:58 PM, Leon wrote:
It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.


Snip




it'll take more than a well designed website with pictures of big titted
bimbos hawking the product (with a serious amount of personal
information gathering), and much more actual information on the program,
to get me interested in even trying it.

Going back to re investigate, Missd the big titted bimbos....

In article , lcb11211
@swbelldotnet says...

It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.

I suppose Autodesk has entered the ring with Sketchup. I down loaded the
enormous file and installed the program. Lots of bells and whistles
during install, typical Autodesk procedure.

I screwed around with it for about an hour and am contemplating removing
the program. I would say at this point that 123D, the program that I am
talking about, is about 8 years behind Sketchup.

I will say that this is a Beta program, 4.x and Autodesk is still asking
for suggestions, wish lists, and wants.

I would have thought that by now some one would have wanted a dimension
tool. Graphics are primitive, they remind me of pre Windows DOS
graphics.

Orbiting is clunky at best, and works a lot like Google Earth.

NO shortcut keys! I know a lot of people like icons for drawing
commands but I prefer a single quick keystroke for the actions that are
repeated over and over. I like typing an L to draw a line, D to
dimension, CTRL D for length, width, and height of a component.
I would not want to be stuck with icons only.

There are some neat features, line distances appear at the cursor
instead of a data, bar but I am not sure that is an advantage as it
seems to clutter up the drawing in the spots that you are trying to snap to.

There seem to be darn few tool available so far and only a hand full of
program tweaks.

So there you have it, I had a similar impression when Sketchup 3.x and
4.x were available.

Uh, did you read the 123D site before downloading the thing? It's not
intended to be a "sketch" program, it's intended to be a front-end for a
MakerBot or to generate files for a service bureau that runs a similar
device.

They certainly are not going to develop it into a full CAD program while
they are trying to get four grand for AutoCAD.

On 6/18/2011 8:20 AM, Leon wrote:
On 6/18/2011 7:59 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 6/17/2011 7:58 PM, Leon wrote:
It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.


Snip




it'll take more than a well designed website with pictures of big titted
bimbos hawking the product (with a serious amount of personal
information gathering), and much more actual information on the program,
to get me interested in even trying it.

Going back to re investigate, Missd the big titted bimbos....

In heavy rotation with the photos of the ideal, handsome, computer
saavy, laptop dude whose picture alone will make you associate with him
and immediately buy the product.

You know, like those flags in the used car lots ...

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Jun 18, 8:59*am, Swingman wrote:
On 6/17/2011 7:58 PM, Leon wrote:

It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.

There is also another directed at woodworkers in particular:

http://www.sketchlist.com/dev/

Trouble is, you rent it for $100/mo, or buy it outright for $2400, AND
"Upgrades to improvements and developments - charges to be determined at
the time of release".

While it might be the cat's meow in 3d woodworking software (it
apparently has cutlist and proposal functions), this guy musta been a
gummit lawyer/lobbyist/politician, or stood next to one too long ...
it'll take more than a well designed website with pictures of big titted
bimbos hawking the product (with a serious amount of personal
information gathering), and much more actual information on the program,
to get me interested in even trying it.

Another under 30 something thinking packaging _is_ the product? ...
makes you wonder, in any case.


he, he, he....he said big titted...he he

On Jun 18, 12:16*am, Larry Jaques
wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 20:21:03 -0700 (PDT), Robatoy

wrote:
On Jun 17, 10:39*pm, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
Now Uninstalled

Once in a while, I will try a new piece of software, and I keep
finding out that I want to stick to what I know.
I'm always uninstalling.

I hear ya. *I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to
find that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less)
and a crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place.
This trend makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

--
Happiness comes of the capacity to feel deeply, to enjoy
simply, to think freely, to risk life, to be needed.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * -- Storm Jameson

Like Karl said: "The package is the product" in many cases. And Clarke
actually got something right this time too by mentioning that
AutoDesk's weasels would never put out a product that would take away
from their cash cow AutoCAD.
In that light, SketchUp looks pretty damned good and since my biggest
beef with it (interaction with the rest of the world) can be cured for
a very reasonable $ 500 bill by going Pro, it is truly exceptional
value.
And nope, today I'm not going there...that it isn't real CAD...nope,
not doing it, because I have decided that SU used at its maximum by a
skilled user will do a better job than an untrained operator can eke
out of a powerful CAD package.

Kinda sorta funny that AutoDesk again offers AutoCAD for the Mac...
VectorWorks (works flawlessly on a PC too) must really be kicking the
**** out of them... especially now that all versions of .dwg and.dxf,
(3D as well), can now be handled seamlessly by VW. (STILL a funny
story is that the architects who designed Bill Gates' house did so on
a mac with VectorWorks...story is getting old, but still funny...)

...now back to our regularly scheduled programming.

Tonight we eat the BEST Italian dish on the planet...PUTTANESCA!!!

On 6/18/2011 8:47 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
In , lcb11211
@swbelldotnet says...

It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.

I suppose Autodesk has entered the ring with Sketchup. I down loaded the
enormous file and installed the program. Lots of bells and whistles
during install, typical Autodesk procedure.

I screwed around with it for about an hour and am contemplating removing
the program. I would say at this point that 123D, the program that I am
talking about, is about 8 years behind Sketchup.

I will say that this is a Beta program, 4.x and Autodesk is still asking
for suggestions, wish lists, and wants.

I would have thought that by now some one would have wanted a dimension
tool. Graphics are primitive, they remind me of pre Windows DOS
graphics.

Orbiting is clunky at best, and works a lot like Google Earth.

NO shortcut keys! I know a lot of people like icons for drawing
commands but I prefer a single quick keystroke for the actions that are
repeated over and over. I like typing an L to draw a line, D to
dimension, CTRL D for length, width, and height of a component.
I would not want to be stuck with icons only.

There are some neat features, line distances appear at the cursor
instead of a data, bar but I am not sure that is an advantage as it
seems to clutter up the drawing in the spots that you are trying to snap to.

There seem to be darn few tool available so far and only a hand full of
program tweaks.

So there you have it, I had a similar impression when Sketchup 3.x and
4.x were available.

Uh, did you read the 123D site before downloading the thing? It's not
intended to be a "sketch" program, it's intended to be a front-end for a
MakerBot or to generate files for a service bureau that runs a similar
device.

They certainly are not going to develop it into a full CAD program while
they are trying to get four grand for AutoCAD.

Strange that the tools and materials and pre drawn objects are not what
I would put into a service bureau category. Still it acts like Sketchup.

"Robatoy" astounded us with
.
In that light, SketchUp looks pretty damned good and since my biggest
beef with it (interaction with the rest of the world) can be cured for
a very reasonable $ 500 bill by going Pro, it is truly exceptional
value.
--------
Peering cautiously out my window

Did hell just freeze over??

Robatoy actually said something nice about Sketchup.

I hope he is OK. No major health problems or anything.

On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:16:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to find
that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less) and a
crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place. This trend
makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

I know I sound like a broken record folks, but I get all sort of programs
for free - I run Linux. And if you've got one or two Windoze
applications that you just can't live without, there are (free) programs
like Virtual Box that will run them under Linux.

When I first started running linux many years ago, you pretty much had to
be a computer guru (I was) to get and keep it running. No longer.
Anyone can download a copy of Ubuntu Linux and get it running unless
they've got some really strange hardware.

Unfortunately, the one weak area is free CAD, so I've been resorting to
TurboCad under Windoze. But I recently downloaded something called
Inkscape that looks pretty good at first glance.

Give Ubuntu Linux a try - I think you'll like it.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On 6/18/11 1:31 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:16:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to find
that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less) and a
crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place. This trend
makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

I know I sound like a broken record folks, but I get all sort of programs
for free - I run Linux. And if you've got one or two Windoze
applications that you just can't live without, there are (free) programs
like Virtual Box that will run them under Linux.

When I first started running linux many years ago, you pretty much had to
be a computer guru (I was) to get and keep it running. No longer.
Anyone can download a copy of Ubuntu Linux and get it running unless
they've got some really strange hardware.

Unfortunately, the one weak area is free CAD, so I've been resorting to
TurboCad under Windoze. But I recently downloaded something called
Inkscape that looks pretty good at first glance.

Give Ubuntu Linux a try - I think you'll like it.

I have a VM of Ubuntu running now, but honestly I really hate the Unity
interface of 11.04, hoping they will reconsider and go back to Gnome.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

"Lee Michaels" leemichaels*nadaspam* at comcast dot net wrote:
"Robatoy" astounded us with
.
In that light, SketchUp looks pretty damned good and since my biggest
beef with it (interaction with the rest of the world) can be cured for
a very reasonable $ 500 bill by going Pro, it is truly exceptional
value.
--------
Peering cautiously out my window

Did hell just freeze over??

Robatoy actually said something nice about Sketchup.
I hope he is OK. No major health problems or anything.

Enough drops of water will eventually wear away a rock ...

--
www.ewoodshop.com

On Jun 18, 1:31*pm, "Lee Michaels" leemichaels*nadaspam* at comcast
dot net wrote:
"Robatoy" astounded us with.
In that light, SketchUp looks pretty damned good and since my biggest
beef with it (interaction with the rest of the world) can be cured for
a very reasonable $ 500 bill by going Pro, it is truly exceptional
value.
--------

Peering cautiously out my window

Did hell just freeze over??

Robatoy actually said something nice about Sketchup. *

I hope he is OK. *No major health problems or anything.

LOL.. hey, it is what it is. And that is: VERY useful to tons of
people who ordinarily would have stayed away from that type of
program. It is a wonderful bridge between the useless of entry-level
"so-called CAD" and the expensive big guns like AutoCAD and
VectorWorks, many who have very powerful CAD feature that hardly
anybody will ever use.

For me, it has always come down to this: Many programs allow me to
create a 3D model of a concept which is in my head and which I want to
'see'. THEN, after tweaking and tuning that concept, I want others to
see and understand what it is I want and now with the cnc, I also want
to be able to have *IT* see it too.
So here I have created a model of a two-part U-joint (hypothetical for
illustrative purposes), accuracy is very important, and so is the
ability for a machine shop to 'see' it.
Here's the path: Model, export to:
a ) Rendering module or separate rendering software
b ) High def graphics on screen or printer
c ) OTHER software packages to edit, study same model.
d ) Machining centres like a CNC flatbed or mill.

Here's the thing for me: I want the path of the model to the CNC to be
as short/easy/accurate as possible.
There are dozens of proprietary file formats for modelling software
and clear paths to machining centres are always an issue.

So guess what? This 123D AutoDesk freebie does offer me a direct path
to my router (.stl).. and it works.
More to come about that software package that Leon so casually tossed
in the garbage. (g,d&r)

Go figgur.

On 06/18/2011 10:42 AM, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 6/18/11 1:31 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:16:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to find
that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less) and a
crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place. This trend
makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

I know I sound like a broken record folks, but I get all sort of programs
for free - I run Linux. And if you've got one or two Windoze
applications that you just can't live without, there are (free) programs
like Virtual Box that will run them under Linux.

When I first started running linux many years ago, you pretty much had to
be a computer guru (I was) to get and keep it running. No longer.
Anyone can download a copy of Ubuntu Linux and get it running unless
they've got some really strange hardware.

Unfortunately, the one weak area is free CAD, so I've been resorting to
TurboCad under Windoze. But I recently downloaded something called
Inkscape that looks pretty good at first glance.

Give Ubuntu Linux a try - I think you'll like it.

I have a VM of Ubuntu running now, but honestly I really hate the Unity
interface of 11.04, hoping they will reconsider and go back to Gnome.

I think you can pick the gnome desktop at login. After you select your
ID and before you enter your password, there is an option dialog at the
bottom of the window.

On 6/18/11 2:37 PM, Doug Winterburn wrote:
On 06/18/2011 10:42 AM, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 6/18/11 1:31 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:16:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to find
that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less) and a
crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place. This trend
makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

I know I sound like a broken record folks, but I get all sort of
programs
for free - I run Linux. And if you've got one or two Windoze
applications that you just can't live without, there are (free) programs
like Virtual Box that will run them under Linux.

When I first started running linux many years ago, you pretty much
had to
be a computer guru (I was) to get and keep it running. No longer.
Anyone can download a copy of Ubuntu Linux and get it running unless
they've got some really strange hardware.

Unfortunately, the one weak area is free CAD, so I've been resorting to
TurboCad under Windoze. But I recently downloaded something called
Inkscape that looks pretty good at first glance.

Give Ubuntu Linux a try - I think you'll like it.

I have a VM of Ubuntu running now, but honestly I really hate the Unity
interface of 11.04, hoping they will reconsider and go back to Gnome.

I think you can pick the gnome desktop at login. After you select your
ID and before you enter your password, there is an option dialog at the
bottom of the window.

Yeah, you can, for *now*.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

On Sat, 18 Jun 2011 17:31:47 +0000 (UTC), Larry Blanchard
wrote:

On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:16:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to find
that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less) and a
crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place. This trend
makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

I know I sound like a broken record folks, but I get all sort of programs
for free - I run Linux. And if you've got one or two Windoze
applications that you just can't live without, there are (free) programs
like Virtual Box that will run them under Linux.

When I first started running linux many years ago, you pretty much had to
be a computer guru (I was) to get and keep it running. No longer.
Anyone can download a copy of Ubuntu Linux and get it running unless
they've got some really strange hardware.

Unfortunately, the one weak area is free CAD, so I've been resorting to
TurboCad under Windoze. But I recently downloaded something called
Inkscape that looks pretty good at first glance.

Give Ubuntu Linux a try - I think you'll like it.

I have a year old copy and may try sharing my old XP box with it.

--
Happiness comes of the capacity to feel deeply, to enjoy
simply, to think freely, to risk life, to be needed.
-- Storm Jameson

On 6/19/2011 11:19 AM, Robatoy wrote:
On Jun 17, 8:58 pm, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote:
It was brought to my attention that there is anew 3D sketch program
available for down load and it is free. IT SHOULD BE FREE.

I suppose Autodesk has entered the ring with Sketchup. I down loaded the
enormous file and installed the program. Lots of bells and whistles
during install, typical Autodesk procedure.

I screwed around with it for about an hour and am contemplating removing
the program. I would say at this point that 123D, the program that I am
talking about, is about 8 years behind Sketchup.

I can't comment on that as I have had no time to compare the two.
I would have to unlearn my interface with VW, and start fresh.

I will say that this is a Beta program, 4.x and Autodesk is still asking
for suggestions, wish lists, and wants.

I would have thought that by now some one would have wanted a dimension
tool. Graphics are primitive, they remind me of pre Windows DOS
graphics.

It has a dimension tool. Graphics have a settings file which looks
pretty good for a working OpenGL view.

Orbiting is clunky at best, and works a lot like Google Earth.

Pretty smooth on my PC, but it has a fancypants graphics card. I
installed the 64 bit version, maybe that helped?

Let me re word that, it seems that orbiting works like Google earth, not
like Sketchup. My graphics card is pretty trick too, no hesitation but
getting things back to normal is not how I like to do it.



NO shortcut keys! I know a lot of people like icons for drawing
commands but I prefer a single quick keystroke for the actions that are
repeated over and over. I like typing an L to draw a line, D to
dimension, CTRL D for length, width, and height of a component.
I would not want to be stuck with icons only.

I have not found any shortcut keys, but that would be a major deal-
breaker for me as there isn't a proper toolbar either.
I'm not in love, but don't hate it either.

There are some neat features, line distances appear at the cursor
instead of a data, bar but I am not sure that is an advantage as it
seems to clutter up the drawing in the spots that you are trying to snap to.

There seem to be darn few tool available so far and only a hand full of
program tweaks.

They are hiding. The right-click uncorks a wealth of modelling tools.

I saw a lot of tools, just not program tweaks.






So there you have it, I had a similar impression when Sketchup 3.x and
4.x were available.

Did you read the overview, Leon?
http://www.123dapp.com/SiteFiles/Sup...d_overview.pdf

This thing is mighty powerful.

So they say.

On 06/18/2011 11:56 AM, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 6/18/11 2:37 PM, Doug Winterburn wrote:
On 06/18/2011 10:42 AM, FrozenNorth wrote:
On 6/18/11 1:31 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Fri, 17 Jun 2011 21:16:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote:

I hear ya. I download all sorts of neat sounding programs only to find
that it's either all bogus marketing (for a FREE prog, no less) and a
crappy prog, or I didn't really want it in the first place. This trend
makes me very careful in what I pay money for, too.

I know I sound like a broken record folks, but I get all sort of
programs
for free - I run Linux. And if you've got one or two Windoze
applications that you just can't live without, there are (free)
programs
like Virtual Box that will run them under Linux.

When I first started running linux many years ago, you pretty much
had to
be a computer guru (I was) to get and keep it running. No longer.
Anyone can download a copy of Ubuntu Linux and get it running unless
they've got some really strange hardware.

Unfortunately, the one weak area is free CAD, so I've been resorting to
TurboCad under Windoze. But I recently downloaded something called
Inkscape that looks pretty good at first glance.

Give Ubuntu Linux a try - I think you'll like it.

I have a VM of Ubuntu running now, but honestly I really hate the Unity
interface of 11.04, hoping they will reconsider and go back to Gnome.

I think you can pick the gnome desktop at login. After you select your
ID and before you enter your password, there is an option dialog at the
bottom of the window.

Yeah, you can, for *now*.

Here's a ubuntu based gnome distro: http://ugr.teampr0xy.net/