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Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Andrew Barss wrote:
J. Clarke wrote: Robatoy wrote: The pleated-paper canister filter on my 2HP DC is just overwhelmed. Better than the old bag. A bag is good for 1 hour.... I really need to do something. I figure that if I were to upgrade to a double canister 3-4 HP set-up, all it would do would buy a little time between dumping. So, I'm told that a cyclone is the way to go. What do we know about those things? http://billpentz.com/woodworking/Cyclone/Index.cfm Just about anything you want to know is there. Some of it is useful and accurate, some of it is neither. Care to point out the inaccuracies? One should also consult reviews on cyclones from FWW, Popular Woodworking, and other major magazines. And the engineers at Oneida give free advice and very useful help in designing and planning a system. -- Andy Barss -- -- --John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
[...snip...]
In the Decibel scale, a 3 dB reduction equates to a reduction by 1/2. dB scale is logarithmic. Depending upon whether one is converting from power or not, the conversion from linear scale to logarithmic scale is either dB = 10 * log10(P) or dB = 20 * log10(A). But in human perception terms, according to audio textbooks I have, a 3 db increase is generally perceived as just noticeable, and a 10 db increase is perceived as twice as loud. Jim |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 16:30:42 GMT, Han wrote:
Hey mac! The scale for dB is logarithmic - I think that each increase of 1 means 10 times more, just as the Richter scale for earthquakes. Better look at wikipedia for more info. How come you need a reduction of 7 to 10 dB for 50% reduction is not immediately clear, unless we have to go back to the Bel decibel is 1/10 of a Bel). Then 10 dB=1 B, or a factor 2. But maybe I need more coffee, and then advice from DIL, who teaches physics in a high school. Exactly why I blanked out when folks tried to explain it.. My math skills are just about good enough to run a calculator..lol mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 09:47:02 -0700, Mark & Juanita wrote:
In the Decibel scale, a 3 dB reduction equates to a reduction by 1/2. dB scale is logarithmic. Depending upon whether one is converting from power or not, the conversion from linear scale to logarithmic scale is either dB = 10 * log10(P) or dB = 20 * log10(A). That first line is the comforting part, after that, it's all Greek (geek?) to me.. thanks! Feliz Navidad mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 15:43:57 -0500, "J. Clarke" wrote:
However, you set your cyclone up, vent it outside the building into a suitable enclosure (I made mine to look like an outhouse). This way, you get rid of the dust, which is the whole purpose. You also get rid of any warm air in the shop right quick. For sure... What isn't fair is that in summer, it doesn't seem to vent much heat.. Then again, we all know that life isn't fair.. Feliz Navidad mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
mac davis wrote in
: On Wed, 24 Dec 2008 09:47:02 -0700, Mark & Juanita wrote: In the Decibel scale, a 3 dB reduction equates to a reduction by 1/2. dB scale is logarithmic. Depending upon whether one is converting from power or not, the conversion from linear scale to logarithmic scale is either dB = 10 * log10(P) or dB = 20 * log10(A). That first line is the comforting part, after that, it's all Greek (geek?) to me.. thanks! Feliz Navidad mac Please remove splinters before emailing That's normal. Most Physics formulas include greek letters. :-) Puckdropper -- On Usenet, no one can hear you laugh. That's a good thing, though, as some writers are incorrigible. To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
J. Clarke wrote:
: Care to point out the inaccuracies? It's filled with hyperbole, it claims no commercial DC company is worth their salt (he has a particular dislike of Oneida), he claims he's spent a hundred thousand dollars on putting up his website and requests donations, he recommends homebuilt systems that are over powered, and he exaggerates the efficacy of the system he advocates and the dangers of small amounts of dust. It may just be me, but the site has a cultish, conpiracy theory feel. However, it does contain some useful information. I just think a person should look elsewhere as well. -- Andy Barss |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Andrew Barss wrote:
J. Clarke wrote: Care to point out the inaccuracies? It's filled with hyperbole, it claims no commercial DC company is worth their salt (he has a particular dislike of Oneida), he claims he's spent a hundred thousand dollars on putting up his website and requests donations, he recommends homebuilt systems that are over powered, and he exaggerates the efficacy of the system he advocates and the dangers of small amounts of dust. It may just be me, but the site has a cultish, conpiracy theory feel. I don't see any specifics there, your assertions are very vague. However, it does contain some useful information. I just think a person should look elsewhere as well. -- Andy Barss -- -- --John to email, dial "usenet" and validate (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
"J. Clarke" wrote in message
... Andrew Barss wrote: J. Clarke wrote: Care to point out the inaccuracies? It's filled with hyperbole, it claims no commercial DC company is worth their salt (he has a particular dislike of Oneida), he claims he's spent a hundred thousand dollars on putting up his website and requests donations, he recommends homebuilt systems that are over powered, and he exaggerates the efficacy of the system he advocates and the dangers of small amounts of dust. It may just be me, but the site has a cultish, conpiracy theory feel. I don't see any specifics there, your assertions are very vague. I share his vague disquiet. The entire site is very dust-phobic, bordering on obsessive and paranoid. It's difficult to say more without quantifying air quality in your own shop. I think about buying a good airborn particulate counter from time to time. OTOH, the only purpose that would serve is to verify whether or not I need to punch a hole through the masonry to vent to the outside, with the attendant problems. Subjectively, the small'ish DC and air cleaner work adequately most of the time, with the ROS being the sole exception. A hole in the wall likely won't help the ROS. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
MikeWhy wrote:
Subjectively, the small'ish DC and air cleaner work adequately most of the time, with the ROS being the sole exception. A hole in the wall likely won't help the ROS. A Shop Vac, drywall bag, and $20 auto switch can do wonders for a ROS. If you're really paranoid, you can add a Cleanstream HEPA filter to catch what escapes the drywall bag. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
"B A R R Y" wrote in message
... MikeWhy wrote: Subjectively, the small'ish DC and air cleaner work adequately most of the time, with the ROS being the sole exception. A hole in the wall likely won't help the ROS. A Shop Vac, drywall bag, and $20 auto switch can do wonders for a ROS. If you're really paranoid, you can add a Cleanstream HEPA filter to catch what escapes the drywall bag. nods Yup. I use it so seldom, mostly on plywood only, and then only rarely. I haven't bothered getting the 1" adapter to fit on the sander. Hand sanding with 220 suffices, but that has a different dust problem. Solid wood gets planed or scraped. (So, it's fair to say I stopped using it for lack of a $2 vac adapter. I hate the whine of that shop vac, too.) |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Fri, 26 Dec 2008 09:27:15 -0600, "MikeWhy" wrote:
"B A R R Y" wrote in message .. . MikeWhy wrote: Subjectively, the small'ish DC and air cleaner work adequately most of the time, with the ROS being the sole exception. A hole in the wall likely won't help the ROS. A Shop Vac, drywall bag, and $20 auto switch can do wonders for a ROS. If you're really paranoid, you can add a Cleanstream HEPA filter to catch what escapes the drywall bag. nods Yup. I use it so seldom, mostly on plywood only, and then only rarely. I haven't bothered getting the 1" adapter to fit on the sander. Hand sanding with 220 suffices, but that has a different dust problem. Solid wood gets planed or scraped. (So, it's fair to say I stopped using it for lack of a $2 vac adapter. I hate the whine of that shop vac, too.) Weather permitting, I sand stuff like that outside.. I find myself working more and more in the carport, using the "Baja Breeze" handle the dust.. Moving the table saw, router table and belt/disk sander outside made a huge difference in how often I have to dust the stuff in the shop.. mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
mac davis wrote:
Weather permitting, I sand stuff like that outside.. I find myself working more and more in the carport, using the "Baja Breeze" handle the dust.. The "Connecticut Breeze" is a tad less accommodating this time of year. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
B A R R Y wrote:
mac davis wrote: Weather permitting, I sand stuff like that outside.. I find myself working more and more in the carport, using the "Baja Breeze" handle the dust.. The "Connecticut Breeze" is a tad less accommodating this time of year. That's what we are hearing. How many inches of global warming have you got so far? Or has it missed you and only hit the midwest? -- If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Mark & Juanita wrote:
B A R R Y wrote: mac davis wrote: Weather permitting, I sand stuff like that outside.. I find myself working more and more in the carport, using the "Baja Breeze" handle the dust.. The "Connecticut Breeze" is a tad less accommodating this time of year. That's what we are hearing. How many inches of global warming have you got so far? Or has it missed you and only hit the midwest? ~ 14 last weekend! I live about 30 minutes from the shore, @ 100 ft/MSL, so that's a huge storm. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Nova wrote:
14" last Friday, 23.5" on Sunday. Mere flurries, for you! G |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Nova wrote:
B A R R Y wrote: Mark & Juanita wrote: B A R R Y wrote: mac davis wrote: Weather permitting, I sand stuff like that outside.. I find myself working more and more in the carport, using the "Baja Breeze" handle the dust.. The "Connecticut Breeze" is a tad less accommodating this time of year. That's what we are hearing. How many inches of global warming have you got so far? Or has it missed you and only hit the midwest? ~ 14 last weekend! I live about 30 minutes from the shore, @ 100 ft/MSL, so that's a huge storm. 14" last Friday, 23.5" on Sunday. Saw a dusting of frost on the lawn (green) this morning. I don't envy you all in the least. -- If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Fri, 26 Dec 2008 14:07:03 -0500, B A R R Y wrote:
mac davis wrote: Weather permitting, I sand stuff like that outside.. I find myself working more and more in the carport, using the "Baja Breeze" handle the dust.. The "Connecticut Breeze" is a tad less accommodating this time of year. Yep.. local makes a huge difference.. Right now, a long sleeve shirt is all I need to work outside, but during the summer it's just too hot/humid to work outside.. Forecast this morning was for a warming trend, maybe up to 70... After 2 years here, we've acclimated a bit though and 70 with a strong breeze is kind of cold.. From what I've heard, your spring is spectacular, though.. mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 11:37:53 -0700, Mark & Juanita wrote:
14" last Friday, 23.5" on Sunday. Saw a dusting of frost on the lawn (green) this morning. I don't envy you all in the least. Me either... The ideal white Christmas for us the sand on the beach.. The older I get, the less I like being cold.. mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
"mac davis" wrote:
Me either... The ideal white Christmas for us the sand on the beach.. The older I get, the less I like being cold.. You want an arguement, change the subject. High today in SoCal is around 60F. IT SUCKS. Lew |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"mac davis" wrote: Me either... The ideal white Christmas for us the sand on the beach.. The older I get, the less I like being cold.. You want an arguement, change the subject. High today in SoCal is around 60F. IT SUCKS. Lew The temperature here today (at 4:30 PM) is 59 degrees. We had heavy rain this AM. Along with the melting snow things are a little wet. -- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
mac davis wrote:
Right now, a long sleeve shirt is all I need to work outside, but during the summer it's just too hot/humid to work outside.. Forecast this morning was for a warming trend, maybe up to 70... After 2 years here, we've acclimated a bit though and 70 with a strong breeze is kind of cold.. Nice! From what I've heard, your spring is spectacular, though.. Fall, too! |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Lew Hodgett wrote:
"mac davis" wrote: Me either... The ideal white Christmas for us the sand on the beach.. The older I get, the less I like being cold.. You want an arguement, change the subject. High today in SoCal is around 60F. IT SUCKS. Lew EXCEPT at 7000 feet where it started at about 8dF and spiraled all the way up to 34 now. We started with about 3.5 feet of powder. Then over Christmas, it rained, sleeted, and ended up with freezing temps. Our street is a sheet of ice covered with a thin layer of snow. If you can get up here through the hordes of snow play people and skiers/snowboarders, bring some 60dF weather. grump, jo4hn |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
"jo4hn" wrote:
If you can get up here through the hordes of snow play people and skiers/snowboarders, bring some 60dF weather. May our paths (skiers and snowboarders) never cross.grin Lew |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:55:19 GMT, "Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"mac davis" wrote: Me either... The ideal white Christmas for us the sand on the beach.. The older I get, the less I like being cold.. You want an arguement, change the subject. High today in SoCal is around 60F. IT SUCKS. Lew Hey, it could be worse, Lew.. You could be in N. Dakota.. lol My inlaws are freezing their butts off there.. mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Dec 28, 12:55*pm, mac davis wrote:
On Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:55:19 GMT, "Lew Hodgett" wrote: "mac davis" wrote: Me either... The ideal white Christmas for us the sand on the beach.. The older I get, the less I like being cold.. You want an arguement, change the subject. High today in SoCal is around 60F. IT SUCKS. Lew Hey, it could be worse, Lew.. You could be in N. Dakota.. lol My inlaws are freezing their butts off there.. mac Please remove splinters before emailing On my way back from Toronto, yesterday, the outside temp gauge in my truck said 15 C. (Which is like 60F for those who haven't figured out metric yet.)( Water freezes at 0, boils at 100...now is that so hard?? G) |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Not to appear too dumb...but what is a drywall bag
and where do I get one ? B A R R Y wrote: MikeWhy wrote: Subjectively, the small'ish DC and air cleaner work adequately most of the time, with the ROS being the sole exception. A hole in the wall likely won't help the ROS. A Shop Vac, drywall bag, and $20 auto switch can do wonders for a ROS. If you're really paranoid, you can add a Cleanstream HEPA filter to catch what escapes the drywall bag. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
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Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Dec 29, 2:42*pm, Nova wrote:
Pat Barber wrote: Not to appear too dumb...but what is a drywall bag and where do I get one ? They're disposable filter bags designed for picking up drywall dust. I've only seen them available for the "Shop-Vac" and the Porter Cable vacs. -- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA The Festool and Fein vacs have them too. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Sun, 28 Dec 2008 11:54:48 -0800 (PST), Robatoy
wrote: On my way back from Toronto, yesterday, the outside temp gauge in my truck said 15 C. (Which is like 60F for those who haven't figured out metric yet.)( Water freezes at 0, boils at 100...now is that so hard?? G) well, it's 59, but who's counting? Metric is great for wrenches and sockets.. I hate fractions.. Oh.. and we set the AC in the bedroom to 30c at night.. mac Please remove splinters before emailing |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Pat Barber wrote:
Not to appear too dumb...but what is a drywall bag and where do I get one ? A drywall bag is simply a disposable filter bag, fine enough to contain drywall dust. I buy them in the Shop Vac (generic term...) section, wherever Shop Vac accessories, like filters and hoses, are sold. I find that the bag provides a steadier suction for longer than a HEPA filter by itself. My HEPA filters seem to clog quite readily with sanding junk. The bags also make the job of emptying the vacuum much cleaner, but they aren't all that cheap. Since the main use of my vacuum is with handheld sanders, I don't worry too much about the extra cost. The bags last me a long time. |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
mac davis wrote:
On Sun, 28 Dec 2008 11:54:48 -0800 (PST), Robatoy wrote: On my way back from Toronto, yesterday, the outside temp gauge in my truck said 15 C. (Which is like 60F for those who haven't figured out metric yet.)( Water freezes at 0, boils at 100...now is that so hard?? G) well, it's 59, but who's counting? Metric is great for wrenches and sockets.. I hate fractions.. Oh.. and we set the AC in the bedroom to 30c at night.. Problem is that your body can pretty well detect 1 degree F differences. Unfortunately 1 degree C is about 2 degrees F, so unless your thermostat gives you 1/2 degree C setting increments, it's not hard to have a significant discomfort factor because you can't tune the temperature as finely. mac Please remove splinters before emailing -- If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Mark & Juanita wrote:
Problem is that your body can pretty well detect 1 degree F differences. My wife can detect 10ths... |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
B A R R Y wrote:
Mark & Juanita wrote: Problem is that your body can pretty well detect 1 degree F differences. My wife can detect 10ths... I can detect my wife's cold feet in the middle of my back. ;-) -- Froz... |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
B A R R Y wrote:
Pat Barber wrote: Not to appear too dumb...but what is a drywall bag and where do I get one ? A drywall bag is simply a disposable filter bag, fine enough to contain drywall dust. I buy them in the Shop Vac (generic term...) section, wherever Shop Vac accessories, like filters and hoses, are sold. I find that the bag provides a steadier suction for longer than a HEPA filter by itself. My HEPA filters seem to clog quite readily with sanding junk. The bags also make the job of emptying the vacuum much cleaner, but they aren't all that cheap. Since the main use of my vacuum is with handheld sanders, I don't worry too much about the extra cost. The bags last me a long time. Have you tried a "CleanStream" filter. They too are initially expensive but I've been running the same one in my Sears shop vac for about 6 years. http://www.cleanstream.com/filters_wetdry.html -- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
I do have a couple of the Cleanstream and they
are nice. I just thought these drywall bags might make things easier. I also use my shop vac for most sanding operations but that fine dust is hell on even the Cleanstream. Dumping those shop vacs can be a VERY nasty operation. Maybe Craftsman makes a similar bag. Nova wrote: I find that the bag provides a steadier suction for longer than a HEPA filter by itself. My HEPA filters seem to clog quite readily with sanding junk. The bags also make the job of emptying the vacuum much cleaner, but they aren't all that cheap. Since the main use of my vacuum is with handheld sanders, I don't worry too much about the extra cost. The bags last me a long time. Have you tried a "CleanStream" filter. They too are initially expensive but I've been running the same one in my Sears shop vac for about 6 years. http://www.cleanstream.com/filters_wetdry.html |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
On Dec 29, 3:34 pm, B A R R Y wrote:
Pat Barber wrote: Not to appear too dumb...but what is a drywall bag and where do I get one ? A drywall bag is simply a disposable filter bag, fine enough to contain drywall dust. I buy them in the Shop Vac (generic term...) section, wherever Shop Vac accessories, like filters and hoses, are sold. I find that the bag provides a steadier suction for longer than a HEPA filter by itself. My HEPA filters seem to clog quite readily with sanding junk. The bags also make the job of emptying the vacuum much cleaner, but they aren't all that cheap. Since the main use of my vacuum is with handheld sanders, I don't worry too much about the extra cost. The bags last me a long time. If you're going through a lot of bags, a mini cyclone would save you money in the long run. -Kevin |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
"Pat Barber" wrote in message
... I do have a couple of the Cleanstream and they are nice. I just thought these drywall bags might make things easier. I also use my shop vac for most sanding operations but that fine dust is hell on even the Cleanstream. Dumping those shop vacs can be a VERY nasty operation. Maybe Craftsman makes a similar bag. That was really weird. Thinking I had a Craftsman vac of some sort, I was somewhat distressed to find that it said Hoover on the outside. Weird. Oh well. Vaguely remembering that I might have bought a Craftsman filter for it at one time, I looked inside to see if it was compatible with what CleanStream was selling. Lo! It was a CleanStream filter. WTF? :D |
Cyclone-style Dust Collectors.
Nova wrote:
Have you tried a "CleanStream" filter. They too are initially expensive but I've been running the same one in my Sears shop vac for about 6 years. I have. It still clogs. The beauty of the drywall bag is that the dust cake seems to fall off in between uses. I like the Cleanstream as a main filter, but the bag is a great pre-filter. |
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