On Sep 15, 11:54*pm, Mark & Juanita wrote:
Rod & Betty Jo wrote:



dpb wrote:
Lew Hodgett wrote:
...
You are probably not going to like this response, but it is reality.

There has not been a "grass roots" refinery built in the USA in over
30 years, and hopefully, there will NEVER be another built, at least
until after some usable form of alternate energy is developed.
...
That's sheer stupidity...to not process shale or sand oil while
waiting on some yet-to-be-discovered magic "alternative" fuel would
be asinine.
And, of course, while that's true on building "clean site" refinery
capacity, actual capacity has more than double in that time frame by
combinations of expansion and process improvement. *So, while it's
important that new refinery capacity be built, the significant factor
of the proposed facility is that it will be processing shale oil.

"alternative energy" will become available as it becomes economically
viable, not before, in large quantities, anyway.

It is worth noting Denmark's successful energy independence
program......following the original oil price shocks of the 70's they
embarked on a very serious plan to avoid foreign energy sources(a then 99%
dependency). With little doubt they succeeded in freeing from the grip of
the OPEC oil cartel......They now lead in windmill technology (20% of
domestic electricity production) and use other renewable including solar,
biomass and thermal ......Drilling for North sea oil did help just a
little since they now export oil and they do have the highest electric and
gasoline($10 gal) cost of western Europe. Houses have fewer appliances,
families have fewer cars and mass transit is very popular in their tiny
country. People there do a remarkable job of conserving energy, somehow
with that choice between heating ones home and eating......food usually
wins. Rod

* *I'm having a hard time buying that definition of "successful". *The
highest electric and gasoline costs in western Europe makes them
successful? *

--
If you're going to be dumb, you better be tough

Give it up, Mark. People are laughing behind your back.

Mark & Juanita wrote in
:

snip

I'm having a hard time buying that definition of "successful". The
highest electric and gasoline costs in western Europe makes them
successful?

Yes, it makes them independent of outside energy sources. Denmark is still
a successful economy, albeit small.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

"Mark & Juanita" wrote in message
...
Rod & Betty Jo wrote:

dpb wrote:
Lew Hodgett wrote:
...
You are probably not going to like this response, but it is reality.

There has not been a "grass roots" refinery built in the USA in over
30 years, and hopefully, there will NEVER be another built, at least
until after some usable form of alternate energy is developed.
...
That's sheer stupidity...to not process shale or sand oil while
waiting on some yet-to-be-discovered magic "alternative" fuel would
be asinine.
And, of course, while that's true on building "clean site" refinery
capacity, actual capacity has more than double in that time frame by
combinations of expansion and process improvement. So, while it's
important that new refinery capacity be built, the significant factor
of the proposed facility is that it will be processing shale oil.

"alternative energy" will become available as it becomes economically
viable, not before, in large quantities, anyway.


It is worth noting Denmark's successful energy independence
program......following the original oil price shocks of the 70's they
embarked on a very serious plan to avoid foreign energy sources(a then
99%
dependency). With little doubt they succeeded in freeing from the grip of
the OPEC oil cartel......They now lead in windmill technology (20% of
domestic electricity production) and use other renewable including solar,
biomass and thermal ......Drilling for North sea oil did help just a
little since they now export oil and they do have the highest electric
and
gasoline($10 gal) cost of western Europe. Houses have fewer appliances,
families have fewer cars and mass transit is very popular in their tiny
country. People there do a remarkable job of conserving energy, somehow
with that choice between heating ones home and eating......food usually
wins. Rod

I'm having a hard time buying that definition of "successful". The
highest electric and gasoline costs in western Europe makes them
successful?


It was very clearly successful....the are energy independent from foreign
sources of energy (by drilling ironically) and lead in renewable including
windmills.....that they have the most unaffordable energy in the western
world is a small price (apparently) to pay for this success. As the approx.
model of the Dems energy program (without the drilling) I think this on
going expensive "success" should be clearly explainedG......I do
personally find it odd that the Dems solution to expensive gas/oil is more
expensive alternatives and a clear aversion to increasing said supply of
domestic oil........Rod