Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata

Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata
Not since 1984, but here's some info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconst...of_New_Orleans

Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Depends almost entirely on where. This for business or on a mission
project? I'd say that would make all the difference in the world.

Haven't been personally but talked w/ some folks returning from mission
work -- the worst of the worst areas are still quite bad and not getting
much better as many have simply abandoned the property. Cleanup in
these areas can still be pretty grim. The more affluent areas are
progressing reasonably well on the whole.

--

Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata
Was there last week. Wal-mart had re-opened that day that I took
"Devastation Tour" on Grey Line. We were told that less than half of
population had returned. Ninth ward area and St. Bernard Parish still
largely uninhabited. Large areas of closed malls and businesses. The
area is quite clean, but maybe that's due to the absence of people.
Downtown largely unaffected. Saw NO school children in 4 days there.
French Quarter still bustling. No foul odors or dead bodies. Be
forewarned...the locals down there consider this a MAN-MADE disaster
because the Army Corp. of Engineers wasn't doing its job, rather than a
natural disaster because the city is built in a bowl.

On Nov 20, 8:43 am, Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata

I'm not sure what aspects of the "situation" you want to know about.
I was down there for 60 days last January & February, and made a quick
trip down last Thursday/Friday.

If you're asking will you be able to find places to eat & sleep, yes,
no problem. Most businesses are back up and running. You could go
downtown and wonder what all the fuss was about.

But when you go out into the neighborhoods, it's a different story.
Rich and poor alike, many homes still stand abandoned and waiting.
Waiting for insurance suits to settle, waiting for the owners to see
what the neighbors are going to do before they commit the resources.
Waiting to earn enough money to buy another pickup load of
sheetrock.

Violent crime is way up, and New Orleans already had a high crime
rate. But it's mostly concentrated in areas your volunteer
coordinators will keep you out of. Last January, I was involved in a
minor fender-bender caused by a red light that wasn't working. We
called the police dispatcher 3 times over a period of 1 hour and 45
minutes without ever seeing a patrolman. Finally, we just left the
scene without an accident report. The insurance company was
surprisingly understanding.

DonkeyHody
"Never kick a pulling mule."

"rich brenz" wrote in message
...
Renata wrote:
Be
forewarned...the locals down there consider this a MAN-MADE disaster
because the Army Corp. of Engineers wasn't doing its job, rather than a
natural disaster because the city is built in a bowl.

I'll have to agree to some extent. The bowl effect was just waiting to
happen however the city did reasonably well during the storm. It was the
failed levies and or dikes after the storm that caused 95% of the damage.

I live there and all I can say is,if it weren't for the volunteers
coming down to help rebuild, the New Orleans of the past would never
recover. What we need is to take the local, state and federal government
totally out of the rebuilding equation and turn it over the the
volunteers and the many church groups that have been down here giving
their heart and souls into the recovery projects.

Cooniedog

Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata

I live there and all I can say is,if it weren't for the volunteers
coming down to help rebuild, the New Orleans of the past would never
recover. What we need is to take the local, state and federal government
totally out of the rebuilding equation and turn it over the the
volunteers and the many church groups that have been down here giving
their heart and souls into the recovery projects.

Cooniedog

Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata

Be forewarned...the locals down there consider this a MAN-MADE disaster
because the Army Corp. of Engineers wasn't doing its job, rather than a
natural disaster because the city is built in a bowl.

The Corps of Engineers has become a convenient whipping-boy for a
system that failed on every level. Yes, the Corps has admitted that
some of the levee failures were a result of design deficiencies. The
people who designed those levees have mosly died of old age by now.
But other levees were simply overtopped and washed away. The end
result wouldn't have been much different if the levees that had design
failures had held.

Many people don't understand that projects such as levees are funded
directly by Congress with funds earmarked for the purpose. The Corps
has been sounding the alarm for 25 years that I know about that New
Orleans could not survive a major hurricane. Congress chose to gamble
that strengthening the levees could wait until other priorities were
taken care of. With the benefit of hindsight we can see that they
waited too late and lost the gamble.

Some local government agencies spent federal funds meant to maintain
levees on other things. But that didn't cause the problem either.

Yes, I have worked for the Corps for 27 years. I'm still proud that I
do.

DonkeyHody
"Never kick a pulling mule."

On Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:43:23 -0500, Renata
wrote:

Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata
I gave up on NO when the mayor announced on national TV that it was to
be a "chocolate city" and ****ed away millions on the cleanup. Houston
sucks up high crime rates on the migration from there when the
city/state gov't ignored the poverty areas in the evacuation. Why
restore something below sea level when they don't try to protect
themselves. The poverty areas remain lacking because the local gov't
doesn't want those people back! Leave 'em in Texas. Nope used to
travel there two or three times a year but never more!

Leon wrote:
"rich brenz" wrote in message
...
Renata wrote:
Be
forewarned...the locals down there consider this a MAN-MADE disaster
because the Army Corp. of Engineers wasn't doing its job, rather than a
natural disaster because the city is built in a bowl.

I'll have to agree to some extent. The bowl effect was just waiting to
happen however the city did reasonably well during the storm. It was the
failed levies and or dikes after the storm that caused 95% of the damage.


The NO locals will also vehemently tell you that it wasn't the levees
that failed...they were all intact. It was the floodwalls inside the
levees that collapsed. On our tour, we were shown the removed defective
floodwall pilings which were 22' long and the new replacement pilings
that were 72' long. The only problem was that the pilings that failed,
appeared to have been bent over AT ground level, and the remaining
buried component performed as expected. Granted, we only saw what they
wanted us to see on the tour, but the guides sure couldn't handle our
questions. The locals are also under the misunderstanding that IF the
flood pumps had been closer to Lake Ponchartrain, then they could have
handled the floodwaters. The sad fact though, was that the lake was
already breaching the levees above flood stage, and a 15-20' storm surge
was heading up the Mississippi river in the opposite direction, trapping
NO in the middle. They'd have been better off to just shut the pumps off.

"eyeclinic" wrote in message
...
Leon wrote:


The NO locals will also vehemently tell you that it wasn't the levees that
failed...they were all intact. It was the floodwalls inside the levees
that collapsed.

I suspect that the locals did not do much television watching as in Houston
we saw news coverage of the water going through a levee with bull dozers
trying to fill the breach with dirt. There were no gates.

eyeclinic wrote:
Leon wrote:
"rich brenz" wrote in message
...
Renata wrote:
Be
forewarned...the locals down there consider this a MAN-MADE disaster
because the Army Corp. of Engineers wasn't doing its job, rather than
a natural disaster because the city is built in a bowl.

I'll have to agree to some extent. The bowl effect was just waiting
to happen however the city did reasonably well during the storm. It
was the failed levies and or dikes after the storm that caused 95% of
the damage.

The NO locals will also vehemently tell you that it wasn't the levees
that failed...they were all intact. It was the floodwalls inside the
levees that collapsed. On our tour, we were shown the removed defective
floodwall pilings which were 22' long and the new replacement pilings
that were 72' long. The only problem was that the pilings that failed,
appeared to have been bent over AT ground level, and the remaining
buried component performed as expected. Granted, we only saw what they
wanted us to see on the tour, but the guides sure couldn't handle our
questions. The locals are also under the misunderstanding that IF the
flood pumps had been closer to Lake Ponchartrain, then they could have
handled the floodwaters. The sad fact though, was that the lake was
already breaching the levees above flood stage, and a 15-20' storm surge
was heading up the Mississippi river in the opposite direction, trapping
NO in the middle. They'd have been better off to just shut the pumps off.

As a lifelong resident of the New Orleans area, I just love it when
people around the country take the attitude that "those people are
stupid for living in a bowl". Many millions of people in southern
California live in close proximity to a major fault line. Will those
same people be saying that Los Angeles should not be rebuilt if a major
earthquake hits? FWIW, the Mississippi gulf coast was completely
devastated by Katrina as well. I guess people just should not live
within 200 miles of the coast, right? :-)

The most devastating portion of the flooding in New Orleans was caused
by the failure of the floodwall on the 17th Street canal. Investigation
showed that the sheet piling were not as long as the original specs
called for. Engineers also misjudged the stability of the soil at
certain depths. Failure actually occurred from underneath the pilings
when the pressure of the full canal caused a blowout of the soft soil at
the base, tilting the tops of sheet piles inward and allowing water to
spill over the top.

As to the original question about conditions here, it is a tale of two
cities. Downtown and the tourist areas are business as usual. Most
visitors would never notice anything had happened unless they purposely
tour the damaged areas. The suburbs on the western edge of the city are
pretty much back to normal as well. But there are many square miles of
former residential areas in the east, 9th ward, and Lakeview that are
still devastated.

And Renata, if you are concerned about crime from things you've heard,
99% of that is drug related. If you are not buying or selling drugs, you
are as safe as any other major city.

On Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:43:23 -0500, Renata
wrote:

Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.
I get over there about every 6 weeks and I actually enjoy it more than
I used to . Rates are going up but you can still stay in the Quarter
for $100 or less and it's not nearly as crowded or dirty as it used to
be. I still feel safe in the Quarter but stay between Bourbon and the
river. We had the crime problem here in Houston and still do but a lot
of the low lifes are moving back so crime has increased there as well.
Just watch where you go and stay out of the drug traffic and you
should be fine. If you've never been, you should take the opportunity
- it's a unique city with great food and good folks. As mentioned in
other posts, if you go east you will see a lot of destruction and
little progress. It's sad that Mississippi and other parts of the gulf
coast are steadily rebuilding while NO sits around waiting for someone
else to do it for them. If you go, have a great trip.

Thank you all for the replies.

I was asked to join a (I think) church group going down to help out in
the recovery efforts, for a week. We'll be doing construction or
destruction - whatever they powers that be assign.

I was pretty sure that the tourist areas are fine, but am concerned
about the conditions where folks are doing what we'll be doing. Not
crime so much as health related conditions.

Again, thanx for the insights and advice!

Renata

Renata wrote in
:

Thank you all for the replies.

I was asked to join a (I think) church group going down to help out in
the recovery efforts, for a week. We'll be doing construction or
destruction - whatever they powers that be assign.

I was pretty sure that the tourist areas are fine, but am concerned
about the conditions where folks are doing what we'll be doing. Not
crime so much as health related conditions.

Again, thanx for the insights and advice!

Renata

I applaud your intentions! Some of the poorer folks in NO deserve all
the help they can get.

Personally I hate wearing gloves and masks for work - my hands have a
tendency to sweat, especially with latex gloves, and I have a beard that
interferes with breathing masks. Still, when I work with blood and
noxious chemicals I do wear what's needed. I would advise to be cautous
when doing demolition and to wear precautions, especially respiratory
protection.

YMMV!
--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

On Nov 25, 12:16 pm, Han wrote:

Personally I hate wearing gloves and masks for work - my hands have a
tendency to sweat, especially with latex gloves, and I have a beard that
interferes with breathing masks. Still, when I work with blood and
noxious chemicals I do wear what's needed. I would advise to be cautous
when doing demolition and to wear precautions, especially respiratory
protection.

It might be wise to invest in a PAPR unit. They're the belt-worn-
battery operated, HEPA filtered breathing masks that pump purified air
into the mask. You can get them with full face masks, half face, or
hoods with plastic full face shields. By far the best protection.

R

I was there in March for a real long weekend trip.

Downtown is not physically hurt with the exception of
unrepaired building that have been falling down for
quite some time. The closer you move out toward the
river, the more damage you see.

We didn't visit the 9th ward area, but it was very
apparent that it was not going to be fixed any time soon.

Downtown was clean and going just about like normal.

The outskirts toward Mississippi really got a fair amount
of damage.

Mississippi was completely screwed as far as I can tell.

New Orleans got a lot of air time, but to really see
things, you need to see the Mississippi coast up to
around Biloxi.

Those folks got wiped clean for about one mile back
from the Gulf. I'm talking about a stretch of area
about 90 miles in length.

It'as just gone.



Renata wrote:
Have an opportunity to go down in early January to participate in
destruction/construction activities. Not sure what sort of situation
exists down there.

Any insights?

Thanx
Renata