We just moved into our new (renovated) house. The kitchen has a
pantry, without shelves. I need to get something up quick, and do to
moving and putting everything in my workshop, my tools are not
available. So, I went to Home Depot and had them cut me up 2 4x8
sheets of 3/4" melamine into 6 74.5"x16" and 6 35"x16" shelves. Upon
further reflection I am going to have them cut some more for me and
put 12"x16" dividers up the middle of the long run, and 6 more to
support where the short run butt's up against them. The room is
74.5"x51" with a 24" pocket door on the narrow end. I plan on nailing
1x3" around the back and sides for support. So, the question is, do
you think the 37" run from the wall to the first divider is too long?
Will there be enough strength here? Also, any ideas about bettering
this, without a table saw, is appreciated.

In article .com, jtpr wrote:
We just moved into our new (renovated) house. The kitchen has a
pantry, without shelves. I need to get something up quick, and do to
moving and putting everything in my workshop, my tools are not
available. So, I went to Home Depot and had them cut me up 2 4x8
sheets of 3/4" melamine into 6 74.5"x16" and 6 35"x16" shelves. Upon
further reflection I am going to have them cut some more for me and
put 12"x16" dividers up the middle of the long run, and 6 more to
support where the short run butt's up against them. The room is
74.5"x51" with a 24" pocket door on the narrow end. I plan on nailing
1x3" around the back and sides for support. So, the question is, do
you think the 37" run from the wall to the first divider is too long?
Will there be enough strength here? Also, any ideas about bettering
this, without a table saw, is appreciated.

I'm not a big fan of melamine and so I would have used ply with
something like a Formica laminate on the top surface and exposed
edges. Much more durable.

As for the 37in span... it will probably work for a while if
you place light items there (e.g. breakfast cerial and NOT
drinks or canned foods).

But with heavier food items it will probably sag over time.
For a quick fix, I'd consider screwing and gluing one or two
strips of "T" section steel to the underside of the shelf to
provide some reinforcement. It's not terribly pretty/elegent
but it will add a fair bit of strength at low cost and with
minimal hand tools.



--
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". |
| Gary Player. |
| http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

jtpr wrote:
We just moved into our new (renovated) house. The kitchen has a
pantry, without shelves. I need to get something up quick, and do
to moving and putting everything in my workshop, my tools are not
available. So, I went to Home Depot and had them cut me up 2 4x8
sheets of 3/4" melamine into 6 74.5"x16" and 6 35"x16" shelves.
Upon further reflection I am going to have them cut some more for
me and put 12"x16" dividers up the middle of the long run, and 6
more to support where the short run butt's up against them. The
room is
74.5"x51" with a 24" pocket door on the narrow end. I plan on
nailing 1x3" around the back and sides for support. So, the
question is, do you think the 37" run from the wall to the first
divider is too long? Will there be enough strength here? Also, any
ideas about bettering this, without a table saw, is appreciated.

Whether 37" will be OK depends totally on what you put on it. Yes, it
should be OK with normal stuff, no it will sag if you fill it with
canned goods stacked 2-3 high. The biggest mel shelves I have are
16"x48" and loaded with sheets and the like. They are fine.

The biggest problem I see for your shelves is the width. I understand
why people want wide ones - they can put more stuff on them; trouble
is, the stuff you want winds up at the back behind lots of other
stuff. The best width for pantry shelves is wide enough to accomodate
something two deep. That means 4-6" for most things. One area of
deeper shelves for things like aluminum foil rolls is nice but the
depth of even those shelves need only be somewhat over half the length
of the stored object...it can overhang the shelf.

The other problem with your shelf width is that it severally restricts
access to the area. If you subtract two tiers of 16" shelving from
the room width of 51" you are left with only 19" of aisle space. Not
comfy. If it were me I'd take the boards back and get them skinnied
down...I'd use 8-10" width shelves on one side, maybe 6" on the other.
Instead of 1x3 strips I'd make two stand up cases, one for each
side...top and bottom affixed to ends and dividers, ends and dividers
drilled for KV shelf clips. More work, better result. IMO, YMMV. If
you did the cases they would need horizontal nailing boards across the
back at the top so that they could be fastened to the wall.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

On Nov 14, 7:18 am, "dadiOH" wrote:
jtpr wrote:
We just moved into our new (renovated) house. The kitchen has a
pantry, without shelves. I need to get something up quick, and do
to moving and putting everything in my workshop, my tools are not
available. So, I went to Home Depot and had them cut me up 2 4x8
sheets of 3/4" melamine into 6 74.5"x16" and 6 35"x16" shelves.
Upon further reflection I am going to have them cut some more for
me and put 12"x16" dividers up the middle of the long run, and 6
more to support where the short run butt's up against them. The
room is
74.5"x51" with a 24" pocket door on the narrow end. I plan on
nailing 1x3" around the back and sides for support. So, the
question is, do you think the 37" run from the wall to the first
divider is too long? Will there be enough strength here? Also, any
ideas about bettering this, without a table saw, is appreciated.

Whether 37" will be OK depends totally on what you put on it. Yes, it
should be OK with normal stuff, no it will sag if you fill it with
canned goods stacked 2-3 high. The biggest mel shelves I have are
16"x48" and loaded with sheets and the like. They are fine.

The biggest problem I see for your shelves is the width. I understand
why people want wide ones - they can put more stuff on them; trouble
is, the stuff you want winds up at the back behind lots of other
stuff. The best width for pantry shelves is wide enough to accomodate
something two deep. That means 4-6" for most things. One area of
deeper shelves for things like aluminum foil rolls is nice but the
depth of even those shelves need only be somewhat over half the length
of the stored object...it can overhang the shelf.

The other problem with your shelf width is that it severally restricts
access to the area. If you subtract two tiers of 16" shelving from
the room width of 51" you are left with only 19" of aisle space. Not
comfy. If it were me I'd take the boards back and get them skinnied
down...I'd use 8-10" width shelves on one side, maybe 6" on the other.
Instead of 1x3 strips I'd make two stand up cases, one for each
side...top and bottom affixed to ends and dividers, ends and dividers
drilled for KV shelf clips. More work, better result. IMO, YMMV. If
you did the cases they would need horizontal nailing boards across the
back at the top so that they could be fastened to the wall.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it athttp://mysite.verizon.net/xico

I should have been clearer about the layout. I am only putting the
long shelves on one side with the short ones on the end. "L" shaped.
This is because the entryway is a pocket door, so it is 4' wide, 2' of
wall, 2'' of door. So when you enter the empty wall is on your right,
the shelves on your left and the opposite end.

I know what you mean about the width. I guess I'm doing it to
maximize space in a small house. Hopefully during the next year I
will have my workshop all set up and I can get something nice built.
I only spent $100 on the material, and can recycle it into the shop.

Thanks,
Jim

On Nov 14, 11:53 am, jtpr wrote:
On Nov 14, 7:18 am, "dadiOH" wrote:





jtpr wrote:
We just moved into our new (renovated) house. The kitchen has a
pantry, without shelves. I need to get something up quick, and do
to moving and putting everything in my workshop, my tools are not
available. So, I went to Home Depot and had them cut me up 2 4x8
sheets of 3/4" melamine into 6 74.5"x16" and 6 35"x16" shelves.
Upon further reflection I am going to have them cut some more for
me and put 12"x16" dividers up the middle of the long run, and 6
more to support where the short run butt's up against them. The
room is
74.5"x51" with a 24" pocket door on the narrow end. I plan on
nailing 1x3" around the back and sides for support. So, the
question is, do you think the 37" run from the wall to the first
divider is too long? Will there be enough strength here? Also, any
ideas about bettering this, without a table saw, is appreciated.

Whether 37" will be OK depends totally on what you put on it. Yes, it
should be OK with normal stuff, no it will sag if you fill it with
canned goods stacked 2-3 high. The biggest mel shelves I have are
16"x48" and loaded with sheets and the like. They are fine.

The biggest problem I see for your shelves is the width. I understand
why people want wide ones - they can put more stuff on them; trouble
is, the stuff you want winds up at the back behind lots of other
stuff. The best width for pantry shelves is wide enough to accomodate
something two deep. That means 4-6" for most things. One area of
deeper shelves for things like aluminum foil rolls is nice but the
depth of even those shelves need only be somewhat over half the length
of the stored object...it can overhang the shelf.

The other problem with your shelf width is that it severally restricts
access to the area. If you subtract two tiers of 16" shelving from
the room width of 51" you are left with only 19" of aisle space. Not
comfy. If it were me I'd take the boards back and get them skinnied
down...I'd use 8-10" width shelves on one side, maybe 6" on the other.
Instead of 1x3 strips I'd make two stand up cases, one for each
side...top and bottom affixed to ends and dividers, ends and dividers
drilled for KV shelf clips. More work, better result. IMO, YMMV. If
you did the cases they would need horizontal nailing boards across the
back at the top so that they could be fastened to the wall.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
...a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it athttp://mysite.verizon.net/xico

I should have been clearer about the layout. I am only putting the
long shelves on one side with the short ones on the end. "L" shaped.
This is because the entryway is a pocket door, so it is 4' wide, 2' of
wall, 2'' of door. So when you enter the empty wall is on your right,
the shelves on your left and the opposite end.

I know what you mean about the width. I guess I'm doing it to
maximize space in a small house. Hopefully during the next year I
will have my workshop all set up and I can get something nice built.
I only spent $100 on the material, and can recycle it into the shop.

Thanks,
Jim- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Nuts, I just realized something else, the pocket door. I won't have
any studs to hang one end of the shelve to will I? Oh boy...

jtpr wrote:

Nuts, I just realized something else, the pocket door. I won't have
any studs to hang one end of the shelve to will I? Oh boy...

I wouldn't call them "studs" but pocket door frames generally have
1x3s or 4s here and there...

http://www.johnsonhardware.com/2000.htm

http://furiousgeorge.typepad.com/pho...s/pd_frame.jpg
(it is lying down sideways)



dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

dadiOH wrote:
jtpr wrote:

Nuts, I just realized something else, the pocket door. I won't
have any studs to hang one end of the shelve to will I? Oh boy...

I wouldn't call them "studs" but pocket door frames generally have
1x3s or 4s here and there...

http://www.johnsonhardware.com/2000.htm

http://furiousgeorge.typepad.com/pho...s/pd_frame.jpg
(it is lying down sideways)

And if worse comes to worse you should be able to get a screw into the
stud where the two walls meet. That and a molly bolt in the drywall
will work if you can find a place for the molly where it doesn't go
through enough to hit the pocket door. If not, a couple of short #8
screws just into the drywall (plus a screw to corner stud) should be
OK if you slather the back side of the support with acrylic caulk and
let it set up well.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:07:34 -0800, jtpr wrote:

Nuts, I just realized something else, the pocket door. I won't have
any studs to hang one end of the shelve to will I? Oh boy...

There should be a half stud in the middle of the pocket.
Personally I'm not at all fond of hanging shelving on them and will
normally run a bulkhead to the floor against the wall that has a
pocket. You can attach the bulkhead above the header and normally
down the back corner as there should be a nailer for the sheet rock at
the back end of the pocket. Measure to be sure. If you have base
board there, it'll have to come off. Then put your end cleats on your
bulkhead.
Be careful when installing the shelves because even with a bulkhead
you can pinch the pocket if your shelves are too long or something is
out of square.

Mike O.

On Nov 14, 9:56 pm, Mike O. wrote:
On Wed, 14 Nov 2007 13:07:34 -0800, jtpr wrote:
Nuts, I just realized something else, the pocket door. I won't have
any studs to hang one end of the shelve to will I? Oh boy...

There should be a half stud in the middle of the pocket.
Personally I'm not at all fond of hanging shelving on them and will
normally run a bulkhead to the floor against the wall that has a
pocket. You can attach the bulkhead above the header and normally
down the back corner as there should be a nailer for the sheet rock at
the back end of the pocket. Measure to be sure. If you have base
board there, it'll have to come off. Then put your end cleats on your
bulkhead.
Be careful when installing the shelves because even with a bulkhead
you can pinch the pocket if your shelves are too long or something is
out of square.

Mike O.

Mike, thank you. But I'm not sure what you mean by a bulkhead. Are
you saying I should install a stud exterior to the wall attaching it
to the header and footer?

Sorry for being dense...

-Jim

Tue, Nov 13, 2007, 8:48pm (EST+5) (jtpr) doth query:
snip Also, any ideas about bettering this, without a table saw, is
appreciated.

I have no use at all for Home Depot. I put in some helves in my
laundry room by using steel shelf brackets, and 1"X13" pine. And, cut
the dry wall between some of the studs, then glued in polywood pieces to
make shalves - my only regred is I didn't do even more. Works great for
canned goods.



JOAT
The whole of life is a learning process.
- John Keel

On Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:06:55 -0800 (PST), jtpr
wrote:

Mike, thank you. But I'm not sure what you mean by a bulkhead. Are
you saying I should install a stud exterior to the wall attaching it
to the header and footer?

Run a piece of material, something as wide or wider than your shelves
(your shelving material would work), vertically against the wall with
the pocket. You can nail it above the pocket track (if you go that
high) and/or at the back corner if there is a nailer. You may not
have a plate at the bottom but if you do, you should be able to see it
under the door.
So if you can imagine, a piece of shelving running up the wall. This
is your bulkhead. Instead of nailing end cleats to the sheet rock on
the pocket door wall, nail the cleats to the bulkhead.
The idea is to avoid hanging the shelves from the pocket wall. The
bulkhead will carry that end of your shelves.

Mike O.