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New Shop Wiring?
Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is
it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
I would run conduit across the ceiling and have recepticals hanging down
on cords. I would thing that outlets in the floor would be a problem with sawdust and dirt getting in the plugs. Of course, there are ways to prevent that. wrote: Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
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New Shop Wiring?
I'm getting ready to build a shop too.
I'll be putting some outlets in the floor. I value the airspace overhead too much to have power drops from above. use conduit in the slab. if I think I can get away with it I'll also run a couple of 4" sewer lines through the slab- one for dust collection, the other to run an air hose through. |
New Shop Wiring? Another way
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New Shop Wiring? Another way
Lew Hodgett wrote in
link.net: If you must have your utilities in the concrete floor, then have the concrete guys form a utility gutter in the floor, say 6"-8" wide, 3"-4" deep, covered by a removable steel grate. Lay conduits, water lines, airlines, whatever in the gutter, then cover with grate. You now have a way of servicing these utility feeds, if necessary. Definitely a more costly type of construction. Lew Sounds like a good idea. Do the grates have holes large enough for the more temporary runs of things like air hoses and extension cords? How many service calls do you think it would cost to justify the extra cost? Puckdropper -- Wise is the man who attempts to answer his question before asking it. To email me directly, send a message to puckdropper (at) fastmail.fm |
New Shop Wiring?
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New Shop Wiring?
I juse went with the overhead route in my new woodshop. If your shop
doesn't double as a garage, then I see no problem with power in the floor, other than the cost. If the floor is likely to ever get wet, I see problems. Oh yeh--- my shop equipment is never in the position I origianlly put it in when I built it. So, think carefully about power outlet location or you will be tripping over cords even worse than with extension cords from the wall. Pete Stanaitis ----------------- wrote: Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
If your table saw is going to be in a fixed position and not moved, and you
know where it will be, put a conduit in for it along with a tube for dust removal. Don't forget that the edges of the building will need to have conduits installed in order to get the power lines, telephone, networking, cable TV, water, drains and any thing else that you can think of. If you are installing these lines underground you don't want to have to exit through and down the outside of the wall if you can have the pipes and conduits installed from underground through the concrete into the soleplate of the wall -- keeps things much neater. As I mentioned above, install a rough-in for virtually anything that you MAY or may not use at a later date. It will simplify life later on if you want to actually add these things. You never know what you will want in the future, enough options will make the addition of something that doesn't even exist today much simpler. I built a storage shed about 25 years ago with a couple of tubes installed through the foundation for power or whatever. Two years ago I ran a power line out to the shed, these tubes made for a simple installation. I was so glad that I had installed them years ago. wrote in message ... Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
wrote in message ... Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? I would not put outlets in the floor. My shop is 18 x 25, a bit smaller tha yours will be and I strongly suggest that you still put all heavy equipment on mobile bases. For my 220 volt tools I use a 30" 10 gauge extension cord for my TS, BSm and Planer. IMHO the extenwion cord is very handy and easy to deal with. You can always have a lot of room available if you use mobile bases. Currently I have my large machines around the perimeter of the room and simply pull out the one that I need to use. At night my wife's car comes in. |
New Shop Wiring?
wrote in message ... Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? Don't forget your **** tube. |
New Shop Wiring?
The only shop that has a permanent layout is the one in the picture in a
book. I agree on drops from the ceiling. While my shop is in the basement, all my drops 110 & 220 mid floor are from the ceiling. The one item that most people forget is the small visitors to the shop. I have a disconnect that allows me to kill the power to all the floor machines. This prevents unwanted events when unsupervised folks wander in the shop during a party or such. No one ever plans to have a accident. But it is just a little harder to have one without power. A master kill switch by the door to the shop is a one time expense. All the should haves, could haves, and would haves never erase much. Good luck Paul wrote in message ... Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
"goaway" wrote The one item that most people forget is the small visitors to the shop. I have a disconnect that allows me to kill the power to all the floor machines. This prevents unwanted events when unsupervised folks wander in the shop during a party or such. No one ever plans to have a accident. But it is just a little harder to have one without power. A master kill switch by the door to the shop is a one time expense. All the should haves, could haves, and would haves never erase much. I agree and have done this with more than one shop. One idea that I saw carried this out even further. He had a master swith that killed the intire shop. It had a lock on it. He kept having kids "wander" into his shop. They even crawled into a window. He put bars on the window and shut off all power. He also installed a much better lock on the door. He said the kids soon lost interest if it was dark and locked. If I tried to do that as a youngster, I would have got a severe beating. But that just isn't politically correct these days. |
New Shop Wiring? Another way
Puckdropper wrote:
Sounds like a good idea. Do the grates have holes large enough for the more temporary runs of things like air hoses and extension cords? How many service calls do you think it would cost to justify the extra cost? Use standard grating which is available in various size openings. Grating can be either steel or fiberglass. Lifting the grating on a regular basis would get to be a total PITA, in a hurry, IMHO. Lew |
New Shop Wiring?
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New Shop Wiring? Another way
On Mon, 04 Jun 2007 05:44:06 GMT, Lew Hodgett
wrote: Definitely a more costly type of construction. Possibly so, but it sure beats the s**t out of walking/tripping over power/extension cords. I've had it both ways and there's no way I'd voluntarily return to the wall plug arrangement. Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA |
New Shop Wiring? Another way
On 04 Jun 2007 09:21:25 GMT, Puckdropper
wrote: How many service calls do you think it would cost to justify the extra cost? Forget service calls. The justification is in the convenience of not having power cords (even with the little 'bridges') laying all over the floor. Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA |
New Shop Wiring?
On Mon, 04 Jun 2007 04:17:58 GMT, Lew Hodgett
wrote: It's not practical, you want to make overhead cable drops. I have to disagree. Completely practical. That's the way my shop is set up, and I wouldn't have it any other way. IMO, overhead cable drops are an even bigger nuisance than cords all over the floor going to wall outlets. I even have my dust collection duct runs under the floor to avoid the obstructions of stuff hanging from the ceiling. Tom Veatch Wichita, KS USA |
New Shop Wiring?
Tom Veatch wrote:
I have to disagree. Completely practical. That's the way my shop is set up, and I wouldn't have it any other way. IMO, overhead cable drops are an even bigger nuisance than cords all over the floor going to wall outlets. I even have my dust collection duct runs under the floor to avoid the obstructions of stuff hanging from the ceiling. Whatever floats your boat. Lew |
New Shop Wiring?
In my past life, I was an architect and worked with a lot of manufacturing
plants and offices for a period of time. Never put anything in a concrete floor unless absolutely unavoidable and then still had problems: 1. Water and mess getting into the outlets. Solution, put them up on pedestals above the floor line. Leads to problem 2. 2. No matter how carefully you located the outlet so it is covered by the machine and not a hazard, the machine will be moved later just enough (8" or so) to expose outlet and make it a tripping hazard. Same is true for outlets under the desk. 3. It is almost impossible to add circuits and or make conduit bigger, without jackhammering the concrete. A trench in the floor is a PITA. A covered trench in the floor is a slightly smaller PITA. Take a look in a McDonald's kitchen. It's all drop cords, with twist lock plugs. If I rewired my shop, I'd do it like a theater lighting bridge. I'd run a couple of conduits on the ceiling the length of the shop spaced about 8' to 10' apart, with several circuits in them. About every 6-8' put a 4-plex outlet for each circuit. Also have some screw eyes or something similar to support cords. To connect a machine, run a heavy duty cord up from the machine to the nearest outlet, coil the extra cord, and hang it from the ceiling. Obviously, locate the cords to they don't get caught in operations. When its time to move, unplug and repeat the process. Now you've got so much advice, I'm sure you are more confused than you were before you posted. Good on you for building a new shop! Old Guy wrote in message ... Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
"Lee Michaels" wrote in message ... If I tried to do that as a youngster, I would have got a severe beating. But that just isn't politically correct these days. No kidding. LOL. apparently not learning from your mistakes "IS" politically correct these days. |
New Shop Wiring?
Old guy wrote:
snip why not a trench If I rewired my shop, I'd do it like a theater lighting bridge. I'd run a couple of conduits on the ceiling the length of the shop spaced about 8' to 10' apart, with several circuits in them. About every 6-8' put a 4-plex outlet for each circuit. snip By the time you get all that pipe and wire in place, you could have had busway installed for the same $ and half the time. Made a living winning that comparison discussion for many years almost every time out of the box. Matter of fact, don't remember losing one. Lew |
New Shop Wiring?
On Jun 3, 11:40 pm, wrote:
Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. Listen to the architect. put your lighting circuit and power runs in pipe in the ceiling and along the wall (about 40" above the floor for the wall outlets). Put your lighting and the top two wall outlets on a 3-Way (4-way) switched circuit (so you can control the lighting and transformers (battery chargers come to mind) from any entrance (I have a switch on either side of the overhead door (for instance - talk about lazy) as well as adjacent the "man" doors. Also have a 220VAC Kill switch setup to keep the compressor from disturbing the wife "People are sleeping!" she screams in the wee hours. I like the idea of running conduit under the slab, but have to admit folks here dissuaded me. The folks who suggest running cable and 10Base-T into the shop are my kind of people. Also like the **** Tube suggestion - especially now that I'm at that age! I piped in the stereo the other day "Ahhh, Bach!." and intend to run coax and ethernet as well. Best time to do it is when you first build out. MOISTURE PROOF THE SLAB REGARDLESS! Add an extra run of block height is nice, but raising the roof or lowering an existing slab is tough work after the fact! I like my windows high up for better ventilation - but no scientific evidence on that. Privacy, yes. Neighbors' peace, maybe improved. Not sure about running dust collection under a slab, however. Temperature changes are likely to create condensation, no? Would this not impede the desired flow? Result in blockage issues? I would think the air laden with sawdust would be at a higher temp than the slab (any buried pipes within) . . . Again, no scientific evidence nor actual experience save with cold moist slab here! Oh, yes, I suggest using plug-in fluorescent work lights. At about $9 for fixture and two bulbs (I buy 'em by the case), they are cheaper to replace than a ballast. Instead of hard wired fixtures or Keyless, I simply put in a duplex outlet with one side switched and another always on. Then, each light fixture can serve as a ceiling drop (right under the light!) and replacing a bad fixture is simply a matter of unhooking the chains and pulling the plug. "Twenty-four by Twenty-four" - "Hmmm, sure your name isn't "Norm?" Good luck How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
"Old guy" wrote in message:
.. | Never put anything in a concrete floor unless absolutely unavoidable and | then still had problems: respectfully snipped| Amen to every point you made. Nuff said woodstuff |
New Shop Wiring?
One thing I did in my shop was to put the outlets in the walls
up 4-1/2 feet. The electrical inspector said that while it was legal, he was curious why they were that high. I explained that I could lean 4 * 8 sheets against the walls and still get to the outlets ... he replied "hey good idea -- I'm going to do that in my shop!". Something to think about. mikey "spaco" wrote in message .. . I juse went with the overhead route in my new woodshop. If your shop doesn't double as a garage, then I see no problem with power in the floor, other than the cost. If the floor is likely to ever get wet, I see problems. Oh yeh--- my shop equipment is never in the position I origianlly put it in when I built it. So, think carefully about power outlet location or you will be tripping over cords even worse than with extension cords from the wall. Pete Stanaitis ----------------- wrote: Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
New Shop Wiring?
"woodstuff" wrote in message ... "Old guy" wrote in message: . | Never put anything in a concrete floor unless absolutely unavoidable and | then still had problems: respectfully snipped| Amen to every point you made. Nuff said woodstuff Only thing I have ever put in a concrete floor that I was glad I did was ... rebar :-) mikey |
New Shop Wiring?
Mike Fields, wrote the following at or about 6/8/2007 8:44 AM:
One thing I did in my shop was to put the outlets in the walls up 4-1/2 feet. The electrical inspector said that while it was legal, he was curious why they were that high. I explained that I could lean 4 * 8 sheets against the walls and still get to the outlets ... he replied "hey good idea -- I'm going to do that in my shop!". Something to think about. Hey, great minds think alike.g To be honest, I never really gave it any conscious thought that I can recall. I just seemed to me at the time, for a workshop, the ONLY place to spot the outlets was mid-wall, where they would be easily accessible over a workbench, stationary tool up against the wall, etc. Your logic is just one more in a loooooong list of reasons to do it that way. OTOH, out in the garage area - all the same construction project - I mixed it up with the majority of the outlets being a foot off the floor and the remainder at mid-wall. |
New Shop Wiring?
"Mike Fields" spam_me_not_mr.gadget2@comcastDOTnet writes:
"woodstuff" wrote in message ... "Old guy" wrote in message: . | Never put anything in a concrete floor unless absolutely unavoidable and | then still had problems: respectfully snipped| Amen to every point you made. Nuff said woodstuff Only thing I have ever put in a concrete floor that I was glad I did was ... rebar :-) mikey I'd be tempted to pick up a surplus computer room floor (tiles and supports), if the price were right. They're designed to hold a great deal of weight, and give you enough room beneath to route both dust collection and power (fluidtite or eq. flex conduit). And the suction cups are fun to play with :-) scott |
New Shop Wiring?
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New Shop Wiring?
In article ,
Scott Lurndal wrote: I'd be tempted to pick up a surplus computer room floor (tiles and supports), if the price were right. I've seen it available (not recently -- not in those circles these days) at prices of 'you haul it _all_ away'.` Isn't necessarily as good a deal as it sounds like -- the base of the risers is usually cemented to the floor; just removing them is a job-and-a-half. getting them up 'intact' is virtually *impossible*. They're designed to hold a great deal of weight, and give you enough room beneath to route both dust collection and power (fluidtite or eq. flex conduit). And the suction cups are fun to play with :-) One *does* tend to get strange looks, at least from the uninitiated, when you ask what they did with the 'keys to the floor'. grin And you _don't_ get into that space without a key. The only good news is that all the floors like that _are_ "keyed alike" -- getting a replacement key is no big deal except for the cost. |
New Shop Wiring?
That is an *excellent* idea. You, my friend, are very smart.
-- Bob the Tomato On Fri, 8 Jun 2007 06:44:51 -0700, "Mike Fields" spam_me_not_mr.gadget2@comcastDOTnet wrote: One thing I did in my shop was to put the outlets in the walls up 4-1/2 feet. The electrical inspector said that while it was legal, he was curious why they were that high. I explained that I could lean 4 * 8 sheets against the walls and still get to the outlets ... he replied "hey good idea -- I'm going to do that in my shop!". Something to think about. mikey "spaco" wrote in message . .. I juse went with the overhead route in my new woodshop. If your shop doesn't double as a garage, then I see no problem with power in the floor, other than the cost. If the floor is likely to ever get wet, I see problems. Oh yeh--- my shop equipment is never in the position I origianlly put it in when I built it. So, think carefully about power outlet location or you will be tripping over cords even worse than with extension cords from the wall. Pete Stanaitis ----------------- wrote: Building a new shop, 24 x 24. Floor will be concrete. How practical is it to put electrical outlets in the floor for stationary machines, TS, bandsaw, etc? If not in the floor how would one recommend getting power to machines set in the middle of the shop. Are extension cords practical for both 110 and 220? |
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