Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Woodworking (rec.woodworking) Discussion forum covering all aspects of working with wood. All levels of expertise are encouraged to particiapte. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
I can't say I'd even know how to cut regular glass, but I've got some mirror
glass to cut to about 11x20". Its from a $11 cheesy wood framed ~16x24" new mirror. I measured it at .081" = ~2mm thickness. So there are inches on the sides to cut off. I've bearing-rabetted out 3/8" around the inside of a 1x2" frame I made. Theres about .2" left to the front face I'll paint. I'm gonna back it with 1/4" Birch plywood, and brad it in w/ 1/4" 1/4 round (.500"Diameter). 1) should I worry about the birch ply right up against the mirror paint? Its not pictures. 2) Should I score the back side where the mirror paint is. Or grind it, or get through to the glass somehow, whether straight or not. Theres ~3/8" to the max edge on each side, so I could make a mess of the finish, I think, without affecting the view from the outside. 3)I am assuming no matter what I am going to do I need to score on the glass side 4) When scoring it says to score with one line only. How hard do I need to push? I just bought a $5 "6 wheels" Richard cutter. Then push down (away) from the cut line on the corner of a table? ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#2
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
bent wrote:
I can't say I'd even know how to cut regular glass, but I've got some mirror glass to cut to about 11x20". Its from a $11 cheesy wood framed ~16x24" new mirror. I measured it at .081" = ~2mm thickness. So there are inches on the sides to cut off. I've bearing-rabetted out 3/8" around the inside of a 1x2" frame I made. Theres about .2" left to the front face I'll paint. I'm gonna back it with 1/4" Birch plywood, and brad it in w/ 1/4" 1/4 round (.500"Diameter). 1) should I worry about the birch ply right up against the mirror paint? Its not pictures. You need to seal the cut edge of the mirror so moisture (read humidity) doesn't get under the silvering. Otherwise you'll get the black tarnishing working its way in from the edge. The back of the rabbet will be reflected by the mirror, so its typical that the rabbet is painted black so the reflection won't be distracting. 2) Should I score the back side where the mirror paint is. Or grind it, or get through to the glass somehow, whether straight or not. Theres ~3/8" to the max edge on each side, so I could make a mess of the finish, I think, without affecting the view from the outside. I don't understand what you're asking. Why would you need to score the back side of the mirror? You always cut from the face. No need to touch the back. 3)I am assuming no matter what I am going to do I need to score on the glass side Right. 4) When scoring it says to score with one line only. How hard do I need to push? I just bought a $5 "6 wheels" Richard cutter. Then push down (away) from the cut line on the corner of a table? You're just scratching the surface of the glass, so you don't need a lot of pressure. You can practice on a glass bottle to see how hard you have to press. The cutter should be lubricated with kerosene and it will sing if you're using constant pressure. Keep the movement uniform and unbroken. Work on top of a towel so you won't scratch the mirror, and snap it on the edge of the table like you mentioned. R |
#3
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Then take the ball end of the cutter and, starting at one end, gently tap along the bottom (mirrored) side of the score. do I need a soft (say towel) to pressurize under while doing this? do I need also to flip it back over to snap it off in one piece. not sure i'm clear on this method, or part of a method ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#4
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
You need to seal the cut edge of the mirror so moisture (read humidity) doesn't get under the silvering. Otherwise you'll get the black tarnishing working its way in from the edge. How can I do this. Can I use a paint? or a tape? Polyurethane? Sounds important! The back of the rabbet will be reflected by the mirror, so its typical that the rabbet is painted black so the reflection won't be distracting. I will have a lot of white going on around . Does this work, or should I do black too? The cutter should be lubricated with kerosene and it will sing if you're using constant pressure. I don't have any kerosene. Is lube a must? What about anything else I have, say, methyl hydrate, lacquer thinner, mineral spirits, gas (w/ fill-up), TSP solution, brush cleaner, other? Work on top of a towel so you won't scratch the mirror, and snap it on the edge of the table like you mentioned. do you suggest any cracking or prep before a final snap? ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#5
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
ball end of the cutter and, starting at one end, gently tap along the bottom (mirrored) side of the score. do I need a soft (say towel) to pressurize under while doing this? No, let the cutoff hang over the bench, and tap from below. Oh, and wear safety glasses. do I need also to flip it back over to snap it off in one piece. No. A good break will come off as one piece. not sure i'm clear on this method, or part of a method. Then practice on some scrap, first. Be patient whilst tapping, increasing power carefully. Tom |
#6
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
how can I be tapping along from one end and a good break will be one piece.
Isn't a tap gonna produce a break, which will be either one piece, or a bunch of pieces. Break little pieces, but try to break one piece? Don't break? ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#7
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
can I just align the score op top of a 1x2" edge and PUSH down, to snap on
one piece? push down firmly against the score until it gives? I don't want to learn breaking glass. I am looking for my best bet, or I'd take my Richard back. But I took apart the frame so... ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#8
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 22:27:04 -0500, "bent" wrote:
I can't say I'd even know how to cut regular glass, but I've got some mirror glass to cut to about 11x20". Its from a $11 cheesy wood framed ~16x24" new mirror. Maybe I'm wimpy, but I've wound up with so much broken glass, I take mine to the local glass experts. They don't mind even if I bring my own, and the cost is minimal ...and expertly done. They do the glass. I do the wood. Sometimes I buy the mirror/glass from them for projects. I definitely let them cut the ovals. |
#9
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
On 5-Mar-2006, "bent" wrote: 4) When scoring it says to score with one line only. How hard do I need to push? I just bought a $5 "6 wheels" Richard cutter. Then push down (away) from the cut line on the corner of a table? Don't put the glass on a towel - if you push hard and the towel is soft enough, you'll break the glass. You might get away with it on thick glass, but the stuff you have is very thin. Use a _flat_ surface and make sure it's clean - no junk under the glass. When you score the glass, you create a stress concentration along the score. When you tap the glass with the little hammer, small cracks emanate from the score in various directions - mostly through the glass. When enough of these cracks propagate and connect, the glass breaks clean along the score line. When you look at the edge that results, you'll see the uneven surface that forms from all these little cracks. You can sand the edge with fine, hard sandpaper to smooth the edges. Wear gloves and safety glasses. Mike |
#10
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
"bent" wrote in message ... I can't say I'd even know how to cut regular glass, but I've got some mirror glass to cut to about 11x20". Its from a $11 cheesy wood framed ~16x24" new mirror. I measured it at .081" = ~2mm thickness. So there are inches on the sides to cut off. I've bearing-rabetted out 3/8" around the inside of a 1x2" frame I made. Theres about .2" left to the front face I'll paint. I'm gonna back it with 1/4" Birch plywood, and brad it in w/ 1/4" 1/4 round (.500"Diameter). 1) should I worry about the birch ply right up against the mirror paint? Its not pictures. 2) Should I score the back side where the mirror paint is. Or grind it, or get through to the glass somehow, whether straight or not. Theres ~3/8" to the max edge on each side, so I could make a mess of the finish, I think, without affecting the view from the outside. 3)I am assuming no matter what I am going to do I need to score on the glass side 4) When scoring it says to score with one line only. How hard do I need to push? I just bought a $5 "6 wheels" Richard cutter. Then push down (away) from the cut line on the corner of a table? I'm no expert on cutting glass, so I take it to my local glass supplier and they cut it for me. They usually don't charge me cause they know I'll be back to buy eventually. Cheers, cc |
#11
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
bent wrote:
I can't say I'd even know how to cut regular glass, but I've got some mirror glass to cut to about 11x20". Its from a $11 cheesy wood framed ~16x24" new mirror. I measured it at .081" = ~2mm thickness. So there are inches on the sides to cut off. I've bearing-rabetted out 3/8" around the inside of a 1x2" frame I made. Theres about .2" left to the front face I'll paint. I'm gonna back it with 1/4" Birch plywood, and brad it in w/ 1/4" 1/4 round (.500"Diameter). 1) should I worry about the birch ply right up against the mirror paint? Its not pictures. 2) Should I score the back side where the mirror paint is. Or grind it, or get through to the glass somehow, whether straight or not. Theres ~3/8" to the max edge on each side, so I could make a mess of the finish, I think, without affecting the view from the outside. 3)I am assuming no matter what I am going to do I need to score on the glass side 4) When scoring it says to score with one line only. How hard do I need to push? I just bought a $5 "6 wheels" Richard cutter. Then push down (away) from the cut line on the corner of a table? ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- Depends on how old the glass is as to how easy it is to cut. I don't like the cutting wheel types and have never had good luck with them. A diamond pointed scorer works much better. You need to practice on a piece of throw away glass. The trick is to use medium pressure on the wheel and to make one continuous swipe using a good straight edge. When you break it, the score should be up, put the glass on a table with a piece on 1/2" plywood under the large part and the the score just past the free edge. Then use another piece of plywood and push down on the piece you are cutting off; you want it to just bend a little, and then it will snap. Tapping on the glass, especially using that little ball end of the cutter is likely to end of with a mess with a long straight cut. |
#12
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
bent wrote:
how can I be tapping along from one end and a good break will be one piece. Isn't a tap gonna produce a break, which will be either one piece, or a bunch of pieces. Break little pieces, but try to break one piece? Don't break? ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- That's why you shouldn't tap. You want to snap the throw away part in one piece. |
#13
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
bent wrote:
can I just align the score op top of a 1x2" edge and PUSH down, to snap on one piece? Yes! push down firmly against the score until it gives? Yes. Use a glove. I don't want to learn breaking glass. I am looking for my best bet, or I'd take my Richard back. But I took apart the frame so... ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#14
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Interesting thread since I've been trying to get around to doing
the same thing but on a thicker mirror (float glass). But even after reading the whole thread, there seems to be two conflicting paths to accomplish it, both of which I already knew, and neither of which has ever really worked for me. In fact, some of the posts sound like guesses based on having cut some plexiglas once, but ... I'm too ignorant on the subject to know if they're right. And, if "tapping" isn't right, why does nearly every glass cutter sold come with a ball shaped on the opposite end? Guess I'll go Google. Pop "bent" wrote in message ... I can't say I'd even know how to cut regular glass, but I've got some mirror glass to cut to about 11x20". Its from a $11 cheesy wood framed ~16x24" new mirror. I measured it at .081" = ~2mm thickness. So there are inches on the sides to cut off. I've bearing-rabetted out 3/8" around the inside of a 1x2" frame I made. Theres about .2" left to the front face I'll paint. I'm gonna back it with 1/4" Birch plywood, and brad it in w/ 1/4" 1/4 round (.500"Diameter). 1) should I worry about the birch ply right up against the mirror paint? Its not pictures. 2) Should I score the back side where the mirror paint is. Or grind it, or get through to the glass somehow, whether straight or not. Theres ~3/8" to the max edge on each side, so I could make a mess of the finish, I think, without affecting the view from the outside. 3)I am assuming no matter what I am going to do I need to score on the glass side 4) When scoring it says to score with one line only. How hard do I need to push? I just bought a $5 "6 wheels" Richard cutter. Then push down (away) from the cut line on the corner of a table? ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#15
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Pop wrote:
snip And, if "tapping" isn't right, why does nearly every glass cutter sold come with a ball shaped on the opposite end? Guess I'll go Google. Pop For cutting curves "tapping" with the ball end is appropriate. For a straight cut it is easier to snap the glass over a straight edge. -- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA (Remove -SPAM- to send email) |
#16
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Pop wrote:
Interesting thread since I've been trying to get around to doing the same thing but on a thicker mirror (float glass). But even after reading the whole thread, there seems to be two conflicting paths to accomplish it, both of which I already knew, and neither of which has ever really worked for me. In fact, some of the posts sound like guesses based on having cut some plexiglas once, but ... I'm too ignorant on the subject to know if they're right. And, if "tapping" isn't right, why does nearly every glass cutter sold come with a ball shaped on the opposite end? Guess I'll go Google. The ball end glass cutters are very common, but there are lots of choices and many of which don't have the ball. The ball is an attempt to make the tool one size fits all - a multipurpose tool. For cutting small curves, the ball end can be useful for tapping to propagate the crack. That shouldn't be done on mirrors as it could damage the silvering. If you've ever been in a commercial glass shop, you'll see that the guys have a carpet covered table and snap the glass over the edge. It's way faster and less likely to have the glass break due to an imperfection that you'd never see. The microscopic imperfections are the weak points in the glass. Tempering is just a way to let the molten glass fill in those surface imperfections - that's where all of the increased strength comes from. It's not special glass. Whether the glass is thick or thin, the same uniform score is sufficient. If you've ever seen the 1" thick glass used in some church windows, that's how it's cut. They score it, pick it up with a hand on either side of the score line and drop/push it down over a hard plastic edge. It breaks just about as easily as the standard float glass you have in your window. To propagate the break along a score line glass artists (like myself - I do stained and leaded glass work) use running pliers, which are basically pliers with a curved mouth or ridge in the middle of one jaw. Gentle pressure is all that is necessary. Another technique is to put a wood dowel under the score line and snap the glass over that. There are many techniques for glass, and everyone will swear that their system is the best. Basically it boils down to trying different techniques until you find something that works for you and gives you good, repeatable results. That's when most people stop trying different techniques because they've found the "perfect" technique. R |
#17
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Do what I did and just go to your local mirror / glass guy. I've done
that a number of times. Only charged $10 for a cut job bigger than yours. One broken attempt will pay for this service. |
#18
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
On 5 Mar 2006 19:45:28 -0800, with neither quill nor qualm, "tom"
quickly quoth: Unless it's tempered, from the top (glass) side, make_one_ firm score along your desired cut with the aid of a straightedge. Then take the ball end of the cutter and, starting at one end, gently tap along the bottom (mirrored) side of the score. Take your time. You might still break your glass where you don't wish it to break, and them's the breaks. Tom Nearly every glasscutting book I've read has said that the ball end of the cutter will shatter more glass than it helps score, so don't use it. My experience prior to reading them (33% loss) mirrored theirs. (bad pun intentional.) I don't cut much glass, but I haven't lost a piece of glass since buying a set of running pliers. I suggest setting the mirror on kraft paper a super clean piece of MDF or other flat table. Score it on the front, move that score line to let the scrap overhang the table, using either glass running pliers or a quick snap to break off the glass scrap. Some silver protectants are plasticized so if you also score the silver on the back, it has less of a tendency to pull off any silver at the cut edges when you break the scrap off. Also remember: NEVER run the carbide cutter over a previously scored section of glass. It instantly dulls the edge and makes a rough cut which can shatter and run away from you. DAMHIKT. -------------------------------------------------------------------- The more we gripe, * http://www.diversify.com/stees.html the longer God makes us live. * Graphic Design - Humorous T-shirts |
#19
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 12:22:34 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm,
"no(SPAM)vasys" quickly quoth: Pop wrote: snip And, if "tapping" isn't right, why does nearly every glass cutter sold come with a ball shaped on the opposite end? Guess I'll go Google. (Why do men have nipples, Pop? Why do ballots come with Reps and Dems listed on them? They're also quite inappropriate and useless, but inertia keeps things going. sigh Besides, it's expensive to change the dies.) For cutting curves "tapping" with the ball end is appropriate. For a straight cut it is easier to snap the glass over a straight edge. You've obviously never used running pliers, Yack. The curved tips work really great. http://www.glassworld.com.au/members...ects/Page2.htm Cheap source: http://cgi.ebay.com/Stained-Glass-Supplies-8-Running-Pliers-has-Extra-Jaws_W0QQitemZ7396356555QQcategoryZ4770QQrdZ1QQcmd ZViewItem -------------------------------------------------------------------- The more we gripe, * http://www.diversify.com/stees.html the longer God makes us live. * Graphic Design - Humorous T-shirts |
#21
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Thin mirrors are float glass too. Most all glass produced these days, other
than decorative, is float glass. "Pop" wrote in message news:UXXOf.757$FN1.324@trndny04... Interesting thread since I've been trying to get around to doing the same thing but on a thicker mirror (float glass). |
#22
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
sections 3,4,5 of http://www.warner-criv.com/techtips/tools.aspx
I used a lighter fluid (heptane) & WD-40 combo for lube.. I used a level on "spongy fabric" as a straightedge after measuring offset of spinning wheel center to edge. The ~1" thickness of the level guided the 1-3/8" high flat edge of the cutter along perfectly perpendicular. I would recommend this orientation. Held it at 90 degrees and pulled toward me. The balled handle had a flat. Started 1/8" in from edge, and finished pulling through, which did leave a 1.5mm chip, which will be hidden. Looked with magnifying glass and couldn't see the score line after one score (I thought of lifing 15 lbs. off ground) Used a plywood sandwich on TS edge, and gloved hand in center of waste about 3" away (at end) and it snapped apart perfectly. ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- |
#23
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
bent wrote:
sections 3,4,5 of http://www.warner-criv.com/techtips/tools.aspx I used a lighter fluid (heptane) & WD-40 combo for lube.. I used a level on "spongy fabric" as a straightedge after measuring offset of spinning wheel center to edge. The ~1" thickness of the level guided the 1-3/8" high flat edge of the cutter along perfectly perpendicular. I would recommend this orientation. Held it at 90 degrees and pulled toward me. The balled handle had a flat. Started 1/8" in from edge, and finished pulling through, which did leave a 1.5mm chip, which will be hidden. You should always start and finish the cut right to the edge. Just let off on the pressure a little so you don't blast a crater. The cutting wheel is round so the cutting force isn't affected by an angle (math freaks, yes, thanks, I know about vectors) - no need to hold the cutter at an unnatural angle like 90 degrees. Lean it back some so it's comfortable then push or pull as is your preference. There was no need to make the plywood sandwich, it would have broken cleanly without it on the edge of the table. Glad to see you had success on your first outing. Keep going. R |
#24
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 12:22:34 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm, "no(SPAM)vasys" quickly quoth: For cutting curves "tapping" with the ball end is appropriate. For a straight cut it is easier to snap the glass over a straight edge. You've obviously never used running pliers, Yack. The curved tips work really great. http://www.glassworld.com.au/members...ects/Page2.htm Cheap source: http://cgi.ebay.com/Stained-Glass-Supplies-8-Running-Pliers-has-Extra-Jaws_W0QQitemZ7396356555QQcategoryZ4770QQrdZ1QQcmd ZViewItem I have the running pliers (I occasionally do foiled and leaded glass work). For a straight cut, of say 2" or greater, I still find using just my fingers or snapping the glass over a straight edge easier. -- Jack Novak Buffalo, NY - USA (Remove -SPAM- to send email) |
#25
Posted to rec.woodworking
|
|||
|
|||
cutting mirror glass
You may want to consider going to a stain glass shop and see if they
will cut it. Otherwise with only 3/8"waste you might want to consider grozzing pliers. Used in stain glass. they are about 1: wide and there is a slight angle in the bill. You would put the center of the pliers on your score line and squeeze firmly. This should give you a running crack along the score. All this said and done the pliers about $15-16 . you spent $5 for a basic glass cutter. Mine are $25-30 . So now you have $20 or so into it. Maybe the glass shop will cut for less, Then again if they break it they will cut you a new one from their inventory. As for sealing the edge from the moisture and turning black, just put a good coat of fingernail polish on the edge and on the mirroring back . Aint nothing cheap about this but wanting to do this without the right tools is kind of harbor freight style. Good luck |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
cutting board | Woodworking | |||
Painting a room...cutting in | UK diy | |||
Basics on Depth of Cuts | Metalworking | |||
gas or not? | Metalworking |