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Two-Part Epoxy?
Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to
"pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ultimately, I'd like to save the paint under and around the epoxy, but if I have to, I'll touch it up later. It's not critical but desirable... Suggestions also welcome! I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... I'm crossposting (eegads!) to the woodworking group since you folks also use glues often and work with moth wood and metal lots... Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
On Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:33:25 GMT, "Joe AutoDrill" wrote:
Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ultimately, I'd like to save the paint under and around the epoxy, but if I have to, I'll touch it up later. It's not critical but desirable... Suggestions also welcome! I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... Vacuum? Regards, Boris Mohar Got Knock? - see: Viatrack Printed Circuit Designs (among other things) http://www.viatrack.ca |
"Boris Mohar" wrote in message ... On Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:33:25 GMT, "Joe AutoDrill" wrote: Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. It'd be worth the effort to look up some specialty hot-melts before you give up. One in particular comes to mind; it's a woodworker's hot-melt containing a portion of beeswax. You can smell it. It has AMAZING tack and flexibility, without that "plasticy" feel of most hot-melts. I'll bet it would grab most any clean surface strongly enough to do what you want. It melts at about 275F, and is soluble in hot paraffin or polyester adipate. LLoyd |
I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... It depends on the epoxy - some works great and others don't. 15 psi is nothing if the correct type of epoxy is used. Could be a PITA to clean up since epoxy sticks so well - the good thing about it is it dries clear or slightly yellow. |
Vacuum?
Not a flat enough surface and I don't have a vacuum unit powerful enough. -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message news:p2lMe.1159$wb.86@trndny05... Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ultimately, I'd like to save the paint under and around the epoxy, but if I have to, I'll touch it up later. It's not critical but desirable... Suggestions also welcome! I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... I'm crossposting (eegads!) to the woodworking group since you folks also use glues often and work with moth wood and metal lots... Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R Call a body shop and see if they have a "Dent Doctor" set up. That's the stuff you need. |
Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
I'll bet it would grab most any clean surface strongly enough to do what you want. The problem with hot glue is, that it's cooling too fast down on metal. _Maybe_ preheating the matal works. Devcon or Loctite have decent two part epoxies. JB-Weld also is said to be excellent. I would try these. But would not relay on the paint sticking good enough on the metal. Nick -- Motormodelle / Engine Models: http://www.motor-manufaktur.de Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic more to come ... |
Right on, Fred! AFAIK there is no 2-part epoxy that can stick painted
surfaces together and then be a cleaned off without a trace and/or damage to the paint. Please let us know if you find some, though. For your intended purpose I would try one of the "5-minute" epoxies and experiment with making the pull before the epoxy was fully cured. It might be possible to remove the partial cure with alcohol or some other solvent which doesn't attack painted surfaces. Bob Swinney "Fred" wrote in message ... I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... It depends on the epoxy - some works great and others don't. 15 psi is nothing if the correct type of epoxy is used. Could be a PITA to clean up since epoxy sticks so well - the good thing about it is it dries clear or slightly yellow. |
Call a body shop and see if they have a "Dent Doctor" set up. That's the
stuff you need. We tried the "Pops-a-Dent" system which is similar with no luck... Thus the inquiry. :) -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
A while back Brownells sent out a gunsmithing tech note which discussed
their epoxy called "Acraglass" and its development. According to them it's not as good as the stuff on the space shuttle but far better than the common store brands. You might want to give their tech support line a call and see what they say. Brownells Inc. 200 South Front Street Montezuma, Iowa 50171 Tech: Open 8:30 am to 4:30 pm (U.S. CST) Technical Support: 800-741-0015 Steve. "Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message news:p2lMe.1159$wb.86@trndny05... Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ultimately, I'd like to save the paint under and around the epoxy, but if I have to, I'll touch it up later. It's not critical but desirable... Suggestions also welcome! I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... I'm crossposting (eegads!) to the woodworking group since you folks also use glues often and work with moth wood and metal lots... Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
On Tue, 16 Aug 2005 14:04:02 GMT, "Joe AutoDrill" wrote:
Vacuum? Not a flat enough surface and I don't have a vacuum unit powerful enough. Than try hot melt but like others said, preheat the surface. You may have to be prepared to repaint so why not scuff the paint. Regards, Boris Mohar Got Knock? - see: Viatrack Printed Circuit Designs (among other things) http://www.viatrack.ca |
Than try hot melt but like others said, preheat the surface. You may have
to be prepared to repaint so why not scuff the paint. I'm going to try the hot glue again tonight with semi-scuffed paint... But the glue was delaminating from the "puller" too so we shall see! Next is a 2 part epoxy and the quest to find something that dissolves it but not paint... Last step is to simply remove the paint and all and do it right but expensive... :) -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message
news:p2lMe.1159$wb.86@trndny05... Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ultimately, I'd like to save the paint under and around the epoxy, but if I have to, I'll touch it up later. It's not critical but desirable... Suggestions also welcome! I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... I'm crossposting (eegads!) to the woodworking group since you folks also use glues often and work with moth wood and metal lots... Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com Devcon makes a good 5 min. epoxy......System Three makes a 24hr one called T-88 -Really amazing stuff. System Three - www.epoxyhelp.com I've bought it from www.rockler.com - they have stores too..... Either way, I can't see how you're gonna get it off the paint though. It might even pull the paint off.... HTH Jeff |
Either way, I can't see how you're gonna get it off the paint though. It
might even pull the paint off.... If the paint goes..., It goes.... No hole is the absolute goal and paint preserved is the dream goal. -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
Joe AutoDrill wrote:
I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ah! Now I understand! There is a special glue for _exactly_ that purpose. Go to a body work shop that is quite innovative and let them show you their repair set for small dents. No, please. Don't ask me for the name. But you could ask in a more car related NG. HTH, Nick -- Motormodelle / Engine Models: http://www.motor-manufaktur.de Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic more to come ... |
I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal
into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ah! Now I understand! There is a special glue for _exactly_ that purpose. Go to a body work shop that is quite innovative and let them show you their repair set for small dents. No, please. Don't ask me for the name. But you could ask in a more car related NG. I think that is the exact glue that is failing me now... I bought a "Pops-a-Dent" paintless dent removal kit to try. The hot glue gun glue... Say that ten times fast ... just delaminates from either the puller or the paint. Someone else suggested ePoxy then dry ice to get the epoxy off... Might try that tonight. -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
Joe AutoDrill wrote:
I think that is the exact glue that is failing me now... Ah, sorry, didn't understand this*) I bought a "Pops-a-Dent" paintless dent removal kit to try. The hot glue gun glue... Say that ten times fast ... just delaminates from either the puller or the paint. Greasy fingers? Greasy paint? Hot glue gun not hot enough? Anyhow, this kind of glueing will _only_ hold if you pull dead staight. A bit of tilting and off it goes. *) OK, sometimes I'm a slow-brainer. But most times it's due to language problems. Nick -- Motormodelle / Engine Models: http://www.motor-manufaktur.de Ellwe 2FB * VTM 87 * DLM-S3a * cubic more to come ... |
I think that is the exact glue that is failing me now...
Ah, sorry, didn't understand this*) No apology necessary. The thread is getting longish now and people will soon be asking me the basics again anyhow. :) I bought a "Pops-a-Dent" paintless dent removal kit to try. The hot glue gun glue... Say that ten times fast ... just delaminates from either the puller or the paint. Greasy fingers? Greasy paint? Hot glue gun not hot enough? Anyhow, this kind of glueing will _only_ hold if you pull dead staight. A bit of tilting and off it goes. I didn't remove the wax from the paint... But the glue itself was splitting between the painted surface and the puller itself so it wasn't adhesion that I had much of a problem with... It seems to be the actual tensile strength of the glue... I let it cool in 70 degree weather for 15 minutes prior to pulling too... -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message news:p2lMe.1159$wb.86@trndny05... Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. Ultimately, I'd like to save the paint under and around the epoxy, but if I have to, I'll touch it up later. It's not critical but desirable... Suggestions also welcome! I need at least 10-15 PSI pulling power without the "stuff" letting go from the surface. In other words, plenty of stick... I'm crossposting (eegads!) to the woodworking group since you folks also use glues often and work with moth wood and metal lots... Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R The double sided tape used in automotive applications to stick in windows on the likes of Toyota FJ75 Troop Carriers. Its a "mastic" type glue and has amzing sticking power - Selleys sell some similar stuff in those tubes but not as strong as the tape but would probably do the job that you want. |
In article lvqMe.2332$yb.977@trndny01,
"Joe AutoDrill" wrote: Either way, I can't see how you're gonna get it off the paint though. It might even pull the paint off.... If the paint goes..., It goes.... No hole is the absolute goal and paint preserved is the dream goal. If you only need 10-15 psi, try a rubber suction cup. No hole, saves paint, and has a lot of pull. -- Free men own guns, slaves don't www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/ |
A lot of people on the list have addressed the various adhesives but that
isn't where your problem is. Rather the problem is that as you pull the dent, the edges delaminate becauuse they are up to whree they belong and thus stop moving. This allows air in and thus the problem. You need to have a flexible puller so that it will flex with the metal. I'd probalby use some rubber to attach to the metal with a good adhesive like weatherseal adhesive (high tack and strength) and then a relatively thin metal puller plate over that. IN addition, you may also want to increase the pressure on the metal from the backside with another rubber coated surface -- Why do penguins walk so far to get to their nesting grounds? |
I know of a great solvent for 2 part epoxy, but it also removes paint
as far as I know. If you want to try, it is Jasco Paint and Epoxy remover. I think it is a mix of acetone, tolulene, and xylene or something like that. |
Bob May wrote: ... Why do penguins walk so far to get to their nesting grounds? Maybe all the fights are booked? -- FF |
"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message
news:p2lMe.1159$wb.86@trndny05... | Anyone have any experience using two-part epoxy on painted metal? I need to | "pull" some painted metal similar to automotive sheet metal into position | and hot glue simply doesn't stick well enough. SNIP Got a new one for you. Get a really good masking or other strong and paper like tape, like the 3M stuff and carefully spread it about the area you need to work. Rub it in good so that the tape adheres perfectly everywhere. Apply some adhesive that is flexible enough to accommodate the expected flexing to the tape and your pulling tool. The trick here is that the strength of the tape in the vertical direction (not tensile or shear, as tape is measured, but in a direction perpendicular to the surface) is phenomenal, but and most adhesive sticks to the tape really well, therefore the tape provides the stiction you can't get from the adhesive directly to the surface, not to mention that you can use a wider variety of adhesives. |
Should work, except it won't make semi-gloss. Satin is already half
way between semigloss and matte. mixing matte and glossy would make semigloss. So it should be fine, just a bit shinier than semigloss. Maybe counteract by adding more satin than glossy. Experiment. |
oops, wrong thread.
Don't know how my computer pulled that one on me. |
"woodworker88" wrote in message
oups.com... oops, wrong thread. Don't know how my computer pulled that one on me. LOL You had me wondering about the relevance of that comment for a sec. :) -- Regards, Joe Agro, Jr. (800) 871-5022 (908) 542-0244 http://www.AutoDrill.com http://www.Multi-Drill.com V8013-R |
Keywords:
In article , "SteveF" wrote: A while back Brownells sent out a gunsmithing tech note which discussed their epoxy called "Acraglass" and its development. According to them it's not as good as the stuff on the space shuttle but far better than the common store brands. You might want to give their tech support line a call and see what they say. Brownells Inc. 200 South Front Street Montezuma, Iowa 50171 Tech: Open 8:30 am to 4:30 pm (U.S. CST) Technical Support: 800-741-0015 The best epoxy I've ever used is Hysol brand. It was the prefered stuff for communications satellites I worked on, and I've very rarely had it fail in home applications. In general, the slower the cure, the stronger the epoxy. 5 minute stuff is usually much weaker than the slower setting ones. Surface prep is always important. Doug White |
Roger & Lorraine Martin wrote: The double sided tape used in automotive applications to stick in windows on the likes of Toyota FJ75 Troop Carriers. Its a "mastic" type glue and has amzing sticking power - Selleys sell some similar stuff in those tubes but not as strong as the tape but would probably do the job that you want. Yes, or double sticky carpet tape. Laquer thinner (I think) will remove the glue residue. -- FF |
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