Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana? I DAGS and didn't find any
reviews or opinions. I know I'm bucking the current popular trend by
using a shaper instead of a router table, but it's what I have so...
The insert systems seem like a good idea because you get a whole bunch
of profiles for alot less than you would pay for the individual cutters
and the inserts are quite reasonable when it comes time to replace
them. What I would like to know is if the quality of cut is similar to
the individual cutters and if the inserts hold up for a reasonable
amount of time. I just don't like to buy things that I haven't used or
at least talked to someone who has used them. I have become gun shy
over the years because too often I have been bit in the butt by things
that don't work like they are supposed too. Any help will be
appreciated. Thanks in advance. I sure appreciate all of you who take
the time and effort to share your knowledge and expertise. You have
saved my bacon more than once. Happy sawdust, BC

I have the CMT system. So far it has worked just fine on Cherry, Maple, and
Poplar. Seems like a good solution for light duty work and provides a good
selection of profiles at a reasonable price. If I were going to do
production-like work, I would probably spring for the dedicated cutters
though.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jim Artherholt

"bc" wrote in message
oups.com...
Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana? I DAGS and didn't find any
reviews or opinions. I know I'm bucking the current popular trend by
using a shaper instead of a router table, but it's what I have so...
The insert systems seem like a good idea because you get a whole bunch
of profiles for alot less than you would pay for the individual cutters
and the inserts are quite reasonable when it comes time to replace
them. What I would like to know is if the quality of cut is similar to
the individual cutters and if the inserts hold up for a reasonable
amount of time. I just don't like to buy things that I haven't used or
at least talked to someone who has used them. I have become gun shy
over the years because too often I have been bit in the butt by things
that don't work like they are supposed too. Any help will be
appreciated. Thanks in advance. I sure appreciate all of you who take
the time and effort to share your knowledge and expertise. You have
saved my bacon more than once. Happy sawdust, BC

In article .com, "bc" wrote:
Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana?
[snip]

My biggest concern with those is,how well do the knives stay put in use?
Losing one at 10000rpm would be a Bad Thing.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

This is a fair question. CMT dealt with the issue by having the cutters
mount over two pins in the head and then used a wedge shaped gib in a
tapered cut out in the head. The gib has a countersunk hole to capture the
screw that holds it in place. Entire system seems quite well thought out
and reliable, much better than the way that craftsman holds the cutters in
their TS molding heads. In the end, it all boils down to being very careful
to mount the cutters correctly and double check everything, but I believe it
is safe.

My concern on some of the cutters, such as the cope and stick, is that there
are relatively long pieces of the cutter stock that are not supported on the
back side. These, IMHO, are more likely to break off and therefore require
extra diligence in feeding. In the single purpose cutters, the body extends
out farther and only a relatively small amount of the carbide knife is
unsupported, thus reducing the breakage likelihood.

~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jim Artherholt

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
...
In article .com, "bc"
wrote:
Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana?
[snip]

My biggest concern with those is,how well do the knives stay put in use?
Losing one at 10000rpm would be a Bad Thing.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

Take a serious look at using a RAS for your shaping and moulding operations
using the "Delta 3 knife system". You can produce all sorts of shapes and
out of flat mouldings with less than 20 knife sets. The master book on
shaping and moulding on the RAS was written by Walley Kunkel "How To Master
The Radial Saw". http://mrsawdust.com/contents.php

--

Rumpty

Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


"bc" wrote in message
oups.com...
Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana? I DAGS and didn't find any
reviews or opinions. I know I'm bucking the current popular trend by
using a shaper instead of a router table, but it's what I have so...
The insert systems seem like a good idea because you get a whole bunch
of profiles for alot less than you would pay for the individual cutters
and the inserts are quite reasonable when it comes time to replace
them. What I would like to know is if the quality of cut is similar to
the individual cutters and if the inserts hold up for a reasonable
amount of time. I just don't like to buy things that I haven't used or
at least talked to someone who has used them. I have become gun shy
over the years because too often I have been bit in the butt by things
that don't work like they are supposed too. Any help will be
appreciated. Thanks in advance. I sure appreciate all of you who take
the time and effort to share your knowledge and expertise. You have
saved my bacon more than once. Happy sawdust, BC

Thanks Jim,
I appreciate the input.
BC

On 15 Jun 2005 16:15:30 -0700, "bc" wrote:

Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana? I DAGS and didn't find any
reviews or opinions. I know I'm bucking the current popular trend by
using a shaper instead of a router table, but it's what I have so...
The insert systems seem like a good idea because you get a whole bunch
of profiles for alot less than you would pay for the individual cutters
and the inserts are quite reasonable when it comes time to replace
them. What I would like to know is if the quality of cut is similar to
the individual cutters and if the inserts hold up for a reasonable
amount of time. I just don't like to buy things that I haven't used or
at least talked to someone who has used them. I have become gun shy
over the years because too often I have been bit in the butt by things
that don't work like they are supposed too. Any help will be
appreciated. Thanks in advance. I sure appreciate all of you who take
the time and effort to share your knowledge and expertise. You have
saved my bacon more than once. Happy sawdust, BC

I have the Grizzly system. Can't comment thus far on knife life as I
have only used it for a single molding job (about 20 LF of cherry) , but
initial cuts were very smooth and the results reasonably good. Biggest
issue was jigging and set-up to feed through smoothly and without causing
snipe -- that would be true for dedicated or insert cutters.

The system appears to be well thought-out in terms of assuring that the
knives don't depart the cutterhead during use, but care and multiple checks
to assure that all fasteners have been secured and tightened is a good
idea.




+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Mark & Juanita wrote:
....
I have the Grizzly system. ...
The system appears to be well thought-out in terms of assuring that the
knives don't depart the cutterhead during use, ...

Curiousity...what's the arbor diameter and OD of the cutter (w/ knives,
roughly)? I've not ventured that direction as have only the LD Delta so
far and am uncomfortable w/ really large diameter, heavy cutters on the
1/2" spindle....

I have not seen these cutters but insert tooling started in metalworking.
Likely they have taken their insert fastening methods from there also. I
have cut thousands of pounds of metal with insert cutters and never had one
come out. Speeds tend to be lower(6000 rpm or less) but cutting forces much
higher. I wouldn't have any reservations in using them.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
...
In article .com, "bc"
wrote:
Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana?
[snip]

My biggest concern with those is,how well do the knives stay put in use?
Losing one at 10000rpm would be a Bad Thing.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 15:29:11 -0500, Duane Bozarth
wrote:

Mark & Juanita wrote:
...
I have the Grizzly system. ...
The system appears to be well thought-out in terms of assuring that the
knives don't depart the cutterhead during use, ...

Curiousity...what's the arbor diameter and OD of the cutter (w/ knives,
roughly)? I've not ventured that direction as have only the LD Delta so
far and am uncomfortable w/ really large diameter, heavy cutters on the
1/2" spindle....

The set I have is 3/4" arbor. The OD is about 3". Grizzly indicates
that they expect a minimum 1 1/2 HP shaper for these cutters. I suspect a
light duty shaper may be at a disadvantage.




+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

If you're gonna be dumb, you better be tough

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

In article .com,
"bc" writes:
Have any of you had any experience with insert cutter systems for
shapers like the ones from CMT or Amana? I DAGS and didn't find any
reviews or opinions.

(You might get more info by looking at more professionally oriented
forums.) The ones I've seen and used are all quite stout and do
an excellent job. They aren't cheap, but are definitely less expensive
than a comparable set of single use cutters. The question for you
is whether you will need/want all the different profiles.

--
Jeff Thunder
Dept. of Mathematical Sciences
Northern Illinois Univ.
jthunder at math dot niu dot edu

Mark & Juanita wrote:

....
The set I have is 3/4" arbor. The OD is about 3". Grizzly indicates
that they expect a minimum 1 1/2 HP shaper for these cutters. I suspect a
light duty shaper may be at a disadvantage.

Thanks, I fugured that would be the case.

HP isn't my concern, it's the 1/2" arbor and large diameter which
translates into high mass...