"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
Do you mean benders flatten the pipe? My, oh, my! Keep twiddling
the bass and treble knobs, and leave proper work to others.

I use a bender exclusively on copper tube.

Don't make things up.

Oh *I* don't,

No you don't. It is clear you haven't a clue.

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.

Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You notch the joists. As long as the notch is no more than 1/5th deep then
fine. If the replaced floor board is screwed back then this adds rigidity.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either side
of the bend.

In article ,
IMM wrote:
Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Anyone who knows anything about pipework would agree the fewer joints the
better. But then you obviously know nothing about pipework.

--
*We waste time, so you don't have to *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:08:52 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"John Rumm" wrote in message
...

If you get the 25m reels of speedfit barrier pipe, then the usual
problem is unbending the stuff!

I know. Appalling stuff

LOL! Just bend it the other way as you take it off the coil, you don't
need the strength of Atlas :)

If using a lot of it, it should be fairly easy to make up a jig for
doing this out of some narrow rollers and a couple of bits of board..

cheers,
Pete.

IMM wrote:

You notch the joists. As long as the notch is no more than 1/5th deep then
fine.

For a domestic floor, you would be outside of the building control
guidance figures if you do....

Notches can be a maximum of 1/8th of the joists depth (or 32mm whichever
is smaller), and may only occur within the first or last quarter of the
total span.

So with a 200mm joist you can notch for 22mm pipe but not 28mm pipe.

If you drill a hole on the centre line of the joist then you can go up
to 1/4 of he joist depth.

If the replaced floor board is screwed back then this adds rigidity.

With chipboard flooring that will add all the structural integrity of a
wheetabix....


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
snip
For a domestic floor, you would be outside of the building control
guidance figures if you do....

Notches can be a maximum of 1/8th of the joists depth (or 32mm whichever
is smaller), and may only occur within the first or last quarter of the
total span.


Is there any preference between straight cut ( |_| ) or 'U' shape notches ?

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when
bent.


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!

":::Jerry::::" wrote in message
...

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
snip
For a domestic floor, you would be outside of the building control
guidance figures if you do....

Notches can be a maximum of 1/8th of the joists depth (or 32mm whichever
is smaller), and may only occur within the first or last quarter of the
total span.


Is there any preference between straight cut ( |_| ) or 'U' shape notches
?

Makes no difference.

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:50:33 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.

Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You notch the joists. As long as the notch is no more than 1/5th deep then
fine. If the replaced floor board is screwed back then this adds rigidity.

I think you've lost the plot. The question was about plastic.



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:51:57 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either side
of the bend.


What on earth for?

The whole thing can be done perfectly well in plastic as long as you
read the instructions and use the right tools.

I saw some pipecutters today at £5. Would you like me to buy you one
for Christmas?



--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
snip

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!


So has an axe !...

In article ,
IMM wrote:
You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!

So you've not got a proper copper tube cutter either? Is there no end to
your meanness? Or would you like it explained how to use one?

--
*Not all men are annoying. Some are dead.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

:::Jerry:::: wrote:

Is there any preference between straight cut ( |_| ) or 'U' shape notches ?

Straight is simplest to cut, so you may as well go for that.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:51:57 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side
of the bend.


What on earth for?

So you can have atioght bend that does not want to unbenmd itself. Unles
you use unipipe.

I saw some pipecutters today at £5.
Would you like me to buy you one
for Christmas?

I have a nice top quality one thank you. Please donate your this money to
the rich people. You appear to want to keep them rich for some reason known
only to yourself.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:50:33 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 09:11:01 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .


Which is why you can buy special formers to bend the pipe to its
correct radius and keep it there.

Or best use copper pipe in the first place which stays bent when bent.

Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You notch the joists. As long as the notch is no more than 1/5th deep
then
fine. If the replaced floor board is screwed back then this adds
rigidity.

I think you've lost the plot. The question was about plastic.

Please re-read.

":::Jerry::::" wrote in message
...

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
snip

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at
either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!

So has an axe !...

and a lazer torch and a tractor and a bus and an angle grinder too.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at
either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!

snip inane tripe

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 00:50:22 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side
of the bend.


What on earth for?

So you can have atioght bend that does not want to unbenmd itself. Unles
you use unipipe.

If you use the formers supplied by the plastic plumbing manufacturers
you can have quite a tight bend which will stay in place without
having to mess around with this.


I saw some pipecutters today at £5.
Would you like me to buy you one
for Christmas?

I have a nice top quality one thank you.

So why don't you use it?

Please donate your this money to
the rich people. You appear to want to keep them rich for some reason known
only to yourself.

I was feeling in a generous mood. Perhaps the Maplin toolkit
instead?





--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:50:33 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You notch the joists. As long as the notch is no more than 1/5th deep then
fine. If the replaced floor board is screwed back then this adds rigidity.

My preference has always been to drill a hole through the joist.
Notching a joist severely weakens it.

sPoNiX

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 00:52:07 -0000, "IMM" wrote:

and a lazer torch..

"Lazer torch"? What sort of batteries does that take?

sPoNiX

"sPoNiX" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 00:52:07 -0000, "IMM" wrote:

and a lazer torch..

"Lazer torch"? What sort of batteries does that take?

Big ones.

"sPoNiX" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 17:50:33 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


Of course. It's so easy to thread through holes in joists under
floorboards.......

You notch the joists. As long as the notch is no more than 1/5th deep
then
fine. If the replaced floor board is screwed back then this adds
rigidity.

My preference has always been to drill a hole through the joist.
Notching a joist severely weakens it.

Not if you don't go down too deep and it is with 25% of the span from a
wall, and the floor boards around the nlotches are screwed not nailed.

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 00:50:22 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side
of the bend.


What on earth for?

So you can have a tight bend that does not want to unbend itself. Unless
you use unipipe.

If you use the formers supplied by the plastic plumbing manufacturers
you can have quite a tight bend which will stay in place without
having to mess around with this.

Or better still use proper pipe. The expense of all this garbage too,
special formers and whatnot.

I saw some pipecutters today at £5.
Would you like me to buy you one
for Christmas?

I have a nice top quality one thank you.

So why don't you use it?

Please donate your this money to the rich people.
You appear to want to keep them rich for some reason known
only to yourself.

I was feeling in a generous mood.

How much do you donate to the rich each year?

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 09:19:14 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 00:50:22 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at either
side
of the bend.


What on earth for?

So you can have a tight bend that does not want to unbend itself. Unless
you use unipipe.

If you use the formers supplied by the plastic plumbing manufacturers
you can have quite a tight bend which will stay in place without
having to mess around with this.

Or better still use proper pipe. The expense of all this garbage too,
special formers and whatnot.

It's one of the tradeoffs between cost of materials vs. time taken and
between doing a job properly and bodging it.

I know that you find both concepts difficult.


I saw some pipecutters today at £5.
Would you like me to buy you one
for Christmas?

I have a nice top quality one thank you.

So why don't you use it?

Please donate your this money to the rich people.
You appear to want to keep them rich for some reason known
only to yourself.

I was feeling in a generous mood.

How much do you donate to the rich each year?

Way too much in taxes, national insurance, VAT, duty,.........


--

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"IMM" wrote in message
...

":::Jerry::::" wrote in message
...

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
snip

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at
either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!

So has an axe !...

and a lazer torch and a tractor and a bus and an angle grinder too.


Irony is not one of your stronger points. is it ?!...

In article ,
IMM wrote:
My preference has always been to drill a hole through the joist.
Notching a joist severely weakens it.

Not if you don't go down too deep and it is with 25% of the span from a
wall, and the floor boards around the nlotches are screwed not nailed.

The correct way to try and regain some of the lost strength is to screw a
steel plate across the notch. This has the added benefit of protecting the
pipe to some extent.

--
*I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
My preference has always been to drill a hole through the joist.
Notching a joist severely weakens it.

Not if you don't go down too deep and it is with 25% of the span from a
wall, and the floor boards around the nlotches are screwed not nailed.

The correct way to try and regain some of the lost strength is to screw a
steel plate across the notch. This has the added benefit of protecting the
pipe to some extent.

Correct way? That is only one way.

":::Jerry::::" wrote in message
...

"IMM" wrote in message
...

":::Jerry::::" wrote in message
...

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
snip

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at
either
side of the bend.

More use for the hacksaw?

Hacksaws have been known to cut copper pipe. Duh!

So has an axe !...

and a lazer torch and a tractor and a bus and an angle grinder too.

Irony is not one of your stronger points. is it ?!...

What type of irony? Any old irony?

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
IMM wrote:
My preference has always been to drill a hole through the joist.
Notching a joist severely weakens it.

Not if you don't go down too deep and it is with 25% of the span from
a
wall, and the floor boards around the nlotches are screwed not nailed.

The correct way to try and regain some of the lost strength is to screw
a
steel plate across the notch. This has the added benefit of protecting
the
pipe to some extent.

Correct way? That is only one way.


So how come *you* never mentioned it.... probably because you have only just
been told yourself, I suspect....

"IMM" wrote


Is there any preference between straight cut ( |_| ) or 'U' shape notches
?

Makes no difference.

of corse it makes a difference! a joist with a smoothly shaped "U"
will be far stronger than a straight cut slot.


shokka

John Rumm wrote If the replaced
floor board is screwed back then this adds rigidity.

With chipboard flooring that will add all the structural integrity of a
wheetabix....

lol! lol!

is imm for real? r u sure hes not a troll?

shokka

"Shockwave" wrote in message
m...
John Rumm wrote If the replaced
floor board is screwed back then this adds rigidity.

With chipboard flooring that will add all the structural integrity of a
wheetabix....

lol! lol!

is imm for real? r u sure hes not a troll?

shokka

This is the internet and this sort is found hanging around doing now sue
whatsoever.

"Shockwave" wrote in message
om...
"IMM" wrote


Is there any preference between straight cut ( |_| ) or 'U' shape
notches
?

Makes no difference.

of corse it makes a difference! a joist with a smoothly shaped "U"
will be far stronger than a straight cut slot.

nope. Regs say no problems with a straight cut. Duh!

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 09:19:14 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 00:50:22 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Andy Hall" wrote in message

You can use just a copper bend and plastic pushfit fittings at
either
side
of the bend.


What on earth for?

So you can have a tight bend that does not want to unbend itself.
Unless
you use unipipe.

If you use the formers supplied by the plastic plumbing manufacturers
you can have quite a tight bend which will stay in place without
having to mess around with this.

Or better still use proper pipe. The expense of all this garbage too,
special formers and whatnot.

It's one of the tradeoffs between cost of materials vs. time taken and
between doing a job properly and bodging it.

Exactly. Copper is quicker and a proper pro job. Plastic is for the
toybox.

How much do you donate
to the rich each year?

Way too much in taxes, national insurance,
VAT, duty,.........

How much do you personally donate to the rich each year?

In article , IMM wrote:


"Shockwave" wrote in message
. com...
"IMM" wrote


Is there any preference between straight cut ( |_| ) or 'U' shape
notches
?

Makes no difference.

of corse it makes a difference! a joist with a smoothly shaped "U"
will be far stronger than a straight cut slot.

nope. Regs say no problems with a straight cut. Duh!

Well the regs can't override the laws of mechanics. A round corner will
present a much lower stress concentration factor than a sharp one (but
the reduction may well be less in fibrous wood than in a homogeneous
material like steel). So it will make a difference, as a smoothly shaped
"U" could be stronger. But you can't take advantage of the extra
strength and go deeper since the regs make no allowance for it.

--
Mike Clarke

IMM wrote:

Exactly. Copper is quicker and a proper pro job. Plastic is for the
toybox.

How do you figure copper will be quicker?

When you have to traverse several joists (and circumstances dictate that
you can't notch the joists or even place all the holes through the
joists inline), copper would be a nightmare! You would have to assemble
a pipe run from lots of short segments joined together - very time
consuming with lots of under floor joints.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
IMM wrote:
Not if you don't go down too deep and it is with 25% of the span
from a wall, and the floor boards around the nlotches are screwed
not nailed.

The correct way to try and regain some of the lost strength is to
screw a steel plate across the notch. This has the added benefit of
protecting the pipe to some extent.

Correct way? That is only one way.

Judging by your recent posts, 'correct' has no place in your 'head'.

--
*If you lived in your car, you'd be home by now *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
IMM wrote:
This is the internet and this sort is found hanging around doing now sue
whatsoever.

Bit early to have been on the sauce?

--
*Can fat people go skinny-dipping?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.