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?Q?How_=26=24=25=5e=c2=a3*=26!_hard_can_it_be_to_ securely_de?=?B?c3Ryb3kgYSBoYXJkIGRpc2M/Pz8/?=
Whenever I wish to sell on of a hard disc, I *always* do a secure
overwrite using a variety of software tools, such as DBAN (Darik's Boot 'n' Nuke)and it gets securely erased to DoD standards..... before it leaves my hands..... So my personal and financial data does not get exploited by ne-er do wells.... I had 2 off 40 GB and 2 off 500 GB hard discs that either had the click of death or was not "present" in the BIOS attached drives autodetection list. So Using DBAN was clearly out of the question on any of these 4 drives and I could't even sell them on for spares or repair as it still had my digital data on it. The last time I had to securely destroy a disk, it had glass platters coated in a magnetic metal oxide. They were *easy* to destroy, with a lump hammer! So today I set to work with these 4 failed drives which are 7,200 rpm versions Got my battery powered screwdriver and remmoved all the Torx screws including those under the stickers. PCBs was successfully removed from all 4 drives and tossed into WEEE bin The metal Lids was also successfully removed after breaking the hermetic seal from all four and tossed into WEEE bin. The torx screws were removed for the read/write heads on swinging arms and removed..... and tossed into WEEE bin. Then the spindle annular rings have 6 torx screws, which are successfully removed and tossed into WEEE bin.... I then remove the platters and I end up with 10 platters (3 form two drives and 2 from 2 drives) I then try and smash them with a hammer. just put a dint into the surface so clearly not glass. I then get the chop saw out with a metal cutting blade... Blunted the brand new blade. I then get the HSS drill bit set out and the pillar drill..... The HSS drilsl won't touch it...... Then I the favoured uk.d-i-y nuclear option... a grinder! I take the platters to my bench grinder..... the grinding wheels are blunted and you can see streaks of metal embedded in the discs from the platters..... I didn't have a professional grade degausser unit so that was not an option open to me..... So I think long and hard about what other methods are open to me to securely destroy the platters.... I then fill up the garage sink with water after putting the sink plug in. I use a pair of mole grips to hold the disc platter by the edge and light my MAPP blowtorch... I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Rinse and repeat 9 more times.... 1 empty bottle of MAPP gas later, the metal granules are now in the WEEE bin! RESULT! |
How ?Q?=26=24=25=5E=C2=A3=2A=26=21?= hard can it be tosecurely destroy a hard disc????
SH wrote:
[snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. -- Chris Green · |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote:
Whenever I wish to sell on of a hard disc, I *always* do a secure overwrite using a variety of software tools, such as DBAN (Darik's Boot 'n' Nuke)and it gets securely erased to DoD standards..... before it leaves my hands..... So my personal and financial data does not get exploited by ne-er do wells.... I had 2 off 40 GB and 2 off 500 GB hard discs that either had the click of death or was not "present" in the BIOS attached drives autodetection list. So Using DBAN was clearly out of the question on any of these 4 drives and I could't even sell them on for spares or repair as it still had my digital data on it. The last time I had to securely destroy a disk, it had glass platters coated in a magnetic metal oxide.Â* They were *easy* to destroy, with a lump hammer! So today I set to work with these 4 failed drives which are 7,200 rpm versions Got my battery powered screwdriver and remmoved all the Torx screws including those under the stickers. PCBs was successfully removed from all 4 drives and tossed into WEEE bin The metal Lids was also successfully removed after breaking the hermetic seal from all four and tossed into WEEE bin. The torx screws were removed for the read/write heads on swinging arms and removed..... and tossed into WEEE bin. Then the spindle annular rings have 6 torx screws, which are successfully removed and tossed into WEEE bin.... I then remove the platters and I end up with 10 platters (3 form two drives and 2 from 2 drives) I then try and smash them with a hammer. just put a dint into the surface so clearly not glass. I then get the chop saw out with a metal cutting blade... Blunted the brand new blade. I then get the HSS drill bit set out and the pillar drill..... The HSS drilsl won't touch it...... Then I the favoured uk.d-i-y nuclear option... a grinder! I take the platters to my bench grinder..... the grinding wheels are blunted and you can see streaks of metal embedded in the discs from the platters..... I didn't have a professional grade degausser unit so that was not an option open to me..... So I think long and hard about what other methods are open to me to securely destroy the platters.... I then fill up the garage sink with water after putting the sink plug in. I use a pair of mole grips to hold the disc platter by the edge and light my MAPP blowtorch... I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Rinse and repeat 9 more times.... 1 empty bottle of MAPP gas later, the metal granules are now in the WEEE bin! RESULT! I'm currently burning garden waste, old bit of fence etc. in a home made incinerator made from a 200 litre oil drum with assorted air holes, on a little stand to protect the rough bit of lawn. With dry-ish stuff the bottom half gets up to a reasonable red heat in no time. I don't believe you need to dismantle, just pop them on the top of the pile once it has started, and collect the remains in the morning. |
How ?Q?=26=24=25=5E=C2=A3=2A=26=21?= hard can it be to securely destroy a hard disc????
Chris Green wrote:
SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. People seem to get huge satisfaction out of destroying hard drives, for some reason. It isn't necessary. As soon as you've opened the lid it's a £1K+++ repair job, and nobody is going to bother with that unless they have a really good reason to spend the money. Secondly, if the drive is broken so you can't get at it, likely nobody else can either without spending that sort of money on it. Theo |
How &$%^£*&! hard can it be to securely destroy a hard disc????
On Thu, 15 Apr 2021 20:02:08 +0100, SH wrote:
snip PCBs was successfully removed from all 4 drives and tossed into WEEE bin The metal Lids was also successfully removed after breaking the hermetic seal from all four and tossed into WEEE bin. The torx screws were removed for the read/write heads on swinging arms and removed..... and tossed into WEEE bin. Then the spindle annular rings have 6 torx screws, which are successfully removed and tossed into WEEE bin.... snip I use a pair of mole grips to hold the disc platter by the edge and light my MAPP blowtorch... I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Rinse and repeat 9 more times.... 1 empty bottle of MAPP gas later, the metal granules are now in the WEEE bin! Once you have broken something like that down into it's component parts, wouldn't the metals (case, lid, platter droplets, screws etc) go in the 'metals' with only the PCB / heads going in the WEE bin? I appreciate most other stuff in there will contain many of the same components you have but the difference being yours are now separated? I just took our old tumble dryer to pieces and ended up with the metals (side panels, screws, drum, heater), electrical bits (motor, switches, PCB, wiring) and plastics (base, ducting, lid, door) and they will all go to different places: Metal / motor to the scrappy with the load of batteries I've built up, plastics in 'Hard plastics' and the other electrical bits in the WEE container at the same place as the plastics and the PCB / connectors / cable to a PCB recyclers when I go that way next (the other two places are local). The last time I went to the PCB recyclers there one a 1 tonne bag there half full of all sorts of connectors (most with brass / gold plated pins). I asked how much that would fetch full and I think it was way more than I expected. I think they even reclaim the solder. Cheers, T i m |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote:
I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Why bother? Hit it a few times with a hammer. Break the PCB, and nobody is going to try to resurrect it. |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 21:58, GB wrote:
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote: I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Why bother? Hit it a few times with a hammer. Break the PCB, and nobody is going to try to resurrect it. +4 (in a box waiting for next trip to tip) -- Robin reply-to address is (intended to be) valid |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote:
Whenever I wish to sell on of a hard disc, I *always* do a secure overwrite using a variety of software tools, such as DBAN (Darik's Boot 'n' Nuke)and it gets securely erased to DoD standards..... before it leaves my hands..... So my personal and financial data does not get exploited by ne-er do wells.... I had 2 off 40 GB and 2 off 500 GB hard discs that either had the click of death or was not "present" in the BIOS attached drives autodetection list. So Using DBAN was clearly out of the question on any of these 4 drives and I could't even sell them on for spares or repair as it still had my digital data on it. The last time I had to securely destroy a disk, it had glass platters coated in a magnetic metal oxide.Â* They were *easy* to destroy, with a lump hammer! So today I set to work with these 4 failed drives which are 7,200 rpm versions I use one of two methods for this class of drive: Got my battery powered screwdriver and remmoved all the Torx screws including those under the stickers. PCBs was successfully removed from all 4 drives and tossed into WEEE bin The metal Lids was also successfully removed after breaking the hermetic seal from all four and tossed into WEEE bin. The torx screws were removed for the read/write heads on swinging arms and removed..... and tossed into WEEE bin. Then the spindle annular rings have 6 torx screws, which are successfully removed and tossed into WEEE bin.... I then remove the platters and I end up with 10 platters (3 form two drives and 2 from 2 drives) Yup all that, then repurpose the discs as coasters, having roughed up the surface a bit / given them a wipe over with a neodymium magnet. OR Skip all the above dissassembly steps, place drive on concrete floor, hit robustly with 14lb sledge several times. That is enough to bend the entire drive, platters and all, so it can't be spun up or read by any conventional method. (Yes there is a fair chance that GCHQ or the NSA might be able to get something back off them, but they are not the folks I am trying to keep out!) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?= ?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote:
SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Or just lose it somewhere nobody will ever find it. TW |
How =?iso-8859-1?q?=26=24=25=5E=A3*=26!_hard_can_it_be_to_securel y_destroy_a_?==?iso-8859-1?q?hard_disc=3F=3F=3F=3F?=
Theo wrote:
Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. People seem to get huge satisfaction out of destroying hard drives, for some reason. I just remove the lovely and very useful Neodymium Magnets and throw the rest in the recycle bin - |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJlbHkgZGUgIHN0cm95IGEgaGFyZCBkaXNjPz8/Pw==?=
On 15 Apr 2021 at 22:24:19 BST, "Tim Streater"
wrote: On 15 Apr 2021 at 20:02:08 BST, SH wrote: I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... You don't have to melt it. Just make the magnetic surface red-hot. That is enough to destroy all the magnetism and hence the info recorded on teh disk. Last lot I got rid of I drilled through the platters via the intact drive with a 10mm drill in a drill press. Took about 10sec per drive and it would take government resources to read the damaged platters. -- Roger Hayter |
How ?B?JiQlXsKjKiYhIGhhcmQgY2FuIGl0IGJlIHRvIHNlY3VyZW w=?=?B?eSBkZXN0cm95IGEgaGFyZCBkaXNjPz8/Pw==?=
SH wrote:
Whenever I wish to sell on of a hard disc, I *always* do a secure overwrite using a variety of software tools, such as DBAN (Darik's Boot 'n' Nuke)and it gets securely erased to DoD standards..... before it leaves my hands..... So my personal and financial data does not get exploited by ne-er do wells.... I had 2 off 40 GB and 2 off 500 GB hard discs that either had the click of death or was not "present" in the BIOS attached drives autodetection list. Just bend the platters in a bench vice. Cutting is not necessary. An MFM (magnetic force microscopy) cannot follow the surface if it isn't flat. The platters, if bent, will never ever ever be smooth enough at any future date, to be rotating on a spindle. They would smash the heads to hell and back. They have to be flat to an extremely tight tolerance, and once they're bent, no amount of hammering and fussing, will make them flat again. Just bend them. The government here, uses a chipper. There is no degausser certified to destroy the bits stored on the platter, so physical destruction is the preferred method, and there is a chipper with hardened blades that they use. And at a guess, with frequent blade/disc changes. On certain high tech drives (6TB, with 256MB or larger cache), there is a flash chip which stored the cache data if the power goes off suddenly. For those disks, the flash chip must be shredded (for high security applications). There are also drives which had flash-cache, 8GB of SLC used for caching, and the same recommendation there, the 8GB of SLC should be shredded. Not every PCB is devoid of user data, most are, but there are exceptions. The ones with Flash Cache might have been called "FireCuda". Paul |
How &$%^*&! hard can it be to securely destroy a hard disc????
|
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
John Rumm wrote:
repurpose the discs as coasters, having roughed up the surface a bit / given them a wipe over with a neodymium magnet. OR Skip all the above dissassembly steps, place drive on concrete floor, hit robustly with 14lb sledge several times. I think I've got "enough" magnets out of hard drives by now, and though the platters are pretty and shiny, and might make good bird scarers, I don't need them, so I just take a plugging chisel and lump hammer to mash the case into the platters. |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote:
SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) Need I go on? |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVe772jKiYhIGhhcmQgY2FuIGl0IGJlIH RvIHNlY3VyZWx5IGRlc3Ryb3kgYSBoYXJkIGRpc2M/Pz8/?=
On 15 Apr 2021 at 23:44:32 BST, " wrote:
Theo wrote: Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. People seem to get huge satisfaction out of destroying hard drives, for some reason. I just remove the lovely and very useful Neodymium Magnets and throw the rest in the recycle bin +1 - one of life's pleasures :-) -- Cheers, Rob |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 21:58, GB wrote:
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote: I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Why bother? Hit it a few times with a hammer. Break the PCB, and nobody is going to try to resurrect it. was that hit the whole intact drive or hit the platters only? Your reply was not clear on that point |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
Yup all that, then repurpose the discs as coasters, having roughed up the surface a bit / given them a wipe over with a neodymium magnet. That won't fly with SWMBO, she will not recognise them as coasters and would throw them in the bin. Skip all the above dissassembly steps, place drive on concrete floor, hit robustly with 14lb sledge several times. That is enough to bend the entire drive, platters and all, so it can't be spun up or read by any conventional method.Â* (Yes there is a fair chance that GCHQ or the NSA might be able to get something back off them, but they are not the folks I am trying to keep out!) The Hard drive is based on arather substantial frame (most likely to be aluminium. I'd rather direct the destructive energy onto the individual platters otherwise, you can;t gaurantee the destructive energy *is* getting through to the platters if you're hitting the entire drive..... Plus some drives have multiple platters...... |
How ?Q?=26=24=25=5E=C2=A3=2A=26=21?= hard can it be tosecurely destroy a hard disc????
GB wrote:
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote: I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Why bother? Hit it a few times with a hammer. Break the PCB, and nobody is going to try to resurrect it. The one thing that *might* do is suggest there's something worth hiding! :-) -- Chris Green · |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
The government here, uses a chipper. There is no degausser certified to destroy the bits stored on the platter, so physical destruction is the preferred method, and there is a chipper with hardened blades that they use. And at a guess, with frequent blade/disc changes. Thats really useful info..... That confirms my view that physical destruction *was* the correct way to go. On certain high tech drives (6TB, with 256MB or larger cache), there is a flash chip which stored the cache data if the power goes off suddenly. For those disks, the flash chip must be shredded (for high security applications). There are also drives which had flash-cache, 8GB of SLC used for caching, and the same recommendation there, the 8GB of SLC should be shredded. Not every PCB is devoid of user data, most are, but there are exceptions. The ones with Flash Cache might have been called "FireCuda". Â* Paul Duly noted for the future time when I have such a drive, I assume they are hybrid hard drives (HHDs)? |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 16/04/2021 08:49, SH wrote:
On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother.Â* Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) Need I go on? Plus once an attacker has your details, they can make themselves *far* more convincing when they phone you and say Hello Mr/Mrs/Miss XXXXX, I'm from (high Street bank), we've detected suspiscious acitivity on your bank account number XXYYZZ, we see its a joint account with youe spouse, Mr/mrs XXXX and we see you have a pension plan with Pension provider from the direct debits etc etc...... |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?= ?Q?l_y_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 16/04/2021 09:00, Tim Streater wrote:
On 16 Apr 2021 at 00:00:10 BST, Paul wrote: The government here, uses a chipper. There is no degausser certified to destroy the bits stored on the platter, ... AISB, red heat is all that is required to randomise all magnetic information in iron. Interestingly enough, the metal platter did not glow red hot at all.... It just softened and then finally dripped globules into the water. There was some brief flame flashes as the magnetic layer delaminated from the metal disc. |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote:
Whenever I wish to sell on of a hard disc, I *always* do a secure overwrite using a variety of software tools, such as DBAN (Darik's Boot 'n' Nuke)and it gets securely erased to DoD standards..... before it leaves my hands..... So my personal and financial data does not get exploited by ne-er do wells.... You need a chemical, brick acid? vinegar? to drown the drives in. That will be quick. (Suggestions for something safe, I could bottle and sell?) In the US, when they were doing 'cash for clunkers', the engine oil would be replaced with a sodium silicate solution to put the block beyond use. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Car_Al...ppage_criteria -- Adrian C |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?= ?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 16/04/2021 09:01, SH wrote:
Plus once an attacker has your details, they can make themselves *far* more convincing when they phone you and say Hello Mr/Mrs/Miss XXXXX, I'm from (high Street bank), we've detected suspiscious acitivity on your bank account number XXYYZZ, we see its a joint account with youe spouse, Mr/mrs XXXX and we see you have a pension plan with Pension provider from the direct debits etc etc...... I see you use Windows*. "They" probably already have your data. Just joking.... -- Adrian C |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJlbHkgZGVzdHJveQ==?=?B?IGEgaGFyZCBkaXNjPz8/Pw==?=
On Friday, 16 April 2021 at 08:50:03 UTC+1, SH wrote:
On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) Need I go on? Many of us have not one single .pst file. (I have one - which is an file last written in 2012! I think I might have used it to recover something or other.) Many, many of us let people know which banks we have relationships with every time we use a credit or debit card. Or each time a postie delivers a letter from one of them (albeit very few these days, for me). Or we throw out envelopes and letters as waste paper. Having been involved in getting drives recovered, even being able to access the data at all in a failed drive it pretty lucky. After going through even a fraction of the steps discussed in this thread, it would reach the miracle level. |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?=?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
On 16/04/2021 08:51, SH wrote:
On 15/04/2021 21:58, GB wrote: On 15/04/2021 20:02, SH wrote: I apply the blue flame to platter and then finally manage to melt the platter and watch molten droplets of metal drop off into the sinkful of water... Why bother? Hit it a few times with a hammer. Break the PCB, and nobody is going to try to resurrect it. was that hit the whole intact drive or hit the platters only? Your reply was not clear on that point I hit the whole drive pretty hard with a hammer. That should damage the motor etc, but not necessarily the platters. If you smash the PCB, it becomes a major job to source another, so nobody is going to bother. |
?B?UmU6IEhvdyAmJCVewqMqJiEgaGFyZCBjYW4gaXQgYmUgdG 8gc2VjdXJl?= ?Q?ly_destroy_a_hard_disc=3f=3f=3f=3f?=
Many, many of us let people know which banks we have relationships with every time we use a credit or debit card. Or each time a postie delivers a letter from one of them (albeit very few these days, for me). Or we throw out envelopes and letters as waste paper. I actually snip out the address labels from post and parcels and it is then stored in the fire bucket and used to start fires with in the woodburner.... the rest of the packaging then goes into the recycling All paper correspondence also ends up as firestarter material for the woodburner. Some papers seme to come with a finish of some description that makes it a challenge to actually light and get burning.... a MAPP blowlamp soon sorts that out :-) |
How ?Q?=26=24=25=5E=C2=A3=2A=26=21?= hard can it be tosecurely destroy a hard disc????
SH wrote:
On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc I don't store any personal informaition in my browser. 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. So what, what's interesting in my E-Mails? 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with No they're not. I have to tell anyone who pays me money "who you have a bankign relationship with" anyway. 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) They're encrypted. .... and it *still* won't be worth anyone spending a lot of money searching for information on lots of disks on the offchance they'll find something useful somewhere. Can anyone show us real evidence that there are people out there searching through old hard disks looking for this sort of data? -- Chris Green · |
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I hit the whole drive pretty hard with a hammer. That should damage the motor etc, but not necessarily the platters. If you smash the PCB, it becomes a major job to source another, so nobody is going to bother. Sourcing another PCB is easy, eBay is a good source of failed drives from which you can take teh PCB from as a donor "organ" I prefer to direct the destructive energy at the platters *themselves* S. |
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On 16/04/2021 09:35, Chris Green wrote:
SH wrote: On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc I don't store any personal informaition in my browser. 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. So what, what's interesting in my E-Mails? 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with No they're not. I have to tell anyone who pays me money "who you have a bankign relationship with" anyway. 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) They're encrypted. ... and it *still* won't be worth anyone spending a lot of money searching for information on lots of disks on the offchance they'll find something useful somewhere. Can anyone show us real evidence that there are people out there searching through old hard disks looking for this sort of data? https://uhra.herts.ac.uk/bitstream/h...pdf?sequence=1 Although it is focused at memory cards, the same principles applies to HDDs.... |
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On 16/04/2021 09:54, SH wrote:
On 16/04/2021 09:35, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother.Â* Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc I don't store any personal informaition in my browser. 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. So what, what's interesting in my E-Mails? 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with No they're not.Â* I have to tell anyone who pays me money "who you have a bankign relationship with" anyway. 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) They're encrypted. ... and it *still* won't be worth anyone spending a lot of money searching for information on lots of disks on the offchance they'll find something useful somewhere. Can anyone show us real evidence that there are people out there searching through old hard disks looking for this sort of data? https://uhra.herts.ac.uk/bitstream/h...pdf?sequence=1 Although it is focused at memory cards, the same principles applies to HDDs.... and this one too.....: https://www.comparitech.com/blog/inf...y-stick-study/ |
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"SH" wrote in message ... Many, many of us let people know which banks we have relationships with every time we use a credit or debit card. Or each time a postie delivers a letter from one of them (albeit very few these days, for me). Or we throw out envelopes and letters as waste paper. I actually snip out the address labels from post and parcels and it is then stored in the fire bucket and used to start fires with in the woodburner.... the rest of the packaging then goes into the recycling All paper correspondence also ends up as firestarter material for the woodburner. Mindlessly paranoid, but then we knew that already. Some papers seme to come with a finish of some description that makes it a challenge to actually light and get burning.... a MAPP blowlamp soon sorts that out :-) |
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"SH" wrote in message ... Yup all that, then repurpose the discs as coasters, having roughed up the surface a bit / given them a wipe over with a neodymium magnet. That won't fly with SWMBO, she will not recognise them as coasters and would throw them in the bin. Time to trade her in on a less stupid bimbo. Skip all the above dissassembly steps, place drive on concrete floor, hit robustly with 14lb sledge several times. That is enough to bend the entire drive, platters and all, so it can't be spun up or read by any conventional method. (Yes there is a fair chance that GCHQ or the NSA might be able to get something back off them, but they are not the folks I am trying to keep out!) The Hard drive is based on arather substantial frame (most likely to be aluminium. I'd rather direct the destructive energy onto the individual platters otherwise, you can;t gaurantee the destructive energy *is* getting through to the platters if you're hitting the entire drive..... Plus some drives have multiple platters...... |
?Q?_How_&$%^=C2=A3*&!_hard_can_it_be_?=?Q?to_securely_destroy_a_hard_disc=3F?=?Q?=3F=3F=3F?=
"SH" wrote in message ... On 16/04/2021 09:35, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: 1. Many browsers now "offer" to save your name, address, phone numbers and even usernames and passwords for all your web accounts. So its clearly stored somewhere on that disc I don't store any personal informaition in my browser. 2. Your email client will have a PST file containing *all* your emails, email addresses, email contents etc. So what, what's interesting in my E-Mails? 3. Online banking, online pensions etc whose web site addresses all in the web browser history at least so its easy to work out who you have a bankign relationship with No they're not. I have to tell anyone who pays me money "who you have a bankign relationship with" anyway. 4. Your own personal data on that disc like DoB, Nat Ins No, Name and address means a fraudster cam commit fraud in your "name" like loans, credit cards or SIM swap fraud or even empy your bank account(s) They're encrypted. ... and it *still* won't be worth anyone spending a lot of money searching for information on lots of disks on the offchance they'll find something useful somewhere. Can anyone show us real evidence that there are people out there searching through old hard disks looking for this sort of data? https://uhra.herts.ac.uk/bitstream/h...pdf?sequence=1 Although it is focused at memory cards, the same principles applies to HDDs.... Nope, because recovery is quite different. |
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How ?Q?=26=24=25=5E=C2=A3=2A=26=21?= hard can it be to securely destroy a hard disc????
SH wrote:
On 15/04/2021 21:17, Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. Thats really quite a very naieve position to take: Those kind of drive-by data slurping are fair arguments to *wipe* a HDD. But if it's broken, by definition nobody can read it, which means a miscreant can't read it either. They would have to spend time and money fixing it, which unless you're a high value target is not going to be worth it. If you did any kind of physical dismantling (taking the lid off, unscrewing the platters) that cost goes up by orders of magnitude. Need I go on? The solution to all of this is full disc encryption. Without the password the disc is full of random noise. If you are concerned about the disc falling into the wrong hands (on a laptop, or at disposal time) then FDE will protect against that. SSDs typically do FDE 'for free' - the raw flash is encrypted, and a 'secure erase' is simply deleting the key from inside the controller. No angle grinders needed. Theo |
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In article ,
Theo wrote: Chris Green wrote: SH wrote: [snip silly attempts to destroy a disk] Really, why bother. Unless you're a known millionaire then no one cares what's on your hard disks. People seem to get huge satisfaction out of destroying hard drives, for some reason. It isn't necessary. As soon as you've opened the lid it's a £1K+++ repair job, and nobody is going to bother with that unless they have a really good reason to spend the money. Secondly, if the drive is broken so you can't get at it, likely nobody else can either without spending that sort of money on it. Theo Quite. Those CSI TV progs have a lot to answer for. ;-) -- *The colder the X-ray table, the more of your body is required on it * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
How ?Q?=26=24=25=5E=C2=A3=2A=26=21?= hard can it be tosecurely destroy a hard disc????
SH wrote:
Can anyone show us real evidence that there are people out there searching through old hard disks looking for this sort of data? https://uhra.herts.ac.uk/bitstream/h...pdf?sequence=1 Although it is focused at memory cards, the same principles applies to HDDs.... That's not evidence of people actually digging around for old data it's just evidence that it's there and that people don't erase it. .... and memory cards are rather different from hard disks. Even so the paper says that some of the cards were 'faulty' and that they couldn't thus get at the data, this is the case we're dealing with regarding hard disks. -- Chris Green · |
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