Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass or
doesit need to go on the outside

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if you
aren't skilled at it?

TIA

tim,

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 10:33:11 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:

Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass or
doesit need to go on the outside

A question I would be interested in an answer to.

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if you
aren't skilled at it?

Only watched a mate put tinted film on a curved car window (well, VW
campervan) and it looked a right PATA.

On flat domestic windows it should be easy and I have lined the inside
of an office unit door 'window' with some frosted film and that was
quite easy.

The trick with most these films is getting the right quantity of the
right lubricant between the film and glass (often weak detergent /
water mix) and using the right hard / softness of 'squeegee to drive
the water out.

Like most things it's all down to prep (getting the glass perfectly
clean), getting the film in place and squeezing it out with the right
effort (so as to not stretch / tear the film but to squeeze the water
out).

Cheers, T i m

On 13/08/2020 10:33, tim... wrote:
Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass
or doesit need to go on the outside

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if
you aren't skilled at it?

Since it is only for a few sunny days a year look for some of the
polyester base holographic aluminised or gold coloured gift wrapping
paper that is on sale in the likes of Smiths or Clintons. It makes a big
difference to the heat in the room and the light level for seeing a
screen. We have some bluetacked up in my wife's office (other spare
bedroom).

It looks a bit weird from outside but it works well enough and is much
cheaper than the fancy films sold for the job. We had some in the loft
which is why it got used. I doubt it makes much difference which side of
the glass the film is placed - the glass does not get warm in sunshine.

As for applying it I have only done the stuff intended to mist windows
for toilets in the village hall and you need to apply it fairly
accurately to clean dry glass starting from one corner and working
outward so as not to generate a trapped bubble. Lining it up accurately
is harder than it sounds but you just need a steady hand and patience.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 13/08/2020 10:33, tim... wrote:
Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass
or doesit need to go on the outside

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if
you aren't skilled at it?

TIA

tim,



We had it done on some lab windows, I *think* it was put on the inside.
It was astonishingly effective.

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 10:33:11 +0100
"tim..." wrote:

Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the
glass or doesit need to go on the outside

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess
if you aren't skilled at it?

TIA

tim,




It goes on the inside. We had it professionally installed on several of
our south and west facing windows, and it makes a big difference. The
pros have all the right equipment to cut each piece quickly, and know
what they are doing.

--
Davey.

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 15:32:49 +0100, Davey
wrote:

snip

It goes on the inside. We had it professionally installed on several of
our south and west facing windows, and it makes a big difference. The
pros have all the right equipment to cut each piece quickly, and know
what they are doing.

What does it look like from the outside, how much light does it stop
coming in and how easy is it to see out through?

Might you want to take it off in the cooler days to get some free heat
in (and apply new before the next summer)?

Cheers, T i m

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 10:33:26 UTC+1, tim... wrote:
Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass or
doesit need to go on the outside

Marginally better on the outside, as it reflects heat and if it's on the inside it will reflect heat through the glass, which in my experience gets noticeably warmer.

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if you
aren't skilled at it?

I think the hardest thing is cutting a really straight edge to meet the frame.

I did mine with only very minor bubbling just using a sponge, but if you have a lot to do investing in the proper squeegee would definately help.

It does darken the room for the rest of the year though, but for something like a south facing bedroom if you are sensitive to heat (I am) I think it's worth it.

Also remember with the lights on in winter you can't see out, but people can see in.

Davey wrote:

It goes on the inside. We had it professionally installed on several of
our south and west facing windows, and it makes a big difference.

Once customer has a raised glass corridor, linking two buildings, it
used to roast in summer, much better with the film fitted, though they
did have some decals fitted afterwards to stop owls flying into it.

It's not too bad to apply if you're into that sort of thing but it's much harder for bigger pieces. If you apply lots of soapy water the piece of film can be moved really easily until it's just in the correct position.

The hardest job is getting the backing sheet off the sticky side and then turning it round so the sticky side faces the glass without it sticking to itself.

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 08:16:07 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

snip


It does darken the room for the rest of the year though, but for something like a south facing bedroom if you are sensitive to heat (I am) I think it's worth it.


I wonder how well it would work on the outside of some triple glazing?
Or do you think the heat generated between the inner layers might
cause a plastic (Acrylic / Perspex) layer to melt?

Cheers, T i m

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 15:40:58 +0100
T i m wrote:

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 15:32:49 +0100, Davey
wrote:

snip

It goes on the inside. We had it professionally installed on several
of our south and west facing windows, and it makes a big difference.
The pros have all the right equipment to cut each piece quickly, and
know what they are doing.

What does it look like from the outside, how much light does it stop
coming in and how easy is it to see out through?

Might you want to take it off in the cooler days to get some free heat
in (and apply new before the next summer)?

Cheers, T i m

Try these folks, who did ours.

https://www.ssafwindowfilms.com/

You might find some answers there.

We are very happy with them and their product.

--
Davey.

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 16:43:51 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
I wonder how well it would work on the outside of some triple glazing?
Or do you think the heat generated between the inner layers might
cause a plastic (Acrylic / Perspex) layer to melt?

I think it would be very unlikely to get the glass that hot in the UK!

Owain

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 09:22:46 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 16:43:51 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
I wonder how well it would work on the outside of some triple glazing?
Or do you think the heat generated between the inner layers might
cause a plastic (Acrylic / Perspex) layer to melt?

I think it would be very unlikely to get the glass that hot in the UK!


Except it's plastic?

Cheers, T i m

wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 13 August 2020 10:33:26 UTC+1, tim... wrote:
Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass or
doesit need to go on the outside

Marginally better on the outside, as it reflects heat and if it's on the
inside it will reflect heat through the glass, which in my experience gets
noticeably warmer.

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if
you
aren't skilled at it?

I think the hardest thing is cutting a really straight edge to meet the
frame.

I did mine with only very minor bubbling just using a sponge, but if you
have a lot to do investing in the proper squeegee would definately help.

It does darken the room for the rest of the year though, but for something
like a south facing bedroom if you are sensitive to heat (I am) I think
it's worth it.

Also remember with the lights on in winter you can't see out, but people
can see in.

I'm on the first floor, (hence the reason why I prefer not to have to put it
on the outside)

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 18:00:21 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
I think it would be very unlikely to get the glass that hot in the UK!
Except it's plastic?

I am not acquainted with plastic triple glazing.

Owain

"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 10:33:11 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:

Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass or
doesit need to go on the outside

A question I would be interested in an answer to.

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if you
aren't skilled at it?

Only watched a mate put tinted film on a curved car window (well, VW
campervan) and it looked a right PATA.

On flat domestic windows it should be easy and I have lined the inside
of an office unit door 'window' with some frosted film and that was
quite easy.

The trick with most these films is getting the right quantity of the
right lubricant between the film and glass (often weak detergent /
water mix) and using the right hard / softness of 'squeegee to drive
the water out.

Like most things it's all down to prep (getting the glass perfectly
clean), getting the film in place and squeezing it out with the right
effort (so as to not stretch / tear the film but to squeeze the water
out).

so

I found this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gzd5vmlLGI



Cheers, T i m

T i m wrote:
What does it look like from the outside, how much light does it stop
coming in and how easy is it to see out through?


I have some to fit next week.

The two major manufacturers I came across are 3M:
https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/window-films-uk/
and SolarGard:
https://www.solargard.com/uk/about-h...-and-business/

3M is a bit hard to get hold of in the UK (if I want to buy a couple of
metres worth rather than 30m rolls), so I settled on SolarGard, from these
people: https://tintsandtools.com/shop/categ...-control-films

If you look up the spec of a specific film it tells you various things. I'm
going to fit Sterling 50, which is:

%Visible Light Transmittance 49%
Visible Light Reflectance (Exterior) 26%
Ultraviolet Light Blocked 99%
Total Solar Energy Rejected 56%

That's about £20/m on 1.5m wide rolls. The best they do is Ecolux 70, which
is also a low-E film:

%Visible Light Transmittance 68%
Visible Light Reflectance (Exterior) 13%
Ultraviolet Light Blocked 99%
Total Solar Energy Rejected 52%
Heat Retention 48%

but Ecolux is £144/m!

And then there's the ebay and Amazon junk-merchants selling products with no
spec - best avoided.

Might you want to take it off in the cooler days to get some free heat
in (and apply new before the next summer)?

I'm going to give it a try and see, but guesstimate is that
spring/summer/autmun solar gain is going to be more of a problem than the
small amount of winter sun the east-facing windows might get.

This is the install video btw,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3qtwcVp8xY
and I did buy a proper squeegee to make life easier.

There are some films intended for external fitting (3M has several) - they
need more careful installation but they do have better performance. However
external is not an option in my situation.

Theo

On 13 Aug 2020 23:03:45 +0100 (BST), Theo
wrote:

T i m wrote:
What does it look like from the outside, how much light does it stop
coming in and how easy is it to see out through?


I have some to fit next week.

Exciting!

The two major manufacturers I came across are 3M:
https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/window-films-uk/
and SolarGard:
https://www.solargard.com/uk/about-h...-and-business/

3M is a bit hard to get hold of in the UK (if I want to buy a couple of
metres worth rather than 30m rolls), so I settled on SolarGard, from these
people: https://tintsandtools.com/shop/categ...-control-films

My friends run a print house, I'll ask them if they have got involved
in this sort of thing yet (they are mostly vinyl signs and vehicle
sign writing but also went on a car wrapping course etc).

If you look up the spec of a specific film it tells you various things. I'm
going to fit Sterling 50, which is:

%Visible Light Transmittance 49%
Visible Light Reflectance (Exterior) 26%
Ultraviolet Light Blocked 99%
Total Solar Energy Rejected 56%

That's about £20/m on 1.5m wide rolls. The best they do is Ecolux 70, which
is also a low-E film:

Ouch. You wouldn't want to muck too much up eh? ;-(

%Visible Light Transmittance 68%
Visible Light Reflectance (Exterior) 13%
Ultraviolet Light Blocked 99%
Total Solar Energy Rejected 52%
Heat Retention 48%

but Ecolux is £144/m!

Feck!

And then there's the ebay and Amazon junk-merchants selling products with no
spec - best avoided.

OK.

Might you want to take it off in the cooler days to get some free heat
in (and apply new before the next summer)?

I'm going to give it a try and see, but guesstimate is that
spring/summer/autmun solar gain is going to be more of a problem than the
small amount of winter sun the east-facing windows might get.

Makes sense.

This is the install video btw,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3qtwcVp8xY
and I did buy a proper squeegee to make life easier.

Much of that feels familiar (from watching them do bigger vehicle
sides) and the office doors I did.

There are some films intended for external fitting (3M has several) - they
need more careful installation but they do have better performance.

Makes sense (as mentioned elsewhere).

However
external is not an option in my situation.

It could be here but inside would be much easier. ;-)

It would be interesting if you could log some inside / outside
temperatures before and after Theo?

Cheers, T i m

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 11:23:36 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 18:00:21 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
I think it would be very unlikely to get the glass that hot in the UK!
Except it's plastic?

I am not acquainted with plastic triple glazing.

Ah, well, in the 'old days' before we had double glazing we could get
plastic sheets with a soft surround bead of self adhesive plastic
frame that you could clip in and out as the weather dictated. Some was
quite thin and used magnetic strips.

I was thinking that given we only used to see (before GW etc) these
current hot temperatures every so often, something 'temporary' wasn't
really an issue.

I was wondering about something similar (no one here would GAF what it
'looked like', especially if she was cooler g) and it would be
easier to fit the film on loose sheets of polycarbonate etc (just trim
it off at the edges once squeegee'd out)?

Cheers, T i m

T i m wrote:
On 13 Aug 2020 23:03:45 +0100 (BST), Theo
wrote:
My friends run a print house, I'll ask them if they have got involved
in this sort of thing yet (they are mostly vinyl signs and vehicle
sign writing but also went on a car wrapping course etc).

If they can apply car vinyl, I think this is the same principle. For the
people who sell solar film by the metre, this is mostly a sideline to their
car window tinting business.

Ouch. You wouldn't want to muck too much up eh? ;-(

True, although I reckon it's worth it if it makes the place habitable in the
hot weather we've just had. It wouldn't be a huge hurt if it didn't work
out, whereas getting someone in would be a few hundred quid I reckon.

It would be interesting if you could log some inside / outside
temperatures before and after Theo?

It's rather difficult because it depends on replicating the weather.
However I have been waving a Flir thermal camera around and yesterday the
temperature on the internal side of the blind was 55C.

Theo

On 14 Aug 2020 00:24:52 +0100 (BST), Theo
wrote:

T i m wrote:
On 13 Aug 2020 23:03:45 +0100 (BST), Theo
wrote:
My friends run a print house, I'll ask them if they have got involved
in this sort of thing yet (they are mostly vinyl signs and vehicle
sign writing but also went on a car wrapping course etc).

If they can apply car vinyl, I think this is the same principle. For the
people who sell solar film by the metre, this is mostly a sideline to their
car window tinting business.

Yes, I have see examples of their functional and decorative 'frosted
glass' / divider work, the sort of large logos you see in the fancy
offices and banks in London.

Ouch. You wouldn't want to muck too much up eh? ;-(

True, although I reckon it's worth it if it makes the place habitable in the
hot weather we've just had.

Oh sure.

I wonder if you can predict anything (realistic) from the '56% solar
energy reduction'? Like how much is coming from the frame, walls or
elsewhere to know what percentage of the overall percentage it will
be?

It wouldn't be a huge hurt if it didn't work
out, whereas getting someone in would be a few hundred quid I reckon.

And this is a d-i-y group. ;-)

I watched a mate trying to get some tinted film on the (concave)
inside of a camper van window. He was using a hot air gun and a
plastic spreader thing and initially it was all over the place and
looked like it wasn't ever going to succeed. Then, after a very long
time chasing air bubbles and wrinkles all over the place, it looked
like he had done it when he caught the corner of the tool in the film
and tore it. All went silent for a few seconds then he tore it all
off. ;-)

It would be interesting if you could log some inside / outside
temperatures before and after Theo?

It's rather difficult because it depends on replicating the weather.

No, but assuming it's at least 'sunny' and the sun in the worst
direction then the outside / inside temps would still be relevant /
comparative wouldn't they?

However I have been waving a Flir thermal camera around and yesterday the
temperature on the internal side of the blind was 55C.

Ouch!

I have an internal / external thermometer here and have been putting
the external bit just inside the main (South facing) window. Yesterday
with window and curtains closed it was 33DegC where I sit and the same
by the Window. Then I opened the window and curtains and the external
temp immediately crept up to 34.

OOI, I have a 'Crookes radiometer' on the internal windowsill and it's
interesting to see just what (level of solar energy) triggers it. Like
right now with no real sun about but fairly bright it's *just* moving
(1 rev every 5 seconds). As soon as the sun hits it properly it looks
like it's going to fly off it's bearing. ;-)

https://preview.tinyurl.com/yxdtyd3l (Mine is similar).

It typically reflects the activity you would be getting from a solar
panel at that time.


Cheers, T i m

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 23:46:47 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
I was thinking that given we only used to see (before GW etc) these
current hot temperatures every so often, something 'temporary' wasn't
really an issue.

An interesting idea to use something removable. But you could just use white louvre shutters :-)

I was wondering about something similar (no one here would GAF what it
'looked like', especially if she was cooler g)

Another option might be greenhouse shading paint.

https://thorndown.co.uk/product/whit...e-glass-paint/
the fancy stuff, £16 covers 5.4 m2.

https://www.greenhousesensation.co.u...g-500-ml.html/
£7.50 for an 8x6' greenhouse!

Owain

On Thursday, 13 August 2020 at 23:03:49 UTC+1, Theo wrote:
T i m wrote:
What does it look like from the outside, how much light does it stop
coming in and how easy is it to see out through?

I have some to fit next week.

The two major manufacturers I came across are 3M:
https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/window-films-uk/
and SolarGard:
https://www.solargard.com/uk/about-h...-and-business/

3M is a bit hard to get hold of in the UK (if I want to buy a couple of
metres worth rather than 30m rolls), so I settled on SolarGard, from these
people: https://tintsandtools.com/shop/categ...-control-films

If you look up the spec of a specific film it tells you various things. I'm
going to fit Sterling 50, which is:

%Visible Light Transmittance 49%
Visible Light Reflectance (Exterior) 26%
Ultraviolet Light Blocked 99%
Total Solar Energy Rejected 56%

49% transmittance 56% rejection makes it close to zero better than semi silvered film.


NT

T i m wrote:
I wonder if you can predict anything (realistic) from the '56% solar
energy reduction'? Like how much is coming from the frame, walls or
elsewhere to know what percentage of the overall percentage it will
be?

I can't quantify it, but the temps lately we

Inner side of blind when down (and window open): 55C
Ceiling: 45C
Walls: 35-40C
Downstairs: 25C
Outside: 33C

From the pictures I suspect the roof is uninsulated (we'll find out come
winter time) but by far the hottest part is the window. So I suspect the
major part of the heating is coming from solar gain.

I watched a mate trying to get some tinted film on the (concave)
inside of a camper van window. He was using a hot air gun and a
plastic spreader thing and initially it was all over the place and
looked like it wasn't ever going to succeed. Then, after a very long
time chasing air bubbles and wrinkles all over the place, it looked
like he had done it when he caught the corner of the tool in the film
and tore it. All went silent for a few seconds then he tore it all
off. ;-)

If I mess up, it's 40 quid down. Which isn't going to kill me.
If I succeed, I don't need to get someone out.
This is only for one room, BTW. If I succeed I'll do the other two.

No, but assuming it's at least 'sunny' and the sun in the worst
direction then the outside / inside temps would still be relevant /
comparative wouldn't they?

Not necessarily, given the possibility of solar gain from other surfaces
such as the roof. However I might do one window and not the other and see
if the difference is noticeable. With the blind down it limits how much the
temperature equalises with the rest of the room so you can see the incoming
flux better.

Theo

I'd be no good at it as I used to always get bubbles in wallpaper and have
corner peeling off.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"tim..." wrote in message
...


"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 10:33:11 +0100, "tim..."
wrote:

Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass or
doesit need to go on the outside

A question I would be interested in an answer to.

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if
you
aren't skilled at it?

Only watched a mate put tinted film on a curved car window (well, VW
campervan) and it looked a right PATA.

On flat domestic windows it should be easy and I have lined the inside
of an office unit door 'window' with some frosted film and that was
quite easy.

The trick with most these films is getting the right quantity of the
right lubricant between the film and glass (often weak detergent /
water mix) and using the right hard / softness of 'squeegee to drive
the water out.

Like most things it's all down to prep (getting the glass perfectly
clean), getting the film in place and squeezing it out with the right
effort (so as to not stretch / tear the film but to squeeze the water
out).

so

I found this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gzd5vmlLGI



Cheers, T i m

On 13/08/2020 11:42, Martin Brown wrote:
On 13/08/2020 10:33, tim... wrote:
Does this work as effectively if you put it on the inside of the glass
or doesit need to go on the outside

Is it an easy thing to install or do you end up with a wrinkly mess if
you aren't skilled at it?

Since it is only for a few sunny days a year look for some of the
polyester base holographic aluminised or gold coloured gift wrapping
paper that is on sale in the likes of Smiths or Clintons. It makes a big
difference to the heat in the room and the light level for seeing a
screen. We have some bluetacked up in my wife's office (other spare
bedroom).

It looks a bit weird from outside but it works well enough and is much
cheaper than the fancy films sold for the job. We had some in the loft
which is why it got used. I doubt it makes much difference which side of
the glass the film is placed - the glass does not get warm in sunshine.

As for applying it I have only done the stuff intended to mist windows
for toilets in the village hall and you need to apply it fairly
accurately to clean dry glass starting from one corner and working
outward so as not to generate a trapped bubble. Lining it up accurately
is harder than it sounds but you just need a steady hand and patience.

I have a thermal emergency 'blanket' which is gold one side, silver the
other and stick that on the inside of the patio doors with blue
masking tape during extreme hot weather.

The permanently applied stuff does cut the light levels dramatically,
which might annoy you on a gloomy winter day.