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Weed-proofing a gravel path
I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel
on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? -- Cheers, Roger ____________ Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom checked. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote:
I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? Salt? |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 10:45, newshound wrote:
On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote: I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? Salt? Which I would probably apply as the largest available granules, maybe lightly forked/raked in, rather than by "watering". To provide a sort of slow release. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 10:45, newshound wrote:
On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote: I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? Salt? My neighbour, a retired garage owner, still does occasinal body repairs for people and emptied out his spraycan full of gunwash thinners onto his front lawn a few years ago. (To annoy his wife I think). A dead patch duly appeared about 9 inches in diameter and nothing has ever grown there, not even weeds. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
"Roger Mills" wrote in message
... I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Beware also of soil getting into the gravel, above the still-intact weed membrane, allowing weeds to grow *above* the membrane. Our house has a *lot* of fairly deep 1/2" gravel for the drive, and it is covered in weeds. We've tried hoeing them off, and when I've pulled up weeds, they have had very shallow roots embedded in the gravel but not going through the membrane to the soil underneath. The gravel is a confounded nuisance, because it makes it *very* difficult to wheel the garden-waste bin to the garden where it is needed, and likewise for the lawn mower. Both start to dig into the gravel almost as soon as they go from paving stones/tarmac onto the gravel, and quickly end up buried up to their axles in gravel. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote:
I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I tend to find that over time enough organic matter accumulates (fallen leaves etc) in the gravel to support weed growth anyway. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? I was under the impression that if you cover a patch with something totally light proof for a few months it will kill off pretty much anything. Perhaps a layer of old carpet. -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On Friday, 21 June 2019 10:16:07 UTC+1, Roger Mills wrote:
I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? Salt. Almost as good as sodium chlorate. Obtainable cheaply for de-icing driveways. Or even free for the dishonest. You must dissolve it (strong solution) and water the ground, don't throw it down dry. Ineffective if you don't. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On Friday, 21 June 2019 10:16:07 UTC+1, Roger Mills wrote:
I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? Gravel is a pain in the bum. I have blocks, only slightly better due to the weed problem. And ants. Plus they fade & look like sh14 afer a while The only benefit is they can be taken up and put back. Go for tarmac or printed concrete. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 13:20, Chris Hogg wrote:
I don't think there is a perfect solution. Apart from conrete? |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21 Jun 2019, newshound wrote
(in articleSt6dnaTjr5ufZ5HAnZ2dnUU78S1QAAAA@brightvie w.co.uk): On 21/06/2019 13:20, Chris Hogg wrote: I don't think there is a perfect solution. Apart from conrete? You could try the application of a Flame Gun. Works OK for me on the gravel patch in my front garden. Available from eBay for about £8 plus £4 for the gas cartridges. Peter |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote:
I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. Matting is pointless . Weeds do not grow up from underneath after the initial laying. They get carried in along with soil in the wind and rain., And on the cars if its a drive I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? you can make sodium chlorate by boiling sodium hypochlorite aka bleach I agree is is the best 'desert storm' type 'kill everything forever' weedkiller But I think the answer is to regard gravel as not that permanent - I am redoing mine after about 16 yeas - its very bad where cars have dropped mud, OK in places where it was deep and cars haven't been. And thats the point. What caused the weeds is nothing to do with membranes. It is soil etc carried onto the gravel where it forms a great place for windblown weedseeds to get their feet down. That soil wont be chlorated so it wont stope the weeds. Alll that works is removing the weeds and the soil with them and regular 'path clear' or chorate I am going to try sieving the soil out & removing the weeds washing and and reusing it. Gravel is expensive. And so are minidiggers My drive is in total about 30 tonnes worth -- But what a weak barrier is truth when it stands in the way of an hypothesis! Mary Wollstonecraft |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 11:34, Andrew wrote:
On 21/06/2019 10:45, newshound wrote: On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote: I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? Salt? My neighbour, a retired garage owner, still does occasinal body repairs for people and emptied out his spraycan full of gunwash thinners onto his front lawn a few years ago. (To annoy his wife I think). A dead patch duly appeared about 9 inches in diameter and nothing has ever grown there, not even weeds. diesel will do that for about 5 years DAMHIKT -- "The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him." - Leo Tolstoy |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 11:58, NY wrote:
"Roger Mills" wrote in message ... I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Beware also of soil getting into the gravel, above the still-intact weed membrane, allowing weeds to grow *above* the membrane. Our house has a *lot* of fairly deep 1/2" gravel for the drive, and it is covered in weeds. We've tried hoeing them off, and when I've pulled up weeds, they have had very shallow roots embedded in the gravel but not going through the membrane to the soil underneath. The gravel is a confounded nuisance, because it makes it *very* difficult to wheel the garden-waste bin to the garden where it is needed, and likewise for the lawn mower. Both start to dig into the gravel almost as soon as they go from paving stones/tarmac onto the gravel, and quickly end up buried up to their axles in gravel. Hire a whacker for a day My gravel was like that until 15 years of cars.... -- "The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him." - Leo Tolstoy |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 12:03, John Rumm wrote:
On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote: I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I tend to find that over time enough organic matter accumulates (fallen leaves etc) in the gravel to support weed growth anyway. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? I was under the impression that if you cover a patch with something totally light proof for a few months it will kill off pretty much anything. Perhaps a layer of old carpet. Oh it will work but it looks **** and the weeds will spring up as soon as you remove it -- "The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him." - Leo Tolstoy |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 13:20, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019 10:17:40 +0100, Roger Mills wrote: I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? The original version of 'Pathclear' was quite effective at suppressing weed germination for quite a while, a season or perhaps longer. But it contained simazine, and was banned by the EU about 10 years ago, IIRC. The replacement version they claim is effective for three months, and opinions that I've read suggest it's not nearly as good as the original. But I'm not convinced that annual weeds will come up through a weed-proof membrane, but deep-rooted perennial weeds may well do. They dont need to. The sit on top of it. Annual weeds seed themselves like crazy Perennial weeds you just round up or pull up But it's inevitable that over time, however well you've sterilised the soil under the matting, soil from airborne dust will gradually accumulate in the gravel; airborne weeds seeds will then germinate in that soil. Regular application of the latest version of Pathlear will help suppress them, but it needs to be repeated regularly through the year which is APITB. I don't think there is a perfect solution. Bite te bullet and weed te thing by hand three times a year and use pathclear three times a ytear Ot dig it all out replace it and itlats anbouta year befire wthe firs tweeds arrive -- Future generations will wonder in bemused amazement that the early twenty-first centurys developed world went into hysterical panic over a globally average temperature increase of a few tenths of a degree, and, on the basis of gross exaggerations of highly uncertain computer projections combined into implausible chains of inference, proceeded to contemplate a rollback of the industrial age. Richard Lindzen |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
Peter wrote:
On 21 Jun 2019, newshound wrote (in articleSt6dnaTjr5ufZ5HAnZ2dnUU78S1QAAAA@brightvie w.co.uk): On 21/06/2019 13:20, Chris Hogg wrote: I don't think there is a perfect solution. Apart from conrete? You could try the application of a Flame Gun. Works OK for me on the gravel patch in my front garden. Available from eBay for about £8 plus £4 for the gas cartridges. Peter Those little things only tickle things as my Dad used to say, Go for the Sheen paraffin version . Still available to the same design it has used since the 1950s. Older ones often on EBay sold by people who have scared themselves using them,especially their propensity to fire 6ft jets of flame on start up. Get the knack though and it makes weed killing fun. GH |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019 05:07:18 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote:
Salt. Almost as good as sodium chlorate. Well the very edge of grass verges go brown towards the end of winter but very soon green back up. Wouldn't with sodium chlorate... -- Cheers Dave. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 22 Jun 2019 04:13:09 GMT, Marland wrote:
You could try the application of a Flame Gun. Works OK for me on the gravel patch in my front garden. Damn forgot I have one of those, having spent the best part of a day weeding the slate chippings. Those little things only tickle things as my Dad used to say, That's all you need to do, you don't incenerate the weeds in place. The blast of heat damages the plant cells and they wither within days. Go for the Sheen paraffin version. Still available to the same design it has used since the 1950's. Older ones often on EBay ... Be better for a larger area than a small handheld gas jobbie. ... sold by people who have scared themselves using them,especially their propensity to fire 6ft jets of flame on start up. Yes, remember that happening when Dad was lighting a paraffin blowlamp. I think it happens when you try to turn on the paraffin before everything has got hot enough from the meths to vapourise it. Still got that blowlamp must try it some time. Also a petrol one, IIRC that needs a preheat but self pressurises, not sure I have the courage to try out, Dad didn't like it either. Get the knack though and it makes weed killing fun. A gas torch-on-felt burner would be a suitable alternative but no where near as much fun. B-) -- Cheers Dave. |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 21/06/2019 19:02, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 21/06/2019 12:03, John Rumm wrote: On 21/06/2019 10:17, Roger Mills wrote: I have a patio area/path consisting of a couple of inches of pea gravel on top of some weed matting. When I first created this 20-odd years ago, I gave the soil a liberal dose of sodium chlorate before laying the weed matting. This kept it weed-free for quite a few years, but the matting has now deteriorated - allowing a lot of weeds to take root. I tend to find that over time enough organic matter accumulates (fallen leaves etc) in the gravel to support weed growth anyway. I have removed the gravel and the weeds, and am about to take up the matting and renew it before covering it with new gravel. I need to be able to neutralise the soil in order to prevent any roots or seeds left in from growing. I don't think you can buy sodium chlorate any more. Most of the weedkillers available seem to be of the systemic type - which kill existing weeds but don't affect the soil. But that's not what I want! Any bright ideas? I was under the impression that if you cover a patch with something totally light proof for a few months it will kill off pretty much anything. Perhaps a layer of old carpet. Oh it will work but it looks **** can you see it under the gravel? and the weeds will spring up as soon as you remove it So leave it there... -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
Weed-proofing a gravel path
On 22/06/2019 09:19, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019 05:07:18 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote: Salt. Almost as good as sodium chlorate. Well the very edge of grass verges go brown towards the end of winter but very soon green back up. Wouldn't with sodium chlorate... I had rabbits grazing the dead nettles in my gravel so today I got out my brand new £2.95 sieve from Home base, and started shovelling the gravel into it One trug for anything green one for what was sieved and then just put the gravel back You would not *believe* how much soil I sieved out. Probably a large bucketful for every square meter. Rate was about a square meter an hour for the very bad bits 3 sq meters done ...15 to go... I got about 10 kilos of compostable material as well -- Some people like to travel by train because it combines the slowness of a car with the cramped public exposure of an airplane. Dennis Miller |
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