I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.
--
Tim Lamb

On 23/08/2018 21:43, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slotÂ* brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.

I have spur shelving in my study. The uprights are secured (through
plasterboard) to studs with standard spacing. The shelves are
contiboard and conrain books, magazines and (small) laser printer.
There is no sign of bowing of the shelves after 20 years

Malcolm

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

In message , Malcolm Race
writes
On 23/08/2018 21:43, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot* brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply
walls so I'm not restricted to the studs.
Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a
box preserves.

I have spur shelving in my study. The uprights are secured (through
plasterboard) to studs with standard spacing. The shelves are
contiboard and conrain books, magazines and (small) laser printer.
There is no sign of bowing of the shelves after 20 years

Standard spacing could be 600 or 400 but no bowing is encouraging;-)
Books are heavy!

--
Tim Lamb

On 24/08/2018 08:44, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Malcolm Race
writes
On 23/08/2018 21:43, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slotÂ* brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply
wallsÂ* so I'm not restricted to the studs.
Â*Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a
boxÂ* preserves.

I have spur shelving in my study.Â* The uprights are secured (through
plasterboard) to studs with standard spacing.Â* The shelves are
contiboard and conrain books, magazines andÂ* (small) laser printer.
There is no sign of bowing of the shelves after 20 years

Standard spacing could be 600 or 400 but no bowing is encouraging;-)
Books are heavy!


Yep - decently short spacing intervals is the key IME.

That said, I took a chance (on recommendation) with some alcove shelving
with support just at the walls (so 1m+ spacing) using 18mm timberboard
supporting quite heavy books - so far so good after 3 years. Friend
tried the same using 18mm pine - bowed within weeks.

--
Cheers, Rob

On Friday, 24 August 2018 09:44:28 UTC+1, RJH wrote:
On 24/08/2018 08:44, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Malcolm Race
writes
On 23/08/2018 21:43, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slotÂ* brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply
wallsÂ* so I'm not restricted to the studs.
Â*Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a
boxÂ* preserves.

I have spur shelving in my study.Â* The uprights are secured (through
plasterboard) to studs with standard spacing.Â* The shelves are
contiboard and conrain books, magazines andÂ* (small) laser printer.
There is no sign of bowing of the shelves after 20 years

Standard spacing could be 600 or 400 but no bowing is encouraging;-)
Books are heavy!


Yep - decently short spacing intervals is the key IME.

That said, I took a chance (on recommendation) with some alcove shelving
with support just at the walls (so 1m+ spacing) using 18mm timberboard
supporting quite heavy books - so far so good after 3 years. Friend
tried the same using 18mm pine - bowed within weeks.

Interesting. The timberboard I've got is pine.


NT

On 24/08/2018 09:59, wrote:
On Friday, 24 August 2018 09:44:28 UTC+1, RJH wrote:
On 24/08/2018 08:44, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Malcolm Race
writes
On 23/08/2018 21:43, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slotÂ* brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply
wallsÂ* so I'm not restricted to the studs.
Â*Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a
boxÂ* preserves.

I have spur shelving in my study.Â* The uprights are secured (through
plasterboard) to studs with standard spacing.Â* The shelves are
contiboard and conrain books, magazines andÂ* (small) laser printer.
There is no sign of bowing of the shelves after 20 years

Standard spacing could be 600 or 400 but no bowing is encouraging;-)
Books are heavy!


Yep - decently short spacing intervals is the key IME.

That said, I took a chance (on recommendation) with some alcove shelving
with support just at the walls (so 1m+ spacing) using 18mm timberboard
supporting quite heavy books - so far so good after 3 years. Friend
tried the same using 18mm pine - bowed within weeks.

Interesting. The timberboard I've got is pine.


I'm not sure what it is - looks like pine:

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Wickes-General-Purpose-Timberboard---18-x-400mm/p/9000033766

I'd meant solid pine bowed, timberboard didn't.


--
Cheers, Rob

On 24/08/2018 09:44, RJH wrote:

That said, I took a chance (on recommendation) with some alcove shelving
with support just at the walls (so 1m+ spacing) using 18mm timberboard
supporting quite heavy books - so far so good after 3 years. Friend
tried the same using 18mm pine - bowed within weeks.


+1
I did the same 10+ ago and no bowing despite heavy loads on a span of
close to 1m. I too used 18mm engineered timber (pine) where the wood is
cut into 80mm strips and then strips from different trees (or different
parts of the tree) are glued back together to make a wider plank.

A gash contiboard shelf in a shed on 0.8m centers with a relatively
light load has bent like a banana (obviously a real banana and not one
of those EU specified straight banana)

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Thursday, 23 August 2018 21:46:16 UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.

somewhere in the 1.5 - 2' region. Real wood is much better fwiw.


NT

In message ,
writes
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 21:46:16 UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.

somewhere in the 1.5 - 2' region. Real wood is much better fwiw.

OK so stud spacing should do. I would prefer faced blockboard but this
seems to have vanished from the market.

Interesting that advancing years seem to have created a
hygiene/cleanliness ambition in my domestic staff. Real wood is not
encouraged:-(

--
Tim Lamb

On Friday, 24 August 2018 08:46:44 UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message ,
tabbypurr writes
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 21:46:16 UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.

somewhere in the 1.5 - 2' region. Real wood is much better fwiw.

OK so stud spacing should do. I would prefer faced blockboard but this
seems to have vanished from the market.

Interesting that advancing years seem to have created a
hygiene/cleanliness ambition in my domestic staff. Real wood is not
encouraged:-(

Real wood is clean if you use the right cleaner. The stuff they use for public toilets does a great job on it - it stinks of public toilet cleaner of course but the smell goes as soon as dry.


NT

Wrote in message:
On Friday, 24 August 2018 08:46:44 UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message ,
tabbypurr writes
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 21:46:16 UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.

somewhere in the 1.5 - 2' region. Real wood is much better fwiw.

OK so stud spacing should do. I would prefer faced blockboard but this
seems to have vanished from the market.

Interesting that advancing years seem to have created a
hygiene/cleanliness ambition in my domestic staff. Real wood is not
encouraged:-(

Real wood is clean if you use the right cleaner. The stuff they use for public toilets does a great job on it - it stinks of public toilet cleaner of course but the smell goes as soon as dry.


NT


You visit public toilets?
With bare wood surfaces?
Tell us more (but no pictures perlease)

--
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 24/08/2018 08:40, Tim Lamb wrote:

OK so stud spacing should do. I would prefer faced blockboard but this
seems to have vanished from the market.


It's still around BUT possibly not the same quality as of old. I
purchased some to replace that at the bottom of kitchen cabinets in my
mothers house which didn't survive a washing machine hose leak. The
quality of the chipboard beneath its white plastic covering was poor
with a very open structure.

Interesting that advancing years seem to have created a
hygiene/cleanliness ambition in my domestic staff. Real wood is not
encouraged:-(

Surely real wood with a coat of varnish is hygienic and can cope with
the vigorous cleaning? The white coating on the chipbaord is likely to
start coming off where the spray polish gets behind the surface at the
edges and starts attacking the glue. or expanding the wheatabix chipboard.



--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Sunday, 26 August 2018 11:23:45 UTC+1, alan_m wrote:
On 24/08/2018 08:40, Tim Lamb wrote:

OK so stud spacing should do. I would prefer faced blockboard but this
seems to have vanished from the market.


It's still around BUT possibly not the same quality as of old. I
purchased some to replace that at the bottom of kitchen cabinets in my
mothers house which didn't survive a washing machine hose leak. The
quality of the chipboard beneath its white plastic covering was poor
with a very open structure.

Interesting that advancing years seem to have created a
hygiene/cleanliness ambition in my domestic staff. Real wood is not
encouraged:-(

Surely real wood with a coat of varnish is hygienic and can cope with
the vigorous cleaning? The white coating on the chipbaord is likely to
start coming off where the spray polish gets behind the surface at the
edges and starts attacking the glue. or expanding the wheatabix chipboard.

Blockboard is a rough grade of timberboard, ie sticks of wood glued side by side, with wood veneer on each side covering it.


NT

wrote:
On Sunday, 26 August 2018 11:23:45 UTC+1, alan_m wrote:
On 24/08/2018 08:40, Tim Lamb wrote:

OK so stud spacing should do. I would prefer faced blockboard but this
seems to have vanished from the market.


It's still around BUT possibly not the same quality as of old. I
purchased some to replace that at the bottom of kitchen cabinets in my
mothers house which didn't survive a washing machine hose leak. The
quality of the chipboard beneath its white plastic covering was poor
with a very open structure.

Interesting that advancing years seem to have created a
hygiene/cleanliness ambition in my domestic staff. Real wood is not
encouraged:-(

Surely real wood with a coat of varnish is hygienic and can cope with
the vigorous cleaning? The white coating on the chipbaord is likely to
start coming off where the spray polish gets behind the surface at the
edges and starts attacking the glue. or expanding the wheatabix chipboard.

Blockboard is a rough grade of timberboard, ie sticks of wood glued side by side, with wood veneer on each side covering it.


NT

Seem to remember my father using it years ago when it was about threeply
birch on the faces and you could get a good paint finish on it but still
risking a void every now and then when cutting the stuff so every open
edge needed lipping. Not seen it around for sale for years though.

On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 21:43:29 +0100, Tim Lamb wrote:

I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals?

Dig about for the instructions on the web? I've used various forms of
that type of shelving system over the years and normally go for about
18". ie verticals 3 or so inches in from the shelf ends, divide the
gap between those verticals evenly to have individual gaps of about
18".

Melamine faced chipboard ("Contiboard") rather than bare chipboard I
take it. You say "larder" is this a proper larder with stone walls,
naturally cool, possibly very slightly damp (warm damp air from
house)? Chip might move a bit under those circumstances so perhaps
err to the narrow side of 18".

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 24/08/2018 10:04, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 21:43:29 +0100, Tim Lamb wrote:

I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals?

Dig about for the instructions on the web? I've used various forms of
that type of shelving system over the years and normally go for about
18". ie verticals 3 or so inches in from the shelf ends, divide the
gap between those verticals evenly to have individual gaps of about
18".

Melamine faced chipboard ("Contiboard") rather than bare chipboard I
take it. You say "larder" is this a proper larder with stone walls,
naturally cool, possibly very slightly damp (warm damp air from
house)? Chip might move a bit under those circumstances so perhaps
err to the narrow side of 18".


I've found flipping Contiboard shelves carrying books end over end every
year or few means the bowing, if any, is not visible. But then I don't
usually bother with screws through the brackets unless the shelves are
high - and then possibly only at the back. And this is mainly
pine-veneered Contiboard from the 1980s so YMMV.

If the domestic staff observe the ancient rite of "Spring cleaning" that
might be a good time to flip the shelves.
--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

In message l.net,
Dave Liquorice writes
On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 21:43:29 +0100, Tim Lamb wrote:

I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals?

Dig about for the instructions on the web? I've used various forms of
that type of shelving system over the years and normally go for about
18". ie verticals 3 or so inches in from the shelf ends, divide the
gap between those verticals evenly to have individual gaps of about
18".
Ok. I think the studs are 24".

Melamine faced chipboard ("Contiboard") rather than bare chipboard I
take it. You say "larder" is this a proper larder with stone walls,
naturally cool, possibly very slightly damp (warm damp air from
house)? Chip might move a bit under those circumstances so perhaps
err to the narrow side of 18".

Umm... There are no outside walls to the larder. I suppose *dry goods
store* might be a better description. I tried to avoid any heat input
but two sets of flow/return underfloor heating pipes run through the
floor insulation.

There is a convenient unused chimney nearby if this is an issue and I
can fit vents in the access door.


--
Tim Lamb

Tim Lamb Wrote in message:
In message l.net,
Dave Liquorice writes
On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 21:43:29 +0100, Tim Lamb wrote:

I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals?

Dig about for the instructions on the web? I've used various forms of
that type of shelving system over the years and normally go for about
18". ie verticals 3 or so inches in from the shelf ends, divide the
gap between those verticals evenly to have individual gaps of about
18".
Ok. I think the studs are 24".

Melamine faced chipboard ("Contiboard") rather than bare chipboard I
take it. You say "larder" is this a proper larder with stone walls,
naturally cool, possibly very slightly damp (warm damp air from
house)? Chip might move a bit under those circumstances so perhaps
err to the narrow side of 18".

Umm... There are no outside walls to the larder. I suppose *dry goods
store* might be a better description. I tried to avoid any heat input
but two sets of flow/return underfloor heating pipes run through the
floor insulation.

There is a convenient unused chimney nearby if this is an issue and I
can fit vents in the access door.

.... drawing warm moist air into your dry larder then up the
chimney? Ummmm....
--
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.
I tend to go for around 400mm spacing, modified by
convenience/constraints of the location.
I have some ridiculously high loading in the workshop such as 500mm plus
bracket length stacked 600mm high with hardwood offcuts with out problems.

Slight concern in your proposal is the 12mm ply, being the limiting load
factor. Suggest you use all the possible fixing holes and screws that
project 5/10mm through the back of the ply to get the best possible hold.

Bowing in thin material can be prevented by fitting an upstand at the back or a deep lip at the front or both.

Richard

On 24/08/2018 10:20, Bob Minchin wrote:
Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slotÂ* brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.
I tend to go for around 400mm spacing, modified by
convenience/constraints of the location.
I have some ridiculously high loading in the workshop such as 500mm plus
bracket length stacked 600mm high with hardwood offcuts with out problems.

Slight concern in your proposal is the 12mm ply, being the limiting load
factor. Suggest you use all the possible fixing holes and screws that
project 5/10mm through the back of the ply to get the best possible hold.

You need to make sure the screws are all tread in the ply, if they are
too long the shank will be in the ply and then you lose strength.
I used self tappers the last time as they had a nice thread all the way up.

On Friday, 24 August 2018 10:20:17 UTC+1, Bob Minchin wrote:
Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.
I tend to go for around 400mm spacing, modified by
convenience/constraints of the location.
I have some ridiculously high loading in the workshop such as 500mm plus
bracket length stacked 600mm high with hardwood offcuts with out problems.

Slight concern in your proposal is the 12mm ply, being the limiting load
factor. Suggest you use all the possible fixing holes and screws that
project 5/10mm through the back of the ply to get the best possible hold.


OP says 18mm chip, far weaker than ply, and ply isn't ideal. 18mm should really help though. Solid wood is strongest, most so if glued strip so defects don't dominate strength.


NT

On Thursday, August 23, 2018 at 9:46:16 PM UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.
--
Tim Lamb

Not to answer your original question exactly -) ... but remember that there are
at least two different versions on 'spur' twin slot shelving, with annoyingly-
slightly-different dimensions. Make you you have thought about repeat ordering
for the future etc.

J^n

In message , jkn
writes
On Thursday, August 23, 2018 at 9:46:16 PM UTC+1, Tim Lamb wrote:
I'm about to order twin slot brackets for 18mm chipboard shelving in
the new larder. Anyone care to suggest support intervals? 12mm ply walls
so I'm not restricted to the studs.

Difficult to guess the loading as it could be cornflake packets or a box
preserves.
--
Tim Lamb

Not to answer your original question exactly -) ... but remember that there are
at least two different versions on 'spur' twin slot shelving, with annoyingly-
slightly-different dimensions. Make you you have thought about repeat ordering
for the future etc.

Yes. Toolstation seem to have stock on the sizes I need so I'll probably
get them to deliver.

--
Tim Lamb