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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
I have just today received this:
http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=104#JBC365 a Jetway Jetway JBC365 Fanless Dual LAN PC with quad core cpu. Wedged a 4GB stick of RAM in (which passed 1 cycle of Memtest86) and also a 240GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD (SATA). Only criticism is it's a bit fiddly getting the HDD cables to fold up nicely away from pointy pin headers, but after a few goes I found a reasonable way to lay them. You can stick mSATA sticks in but the chipset is a bit fussy and does not like all types of SSD (in particular it's not been tested with Plextor or Sandisk - the only 2 types I will touch). But boy, it is *small*. I want it to be an Internet gateway, firewall, essential services like DNS, DHCP and critical filestore ( $HOME basically). The 2 gig ports lend it to that (though of course you could pull a VLAN stunt with one port). It's running Mint linux 64 bit live right now and I'm stress testing the crap out of it. Bonnie++ results are good, got 8 cpuburn processes going at once and the temperatures are after about 1/2 hour (with room at about 20C and this thing has no fans): Disk internal temp: 42C CPU cores: 49-52C System temp: 47C/27C (I suspect that is chipset/ambient board) All of those have a very large margin before maximums. When I've finished a badblocks run, I try it for feel of Mint - but I suspect it could also make a quite convincing media device (stapped to the back of a TV) or even a plausible desktop machine. Only just got it so it could go bang tomorrow - but thought some folk might me interested... |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
OK whats it actually cost though...
Brian -- From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active "Tim Watts" wrote in message ... I have just today received this: http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=104#JBC365 a Jetway Jetway JBC365 Fanless Dual LAN PC with quad core cpu. Wedged a 4GB stick of RAM in (which passed 1 cycle of Memtest86) and also a 240GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD (SATA). Only criticism is it's a bit fiddly getting the HDD cables to fold up nicely away from pointy pin headers, but after a few goes I found a reasonable way to lay them. You can stick mSATA sticks in but the chipset is a bit fussy and does not like all types of SSD (in particular it's not been tested with Plextor or Sandisk - the only 2 types I will touch). But boy, it is *small*. I want it to be an Internet gateway, firewall, essential services like DNS, DHCP and critical filestore ( $HOME basically). The 2 gig ports lend it to that (though of course you could pull a VLAN stunt with one port). It's running Mint linux 64 bit live right now and I'm stress testing the crap out of it. Bonnie++ results are good, got 8 cpuburn processes going at once and the temperatures are after about 1/2 hour (with room at about 20C and this thing has no fans): Disk internal temp: 42C CPU cores: 49-52C System temp: 47C/27C (I suspect that is chipset/ambient board) All of those have a very large margin before maximums. When I've finished a badblocks run, I try it for feel of Mint - but I suspect it could also make a quite convincing media device (stapped to the back of a TV) or even a plausible desktop machine. Only just got it so it could go bang tomorrow - but thought some folk might me interested... |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/2015 17:51, Huge wrote:
On 2015-01-22, Tim Watts wrote: I have just today received this: http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=104#JBC365 a Jetway Jetway JBC365 Fanless Dual LAN PC with quad core cpu. Wedged a 4GB stick of RAM in (which passed 1 cycle of Memtest86) and also a 240GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD (SATA). Only criticism is it's a bit fiddly getting the HDD cables to fold up nicely away from pointy pin headers, but after a few goes I found a reasonable way to lay them. You can stick mSATA sticks in but the chipset is a bit fussy and does not like all types of SSD (in particular it's not been tested with Plextor or Sandisk - the only 2 types I will touch). But boy, it is *small*. I want it to be an Internet gateway, firewall, essential services like DNS, DHCP and critical filestore ( $HOME basically). The 2 gig ports lend it to that (though of course you could pull a VLAN stunt with one port). It's running Mint linux 64 bit live right now and I'm stress testing the crap out of it. Bonnie++ results are good, got 8 cpuburn processes going at once and the temperatures are after about 1/2 hour (with room at about 20C and this thing has no fans): Disk internal temp: 42C CPU cores: 49-52C System temp: 47C/27C (I suspect that is chipset/ambient board) All of those have a very large margin before maximums. When I've finished a badblocks run, I try it for feel of Mint - but I suspect it could also make a quite convincing media device (stapped to the back of a TV) or even a plausible desktop machine. Only just got it so it could go bang tomorrow - but thought some folk might me interested... I am. I need a smaller, less power hungry machine to run my Smoothwall on. I've read some good reports on these mini PCs and they seem to perform very well considering the miniscule size of them. I'm watching with interest and may well buy one, but I'll wait to see if more competition improves them even more. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/15 17:51, Huge wrote:
On 2015-01-22, Tim Watts wrote: Only just got it so it could go bang tomorrow - but thought some folk might me interested... I am. I need a smaller, less power hungry machine to run my Smoothwall on. I have not speedtested the Realtek NICs yet - that will probably be next week - happy to post the result - I'll do some iperf tests using both and see how hard it hits the CPU and if the NICs actually have drive at line speed more or less[1] [1] Probably these days, but years ago, ****e NICs would manage maybe 40% of the line speed unless they were good Intel ones. If you are happy with the mSATA offerings that are stated compatible, (Kingston, Intel) they would be easier to fit. I went for Sandisk Extreme Pro regular SATA as for no extra money, it has a 10 year guarantee. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/15 17:51, Brian Gaff wrote:
OK whats it actually cost though... £186 plus RAM plus disk 4GB SODIMM RAM was £40 Disk was about £100 for 240GB of 10 year guaranteed Sandisk SSD. Has 4 USB ports, 2 NICs, 1 DVI out that can drive VGA via supllied adaptor. Comes with DIN rail clips, feet to stand up and wall mount brackets. External PSU. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/15 18:15, Bod wrote:
I've read some good reports on these mini PCs and they seem to perform very well considering the miniscule size of them. I'm watching with interest and may well buy one, but I'll wait to see if more competition improves them even more. I've just had my son hammer the linux screensavers a bit and he thought they were pretty smooth. It's is probably not as fast as an i3 laptop, but it feels usable (need to hook up to internet to try youtube) but it does kick an Atom's arse off into the next field. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/2015 18:56, Tim Watts wrote:
On 22/01/15 17:51, Brian Gaff wrote: OK whats it actually cost though... £186 plus RAM plus disk 4GB SODIMM RAM was £40 Disk was about £100 for 240GB of 10 year guaranteed Sandisk SSD. Has 4 USB ports, 2 NICs, 1 DVI out that can drive VGA via supllied adaptor. Comes with DIN rail clips, feet to stand up and wall mount brackets. External PSU. USB2 or USB3 or both? |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/2015 18:57, Tim Watts wrote:
On 22/01/15 18:15, Bod wrote: I've read some good reports on these mini PCs and they seem to perform very well considering the miniscule size of them. I'm watching with interest and may well buy one, but I'll wait to see if more competition improves them even more. I've just had my son hammer the linux screensavers a bit and he thought they were pretty smooth. It's is probably not as fast as an i3 laptop, but it feels usable (need to hook up to internet to try youtube) but it does kick an Atom's arse off into the next field. Ok, thanks for the info. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/15 19:00, Bod wrote:
USB2 or USB3 or both? Good question... Spec says 2 USB2 and 2 USB3 |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On Thursday, 22 January 2015 19:00:16 UTC, Bod wrote:
USB2 or USB3 or both? Depends on the model, but some models have USB3 on the front and USB2 on the back. Owain |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/2015 20:18, Tim Watts wrote:
On 22/01/15 19:00, Bod wrote: USB2 or USB3 or both? Good question... Spec says 2 USB2 and 2 USB3 That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
In article ,
Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. -- Andrew |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. USB3 flash sticks work fine on Windows 7 and even XP with USB2 sockets. I've not tried them on my Linux system (Zorin). |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/2015 07:21, Bod wrote:
On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. USB3 flash sticks work fine on Windows 7 and even XP with USB2 sockets. I've not tried them on my Linux system (Zorin). USB3 *are* compatible with USB2, but a USB stick will only run at the USB2 speed. http://www.integralmemory.com/faq/us...le-usb-2-ports |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/2015 07:27, Bod wrote:
On 23/01/2015 07:21, Bod wrote: On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. USB3 flash sticks work fine on Windows 7 and even XP with USB2 sockets. I've not tried them on my Linux system (Zorin). USB3 *are* compatible with USB2, but a USB stick will only run at the USB2 speed. http://www.integralmemory.com/faq/us...le-usb-2-ports ITHM loading an old OS wont be able to find the USB3 chips so the ports wont work. RailMaster doesn't like the USB3 ports on my thinkpad yoga so they aren't that compatible. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/2015 08:04, Dennis@home wrote:
On 23/01/2015 07:27, Bod wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:21, Bod wrote: On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. USB3 flash sticks work fine on Windows 7 and even XP with USB2 sockets. I've not tried them on my Linux system (Zorin). USB3 *are* compatible with USB2, but a USB stick will only run at the USB2 speed. http://www.integralmemory.com/faq/us...le-usb-2-ports ITHM loading an old OS wont be able to find the USB3 chips so the ports wont work. RailMaster doesn't like the USB3 ports on my thinkpad yoga so they aren't that compatible. Maybe, but they even work on my oldest computer, using a 2001 installation of XP Pro. I fix lots of computers for people and I've not had a USB3 not work on any of them. Believe me, some of them are really ancient pooters. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/15 10:59, Huge wrote:
On 2015-01-22, Tim Watts wrote: On 22/01/15 17:51, Brian Gaff wrote: OK whats it actually cost though... £186 plus RAM plus disk 4GB SODIMM RAM was £40 Disk was about £100 for 240GB of 10 year guaranteed Sandisk SSD. Has 4 USB ports, 2 NICs, Hmmm. I need 3 NICs. Any way to do that? If you have a look on the original link, IIRC there's one with 4 NICs. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/15 11:03, Tim Watts wrote:
On 23/01/15 10:59, Huge wrote: On 2015-01-22, Tim Watts wrote: On 22/01/15 17:51, Brian Gaff wrote: OK whats it actually cost though... £186 plus RAM plus disk 4GB SODIMM RAM was £40 Disk was about £100 for 240GB of 10 year guaranteed Sandisk SSD. Has 4 USB ports, 2 NICs, Hmmm. I need 3 NICs. Any way to do that? If you have a look on the original link, IIRC there's one with 4 NICs. Or VLANs? |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
In article ,
Bod writes: Maybe, but they even work on my oldest computer, using a 2001 installation of XP Pro. I fix lots of computers for people and I've not had a USB3 not work on any of them. Believe me, some of them are really ancient pooters. There is no xHCI driver in Windows XP, so it can't talk to a USB3 port at all. Some BIOS's will detect an OS with no xHCI support and flip the port back to USB2, so the eHCI (USB2) driver will then attach. This is a function of the BIOS (Intel call it Smart Auto mode in the BIOS). If you have a system with USB3 ports, the drivers which come with the system may have an xHCI driver for Windows XP, which will then work. USB devices are backwards compatible, but the USB port register specification never has been (USB1.1 to 2, or 2 to 3), so you need the right driver which can bind to the port, and it can then fall back if it has an older spec USB device attached. -- Andrew |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
In article ,
Tim Watts writes: I have just today received this: http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=104#JBC365 a Jetway Jetway JBC365 Fanless Dual LAN PC with quad core cpu. Wedged a 4GB stick of RAM in (which passed 1 cycle of Memtest86) and also a 240GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD (SATA). I would be interested to know the idling power consumption. -- Andrew |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/15 11:25, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article , Tim Watts writes: I have just today received this: http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=104#JBC365 a Jetway Jetway JBC365 Fanless Dual LAN PC with quad core cpu. Wedged a 4GB stick of RAM in (which passed 1 cycle of Memtest86) and also a 240GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD (SATA). I would be interested to know the idling power consumption. I will not be able to do that sadly - I don't have a spare power meter right now. But my guesstimate is it will be in the 10-20W region based on how warm the case gets with no fan. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/15 11:39, Huge wrote:
On 2015-01-23, Tim Watts wrote: On 23/01/15 10:59, Huge wrote: On 2015-01-22, Tim Watts wrote: On 22/01/15 17:51, Brian Gaff wrote: OK whats it actually cost though... £186 plus RAM plus disk 4GB SODIMM RAM was £40 Disk was about £100 for 240GB of 10 year guaranteed Sandisk SSD. Has 4 USB ports, 2 NICs, Hmmm. I need 3 NICs. Any way to do that? If you have a look on the original link, IIRC there's one with 4 NICs. Betterer and betterer. Thank you. I've just emailed mini-itx back (they know their products) and asked: How are certain mSATA cards not compatible with the BayTrain chipset - totally not working or (worse) subtle problems. I did also give some feedback on the amount of strain the SATA cables and suggested a cable a right angled plugs (data and powwer, board end) and extra flexible data cabled would help. I think it will be OK - the warmth will probably let the stress out of the cables and on my 4th or so go to pre-fold the wires so they lay reasonably well, it was not too hard to get the case lid on. But I come from the school of "permanent strain on connectors is bad, mmmkay?". Bit of a Sinclair-ism - if Jetway had made the case 1/4" thicker it would have made all the difference. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On Friday, 23 January 2015 08:28:19 UTC, Bod wrote:
On 23/01/2015 08:04, Dennis@home wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:27, Bod wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:21, Bod wrote: On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. USB3 flash sticks work fine on Windows 7 and even XP with USB2 sockets. I've not tried them on my Linux system (Zorin). USB3 *are* compatible with USB2, but a USB stick will only run at the USB2 speed. http://www.integralmemory.com/faq/us...le-usb-2-ports ITHM loading an old OS wont be able to find the USB3 chips so the ports wont work. RailMaster doesn't like the USB3 ports on my thinkpad yoga so they aren't that compatible. Maybe, but they even work on my oldest computer, using a 2001 installation of XP Pro. I fix lots of computers for people and I've not had a USB3 not work on any of them. Believe me, some of them are really ancient pooters. You misunderstand the problem. A USB3 device plugged into a USB2 port on an ancient machine running an OS that doesn't know about USB3 will work fine. The problem is that if you take a shiny new computer with a USB3 port on it, and then install an aged OS that doesn't know about USB3 driver chips, the aged OS won't be able to talk to those driver chips (and hence won't be able to talk to the port). Thus if one is selling shiny new hardware, it makes (some) sense to leave a USB2 driver chip connected to a couple of USB2 ports in order that above aged OS can still talk to something. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/2015 14:33, Martin Bonner wrote:
On Friday, 23 January 2015 08:28:19 UTC, Bod wrote: On 23/01/2015 08:04, Dennis@home wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:27, Bod wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:21, Bod wrote: On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. Drivers are not. An OS release which doesn't know about USB3 at all will not be able to use the USB3 ports at all, even in fall-back. USB3 flash sticks work fine on Windows 7 and even XP with USB2 sockets. I've not tried them on my Linux system (Zorin). USB3 *are* compatible with USB2, but a USB stick will only run at the USB2 speed. http://www.integralmemory.com/faq/us...le-usb-2-ports ITHM loading an old OS wont be able to find the USB3 chips so the ports wont work. RailMaster doesn't like the USB3 ports on my thinkpad yoga so they aren't that compatible. Maybe, but they even work on my oldest computer, using a 2001 installation of XP Pro. I fix lots of computers for people and I've not had a USB3 not work on any of them. Believe me, some of them are really ancient pooters. You misunderstand the problem. A USB3 device plugged into a USB2 port on an ancient machine running an OS that doesn't know about USB3 will work fine. The problem is that if you take a shiny new computer with a USB3 port on it, and then install an aged OS that doesn't know about USB3 driver chips, the aged OS won't be able to talk to those driver chips (and hence won't be able to talk to the port). Thus if one is selling shiny new hardware, it makes (some) sense to leave a USB2 driver chip connected to a couple of USB2 ports in order that above aged OS can still talk to something. Hmm! it would be an unusual person who paid hundreds for a brand new latest Windows computer, who would then put a prehistoric system on it. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
Tim Watts wrote:
[snip description of tiny PC] I've looked at these, but they've never quite been what I want. For a compact, basic (but 'real') PC I use RaspberryPi or BeagleBone Black. For an efficent server box with space for disk drives etc. I've just discovered Fujitsu Esprimo, Morgan Computers have an Esprimo P910 at about £200 and it runs at an idle power consumption of abot 20 watts. Excellent NAS system, lots of space for disk drives, and being quad code I5 has lots of processing power. -- Chris Green · |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
Tim Watts wrote:
On 22/01/15 17:51, Brian Gaff wrote: OK whats it actually cost though... £186 plus RAM plus disk 4GB SODIMM RAM was £40 Disk was about £100 for 240GB of 10 year guaranteed Sandisk SSD. Has 4 USB ports, 2 NICs, 1 DVI out that can drive VGA via supllied adaptor. Comes with DIN rail clips, feet to stand up and wall mount brackets. External PSU. Blimey! Buy a proper PC with space for that, or buy a RaspberryPi for £25. -- Chris Green · |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 2:33:42 PM UTC, Martin Bonner wrote:
On Friday, 23 January 2015 08:28:19 UTC, Bod wrote: On 23/01/2015 08:04, Dennis@home wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:27, Bod wrote: On 23/01/2015 07:21, Bod wrote: On 22/01/2015 21:39, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Bod writes: That's good, but I can't understand why they don't install all USB3s, seeing as USB3s are backward compatible with USB2s. There's no point having usb3 for things like mice, keyboard etc. So why pay the extra 2p. NT |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
Tim Watts wrote:
On 23/01/15 11:25, Andrew Gabriel wrote: In article , Tim Watts writes: I have just today received this: http://www.mini-itx.com/store/?c=104#JBC365 a Jetway Jetway JBC365 Fanless Dual LAN PC with quad core cpu. Wedged a 4GB stick of RAM in (which passed 1 cycle of Memtest86) and also a 240GB Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD (SATA). I would be interested to know the idling power consumption. I will not be able to do that sadly - I don't have a spare power meter right now. But my guesstimate is it will be in the 10-20W region based on how warm the case gets with no fan. No less than my full-sized Fujitsu Esprimo P910. -- Chris Green · |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On Fri, 23 Jan 2015 08:06:48 -0800, meow2222 wrote:
There's no point having usb3 for things like mice, keyboard etc. Depends how fast you type, of course... |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
Tim Watts wrote:
On 23/01/15 16:04, wrote: Fujitsu Esprimo That's pretty sweet. THAT might be a good candidate for real desktop use - I have not tried hammering the Jetway hard as a desktop, but I suspect it's graphics chip is not going to be the most rapid... I'm using one as my desktop machine, excellent so far. -- Chris Green · |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 23 Jan 2015 16:04:36 +0000, wrote: For an efficent server box with space for disk drives etc. I've just discovered Fujitsu Esprimo, Morgan Computers have an Esprimo P910 at about £200 ... £200 made me look but all I can find is £329.95 inc VAT Courier Delivery £6.99 on the Morgan site. Or "manufacturer refurbished" on eBay £315.95 delivered from seller "morgancomputers". Sorry, I mis-remembered it, I bought mine for about £270 which is easy enough as you can nearly always get an extra 10% off the Morgan prices. Reason for looking is that I have a feeling I'm going to dragged into the 21st centuary in the next month or so. Very slowly more things are not working properly under OS/2 Warp3 (patched for net access). Latest creeping disease is SSL certificates being "invalid or corupted", wasn't worried until the certificate of my ISP changed yesterday. B-( But what ever I get must have enough grunt to run OS/2 in a VM and consume as little power as possible. My current 10+ old machine (1 GHz single core Athlon) draws about 100W, does help keep the room warm though. B-) I run XP and Win7 in VirtualBox on my Esprimo, they whizz along. I left OS/2 many moons ago and, after a brief foray into Win2k I moved to Linux. -- Chris Green · |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
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[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On 23/01/2015 16:45, Tim Watts wrote:
And "Raspberry Pi" would have to be a seriously rediculous statement to make - how am I going to route 80Mbit/sec IP through a Pi plus internal 1gig? My ADSL router manages more than that with less processing power than a Pi so it is doable. |
[OT] Cool tiny tiny PC
On Friday, January 23, 2015 at 7:13:06 PM UTC, Dave Liquorice wrote:
I keep wandering off to look but I've yet to be won over by any linux desktop compared to Presentation Manager on OS/2. They have the annoying restrictions that the Windows desktop has. Dialogue open? You can only move or switch to a limited set of windows. maybe if the question were clearer NT |
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