We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.

Tim

On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Depending on the internal supply voltages in the hi-fi unit, you may be
able to convert it to run off a wall wart, with a low voltage power feed
using the same ribbon cable as you do for the speakers.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.

Tim


Finding out if it will run off a wallwart and then run the low voltage
DC through some thin cable is probably the practical answer

Maybe there is a (albeit limited) market for wireless power transfer in
cases like this?
More trouble (and cost) than it's worth but at only 25W you could have a
couple of coils either side of the back of the dresser...

In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a
mini hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole
in the back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very
loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units
there's a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing
card through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like
laminated cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through
this gap. I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable
for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.

I'd say the physical protection needed for a mains cable - two layers of
usually PVC - would make it impossible. I've never seen speaker cable as
thin as a playing card either. The sort of ribbon used inside PCs etc
could probably be used for low power speakers if you paralleled cores.

Drill those holes in the back - you know it makes sense. ;-) Or even make
a feature of what you've done by fitting suitable sockets/plugs to the
back of the unit - that would make it easy to replace the 'mini Hi-Fi'
when it fails. ;-)

--
*Do infants enjoy infancy as much as adults enjoy adultery? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 30/07/2014 10:28, Lee wrote:

Maybe there is a (albeit limited) market for wireless power transfer in
cases like this?

Was meant to be tongue-in-cheek as it seems to be the latest fad, but it
turns out there are some proof-of-concept 25W transfer systems available
@ around 80% efficiency so maybe they will become more commonplace if
the cost comes down.

Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.

Could you put a 6(ish)mm-high strip of hardwood or whatever between the
sideboard and the dresser - all the way along - leaving a minimal gap
where the wires are to go? As long as that arrangement was structurally
sound it could be made to look quite decent. You could try it without
risking anything and see how you like it.

--
Mike Barnes
Cheshire, England

On Wednesday, 30 July 2014 10:35:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article

,

Tim+ wrote:

We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a

mini hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole

in the back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very

loth to do.



As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units

there's a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing

card through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like

laminated cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through

this gap. I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable

for mains.



Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is

only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.



I'd say the physical protection needed for a mains cable - two layers of

usually PVC - would make it impossible. I've never seen speaker cable as

thin as a playing card either. The sort of ribbon used inside PCs etc

could probably be used for low power speakers if you paralleled cores.



Drill those holes in the back - you know it makes sense. ;-) Or even make

a feature of what you've done by fitting suitable sockets/plugs to the

back of the unit - that would make it easy to replace the 'mini Hi-Fi'

when it fails. ;-)



--

*Do infants enjoy infancy as much as adults enjoy adultery? *



Dave Plowman London SW

To e-mail, change noise into sound.

You can certainly get (or make ;-) speaker cable as thin as a playing card ...
I have some myself. It's made from thin silver ribbon (99.999% pure etc.)
conductors, laid side-by-side onto transparent adhesive tape.

Google 'Allen Wright' and 'vacuumstate' for more info. Yes, I realise I'm
opening myself up to the Ross Andrews baiters here - I regard myself as one of
those baiters actually.

However I don't really expect the OP to go to these lengths, and I agree with
others that you don't want to do this with mains power.

J^n

In article ,
Mike Barnes wrote:
Could you put a 6(ish)mm-high strip of hardwood or whatever between the
sideboard and the dresser - all the way along - leaving a minimal gap
where the wires are to go? As long as that arrangement was structurally
sound it could be made to look quite decent. You could try it without
risking anything and see how you like it.

Yup - drop shadows are all the rage these days. ;-)

--
*Sometimes I wake up grumpy; Other times I let him sleep.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Wednesday, July 30, 2014 12:25:38 PM UTC+1, Mike Barnes wrote:
Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.
Could you put a 6(ish)mm-high strip of hardwood or whatever between the
sideboard and the dresser - all the way along - leaving a minimal gap
where the wires are to go? As long as that arrangement was structurally
sound it could be made to look quite decent. You could try it without
risking anything and see how you like it.

If you still need thin wire, enamelled copper wire is good for speakers. Mains, as said, isn't doable safely in card-thin format.


NT

Mike Barnes wrote:
Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.

Could you put a 6(ish)mm-high strip of hardwood or whatever between the
sideboard and the dresser - all the way along - leaving a minimal gap
where the wires are to go? As long as that arrangement was structurally
sound it could be made to look quite decent. You could try it without
risking anything and see how you like it.


Hmm, interesting. That could work but I'm not sure it would meet with
approval from my better half. Thanks for the suggestion though.

Tim

John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

Tim

On 30/07/2014 13:20, Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

The smallest normally available is rated at 3 amps, is 0.5mm2
conductors, and is about 5.4 x 3.4mm overall size.

The same area of conductor is available without the outer sleeve for
your speaker connections, and is about 2/3 of the size.


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 13:20, Tim+ wrote:

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

The smallest normally available is rated at 3 amps, is 0.5mm2 conductors,
and is about 5.4 x 3.4mm overall size.

Yep, that's what's fitted. I'm after something "not normally available".
Bell wire? ;-)

Tim

In article
,
Tim+ wrote:
Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

Two or three core? Two is available in oval which might suit better.

I've got a newish mains lead here which came with an appliance - moulded
13 amp one end and figure of 8 connector at the other, so two core. I
assume it conforms to regs. Cable measures 5.5 x 3.3 mm

--
*Honk if you love peace and quiet.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

No it would probably be very unstable and cause feedback. I tried this many
years ago with some Sinclair amp modules. High current low voltage loses
regulation by the time it gets to the amps. You need the psu right on top of
the power amps.

I fancy this is not going to get put where it is needed.
Maybe some kind of plug of wood can be f cut that can be reglued back later
almost invisibly.
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"John Williamson" wrote in message
...
On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units
there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like
laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Depending on the internal supply voltages in the hi-fi unit, you may be
able to convert it to run off a wall wart, with a low voltage power feed
using the same ribbon cable as you do for the speakers.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 30/07/2014 12:38, jkn wrote:

You can certainly get (or make ;-) speaker cable as thin as a playing card ...
I have some myself. It's made from thin silver ribbon (99.999% pure etc.)
conductors, laid side-by-side onto transparent adhesive tape.

Google 'Allen Wright' and 'vacuumstate' for more info. Yes, I realise I'm
opening myself up to the Ross Andrews baiters here - I regard myself as one of
those baiters actually.

However I don't really expect the OP to go to these lengths, and I agree with
others that you don't want to do this with mains power.


You can do mains safely..

just step the voltage down
run it through foil stuck to the units
step it back up.

Easier to fit feet to the units and run normal cable underneath.

On Wednesday, July 30, 2014 10:00:39 AM UTC+1, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini

hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the

back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.



As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's

a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card

through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated

cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.

I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.



Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is

only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.



Tim

Put a recessed strip of wood under the dresser so the gap between it and the sideboard is enough for the cables. Paint it dark so it creates a shadow gap and it will probably look OK.
Simon.

On Wednesday, July 30, 2014 3:20:23 PM UTC+1, Dennis@home wrote:


You can do mains safely..
just step the voltage down
run it through foil stuck to the units
step it back up.
Easier to fit feet to the units and run normal cable underneath.

You'd have a hell of a regulation problem, I don't know how you propose to address that.

One might see 15% regulation or thereabouts at that size, so 2 transformers would deregulate the supply by around 30%, plus there's already 15% regulation in the unit's built in transformer.

Better I think to go to dc, pass that thru the cabinet and to the 2ndary side of the moderate-fi.


NT

On 30/07/2014 13:39, Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 13:20, Tim+ wrote:

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

The smallest normally available is rated at 3 amps, is 0.5mm2 conductors,
and is about 5.4 x 3.4mm overall size.

Yep, that's what's fitted. I'm after something "not normally available".
Bell wire? ;-)

Tim

Nope, it *must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 13:39, Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 13:20, Tim+ wrote:

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

The smallest normally available is rated at 3 amps, is 0.5mm2 conductors,
and is about 5.4 x 3.4mm overall size.

Yep, that's what's fitted. I'm after something "not normally available".
Bell wire? ;-)

Tim

Nope, it *must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean behind it" incident.


Really?

Tim

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

Drill those holes in the back - you know it makes sense. ;-) Or even make
a feature of what you've done by fitting suitable sockets/plugs to the
back of the unit - that would make it easy to replace the 'mini Hi-Fi'
when it fails. ;-)

Well, I noticed a spot high in the back where I could drill discretely so
that's what I've done. Would rather not have but the other options
weren't really realistic.

Tim

On 30/07/14 21:57, Tim+ wrote:
Nope, it*must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean behind it" incident.

Really?

Pretty much yes, or all sorts of stuff like insurance might get invalidated.


--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

Tim


You also need one of these.
http://www.tweekgeek.com/bybee-holographic-ac-adapter/
and one of these.
http://www.tweekgeek.com/pranawire-photon-usb/

F Murtz wrote:
Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

Tim


You also need one of these.
http://www.tweekgeek.com/bybee-holographic-ac-adapter/
and one of these.
http://www.tweekgeek.com/pranawire-photon-usb/


Why are you plugging this crap? It's neither relevant or funny.

Tim

Tim

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/07/14 21:57, Tim+ wrote:
Nope, it*must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

Really?

Pretty much yes, or all sorts of stuff like insurance might get invalidated.


"Really?", as in, "did you really miss my smiley?".

Tim

On 31/07/2014 09:19, Tim+ wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/07/14 21:57, Tim+ wrote:
Nope, it*must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

Really?

Pretty much yes, or all sorts of stuff like insurance might get invalidated.


"Really?", as in, "did you really miss my smiley?".


As in the one a few posts upthread?

Sorry, safety is not a laughing matter round here.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 31/07/14 18:19, Tim+ wrote:
F Murtz wrote:
Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:
On 30/07/2014 10:00, Tim+ wrote:
We have a new sideboard/dresser unit and my wife would like to put a mini
hi-fi unit on the sideboard. To do so would mean drilling a hole in the
back of the dresser unit to run cables through which I'm very loth to do.

As the sideboard and dresser are constructed as two separate units there's
a very narrow gap twixt the two that one could slide a playing card
through. What I'm wondering is if there is any flat ribbon-like laminated
cable that I could use to pass mains and speaker feeds through this gap.
I've seen some speaker cable but nothing listed as suitable for mains.

Is this a no-no or doable? The "hi-fi" unit is double insulated and is
only rated at 25W consumption so it's not got to carry much power.


For the speakers, you can use ribbon cable, but it'd be a definite no-no
for the mains power, for which you need the correctly rated cable.

Okay. I've been having a closer look at the construction of the back of
the dresser and it's made with tongue & groove boards and if I could get
skinny enough mains flex I could run it up the groove to a point where I
could drill it invisibly. (From behind to a point behind a shelf edge).

Given the low power consumption, what's the skinniest cable that would do
the job (and is available)?

Tim


You also need one of these.
http://www.tweekgeek.com/bybee-holographic-ac-adapter/
and one of these.
http://www.tweekgeek.com/pranawire-photon-usb/


Why are you plugging this crap? It's neither relevant or funny.

Tim

Tim

I think it is hugely funny to think that any one would be silly enough
to buy such rubbish.

John Williamson wrote:
On 31/07/2014 09:19, Tim+ wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 30/07/14 21:57, Tim+ wrote:
Nope, it*must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

Really?

Pretty much yes, or all sorts of stuff like insurance might get invalidated.


"Really?", as in, "did you really miss my smiley?".


As in the one a few posts upthread?

Where else? Downthread?

Sorry, safety is not a laughing matter round here.

When did that happen? Nobody told me.

Tim

On 31/07/2014 13:52, Tim+ wrote:
John Williamson wrote:


Sorry, safety is not a laughing matter round here.

When did that happen? Nobody told me.


You don't keep parrots in your garage, do you? ;-)


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 19:29:48 +0100, John Williamson
wrote:

Nope, it *must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

Is the thickness of the insulation actually specified (presumably by the likes
of the IEC?) or just the withstand voltage and the mechanical properties?

--

On 31/07/2014 22:56, The Other Mike wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 19:29:48 +0100, John Williamson
wrote:

Nope, it *must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

Is the thickness of the insulation actually specified (presumably by the likes
of the IEC?) or just the withstand voltage and the mechanical properties?

Politician mode on That's a very good question and I'm glad you asked
it...

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 04:38:20 -0700 (PDT), jkn
wrote:


You can certainly get (or make ;-) speaker cable as thin as a playing card ...
I have some myself. It's made from thin silver ribbon (99.999% pure etc.)
conductors, laid side-by-side onto transparent adhesive tape.

Google 'Allen Wright' and 'vacuumstate' for more info. Yes, I realise I'm
opening myself up to the Ross Andrews baiters here - I regard myself as one of
those baiters actually.

However I don't really expect the OP to go to these lengths, and I agree with
others that you don't want to do this with mains power.

Another version is the self adhesive copper tape sold in hobby
stores/model shops sometimes known by the name Kaptan tape which is
the original quality version though Kapton is the insulation material
which other copper tapes may not have.
Used some to connect a door bell push once where the owner did not
want any holes drilled through a door frame .
Hardly visible once it was painted over.

G.Harman

On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 23:19:15 +0100, John Williamson
wrote:

On 31/07/2014 22:56, The Other Mike wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 19:29:48 +0100, John Williamson
wrote:

Nope, it *must* have two layers of insulation of sufficient thickness,
and even for an installation such as you suggest, and a minimum physical
strength to cope with the inevitable "I'll just pull this out to clean
behind it" incident.

Is the thickness of the insulation actually specified (presumably by the likes
of the IEC?) or just the withstand voltage and the mechanical properties?

Politician mode on That's a very good question and I'm glad you asked
it...

paxman mode

I asked a very simple question so why can't you answer the question rather than
prevaricating

/paxman mode

A few possibilities?

IEC 60227-5 - A mere 100 quid
BS EN 50525 - Free, or would be if I had my library card number with me

Just wondered if alternatives using a radically different construction method
and / or insulation could be made significantly thinner and still comply.

--

On Friday, August 1, 2014 7:58:43 AM UTC+1, wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 04:38:20 -0700 (PDT), jkn
wrote:

You can certainly get (or make ;-) speaker cable as thin as a playing card ...
I have some myself. It's made from thin silver ribbon (99.999% pure etc.)
conductors, laid side-by-side onto transparent adhesive tape.

Google 'Allen Wright' and 'vacuumstate' for more info. Yes, I realise I'm
opening myself up to the Ross Andrews baiters here - I regard myself as one of
those baiters actually.

However I don't really expect the OP to go to these lengths, and I agree with
others that you don't want to do this with mains power.

Another version is the self adhesive copper tape sold in hobby
stores/model shops sometimes known by the name Kaptan tape which is
the original quality version though Kapton is the insulation material
which other copper tapes may not have.
Used some to connect a door bell push once where the owner did not
want any holes drilled through a door frame .
Hardly visible once it was painted over.
G.Harman

Wonder what the kickback voltage is on a mechanical sounder.


NT

On 01/08/14 12:22, wrote:
On Friday, August 1, 2014 7:58:43 AM UTC+1, wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 04:38:20 -0700 (PDT), jkn
wrote:

You can certainly get (or make ;-) speaker cable as thin as a playing card ...
I have some myself. It's made from thin silver ribbon (99.999% pure etc.)
conductors, laid side-by-side onto transparent adhesive tape.

Google 'Allen Wright' and 'vacuumstate' for more info. Yes, I realise I'm
opening myself up to the Ross Andrews baiters here - I regard myself as one of
those baiters actually.

However I don't really expect the OP to go to these lengths, and I agree with
others that you don't want to do this with mains power.

Another version is the self adhesive copper tape sold in hobby
stores/model shops sometimes known by the name Kaptan tape which is
the original quality version though Kapton is the insulation material
which other copper tapes may not have.
Used some to connect a door bell push once where the owner did not
want any holes drilled through a door frame .
Hardly visible once it was painted over.
G.Harman

Wonder what the kickback voltage is on a mechanical sounder.


I've had several hundred volts off electric motors on 12v..


NT



--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

On Friday, August 1, 2014 12:59:41 PM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 01/08/14 12:22, wrote:
On Friday, August 1, 2014 7:58:43 AM UTC+1, wrote:
On Wed, 30 Jul 2014 04:38:20 -0700 (PDT), jkn
wrote:

You can certainly get (or make ;-) speaker cable as thin as a playing

Another version is the self adhesive copper tape sold in hobby
stores/model shops sometimes known by the name Kaptan tape which is
the original quality version though Kapton is the insulation material
which other copper tapes may not have.
Used some to connect a door bell push once where the owner did not
want any holes drilled through a door frame .
Hardly visible once it was painted over.

Wonder what the kickback voltage is on a mechanical sounder.

I've had several hundred volts off electric motors on 12v..

.... and what voltage a layer of gloss paint can withstand. I wouldnt be surprised if it could cope with 200 or 300v, but only barely, for a while.


NT