I phoned in our meter reading today fom our electricty dial meter as
from left to right:

5 - exactly on
0 - exactly on
9 0 - between
5 6 - between
8 9 - between

This has been billed as:

50958

Am I right in thinking that this should be:

49958 ?

E.

eastender wrote:
I phoned in our meter reading today fom our electricty dial meter as
from left to right:

5 - exactly on
0 - exactly on
9 0 - between
5 6 - between
8 9 - between

This has been billed as:

50958

Am I right in thinking that this should be:

49958 ?

E.

yes See
http://www.edfenergy.com/products-se...ty-meter.shtml

Bob Minchin wrote:

eastender wrote:

I phoned in our meter reading today fom our electricty dial meter as
from left to right:

5 - exactly on
0 - exactly on
9 0 - between
5 6 - between
8 9 - between

This has been billed as:
50958

Am I right in thinking that this should be:
49958 ?

yes See
http://www.edfenergy.com/products-se...ty-meter.shtml

Yes, but I think they are expecting the person submitting the reading to
follow the rule

"If the pointer on a dial falls between 9 and 0, reduce the reading
already taken for the dial on the left by one"

rather than that they will reduce it for you ...

On 2014-03-27 21:06:21 +0000, Andy Burns said:

Yes, but I think they are expecting the person submitting the reading
to follow the rule

"If the pointer on a dial falls between 9 and 0, reduce the reading
already taken for the dial on the left by one"

rather than that they will reduce it for you ...

I asked the E.ON agent to confirm that he needed to take 1 away from
the top two but he obviously ignored me or didn't understand that two
dials needed reduction so have been billed 1000 kW too much.

This is after someone read the meter and they asked me to recheck it -
I thing they are having trouble getting readers who know about dials
now...

EDF want to replace the meter but it's in a built-in unit that I'll
have to break apart unfortunately and I've not got around to it.

The bill is still high - about £1000 for four months' gas and electric
- is it possible (in London) to get it any cheaper or is E.ON about the
best? I've never paid any attention to the bills until now but suspect
there's not much to choose between them.

E.

On Thursday, March 27, 2014 9:36:16 PM UTC, eastender wrote:
On 2014-03-27 21:06:21 +0000, Andy Burns said:



Yes, but I think they are expecting the person submitting the reading

to follow the rule



"If the pointer on a dial falls between 9 and 0, reduce the reading

already taken for the dial on the left by one"



rather than that they will reduce it for you ...



I asked the E.ON agent to confirm that he needed to take 1 away from

the top two but he obviously ignored me or didn't understand that two

dials needed reduction so have been billed 1000 kW too much.



This is after someone read the meter and they asked me to recheck it -

I thing they are having trouble getting readers who know about dials

now...



EDF want to replace the meter but it's in a built-in unit that I'll

have to break apart unfortunately and I've not got around to it.



The bill is still high - about £1000 for four months' gas and electric

- is it possible (in London) to get it any cheaper or is E.ON about the

best? I've never paid any attention to the bills until now but suspect

there's not much to choose between them.



E.

Many years ago the meter in our house was under the hall table. As a child I was fascinated to see the disk revolve, except one day it wasn't revolving. I told me mother it was broken, and upon confirming it wasn't working, she promptly turned on all the electric heaters and the immersion heater. Her reasoning was they were going to estimate the bill and as sure as God made little apples, they would err on their side, so she was getting her dig in first.

On 27/03/2014 21:36, eastender wrote:
On 2014-03-27 21:06:21 +0000, Andy Burns said:

Yes, but I think they are expecting the person submitting the reading
to follow the rule

"If the pointer on a dial falls between 9 and 0, reduce the reading
already taken for the dial on the left by one"

rather than that they will reduce it for you ...

I asked the E.ON agent to confirm that he needed to take 1 away from the
top two but he obviously ignored me or didn't understand that two dials
needed reduction so have been billed 1000 kW too much.

This is after someone read the meter and they asked me to recheck it - I
thing they are having trouble getting readers who know about dials now...

They fired all their meter readers and now every supplier outsources it
to what appears to be the same organisation of cheap untrained serfs.
They only know how to read the digital ones. I see the same one coming
round here with a different suppliers hat on just about every month
(until he gets fed up/finds a better job and leaves).

They once tried to charge the village hall for a proportion of the
national debt since their system expects 6 digits and one meter has only
5 on it. If the drudge zero pads at the wrong end then the resulting
bill is an order of magnitude higher than it should be.

EDF want to replace the meter but it's in a built-in unit that I'll have
to break apart unfortunately and I've not got around to it.

The bill is still high - about £1000 for four months' gas and electric -
is it possible (in London) to get it any cheaper or is E.ON about the
best? I've never paid any attention to the bills until now but suspect
there's not much to choose between them.

E.

Eon isn't all that bad - but check you are on their best tariff though.
Like all the energy suppliers they will default you to the worst one if
you don't pay careful attention to what is going on. Worth feeding your
data into a comparison site (and then into the recommended supplier)

Scottish were cheapest for me last time I looked (but I don't quality
for dual fuel) and SSE *has* to be worth a look right now.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 28/03/14 09:35, Martin Brown wrote:

They fired all their meter readers and now every supplier outsources it
to what appears to be the same organisation of cheap untrained serfs.

Maybe my 8 year old some can get a Saturday job with them - he knows how
to read dial meters...

In article ,
Tim Watts wrote:
On 28/03/14 09:35, Martin Brown wrote:

They fired all their meter readers and now every supplier outsources it
to what appears to be the same organisation of cheap untrained serfs.

Maybe my 8 year old some can get a Saturday job with them - he knows how
to read dial meters...

no chance - he's too highly qualified.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

On Thu, 27 Mar 2014 21:36:16 +0000, eastender wrote:

I asked the E.ON agent to confirm that he needed to take 1 away from
the top two but he obviously ignored me or didn't understand that two
dials needed reduction so have been billed 1000 kW too much.

This is after someone read the meter and they asked me to recheck it -
I thing they are having trouble getting readers who know about dials
now...
snip
The bill is still high - about £1000 for four months' gas and electric
- is it possible (in London) to get it any cheaper ...

Is that with or without the extra 1000 kWHr of lecky? They could add
anything from £100 to £200+ depending on what you pay per kWhr.

I've never paid any attention to the bills until now but suspect
there's not much to choose between them.

See above tariffs vary greatly within companies let alone across
companies. Arm your self with your actual annual use (gas and
electricity) over at least the last 12 months (averaged over longer
if you can) and take a look at the comparison site to quickly see
what is out there.

Personally I don't trust the savings given by the comparison sites, I
just use them to find likely suppliers and tarrifs. I then obtain the
real numbers for each tariff and feed them into a spreadsheet to work
out what I expect the real costs to be. But then I have meter
readings going back years in that spreadsheet so know my use very
accurately.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 09:35:12 +0000, Martin Brown wrote:

... and SSE *has* to be worth a look right now.

"Prices fixed 'till 2016" sounds good but read the detail. That's
Jan '16 and fixed at what rate? All their tariffs?

I have a couple of fixed tariffs, that I signed up for nearly 12
months ago, one ends Feb 15 the oher May 15. I should imagine that
most of the companies have fixed price tariffs going into at least
late 15 if not early 16.

The cynic in me says SSE is just waving a marketing flag, rather than
offering any thing really different to other suppliers.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 28/03/2014 10:23, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 09:35:12 +0000, Martin Brown wrote:

... and SSE *has* to be worth a look right now.

"Prices fixed 'till 2016" sounds good but read the detail. That's
Jan '16 and fixed at what rate? All their tariffs?

I have a couple of fixed tariffs, that I signed up for nearly 12
months ago, one ends Feb 15 the oher May 15. I should imagine that
most of the companies have fixed price tariffs going into at least
late 15 if not early 16.

The cynic in me says SSE is just waving a marketing flag, rather than
offering any thing really different to other suppliers.

Very probably but still worth a look. I certainly didn't get offered the
best tariff from my own supplier on renewal and I expect that is common.
You have to check online and then double check what is claimed on the
suppliers own website to avoid being ripped off.

Customer loyalty is rewarded by higher bills - the message is clear!

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

In article 2014032721361662413-nospam@nospamcom, eastender
writes

The bill is still high - about £1000 for four months' gas and electric
- is it possible (in London) to get it any cheaper or is E.ON about the
best? I've never paid any attention to the bills until now but suspect
there's not much to choose between them.

Have a look at a switching site and you will see, it's a 5min job.

You could do worse than to go to http://energylinx.co.uk/ , enter the
required details and then when you get the results look at using
separate suppliers, instead of a single combined one, as there are now a
couple of smaller outfits making inroads into the business. I had
wondered how they were able to undercut the big boys but I heard
recently that smaller companies aren't required to pay green levies and,
to quote the source, they could be up to 100quid cheaper.
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

On 28/03/2014 10:08, Dave Liquorice wrote:
Personally I don't trust the savings given by the comparison sites, I
just use them to find likely suppliers and tarrifs. I then obtain the
real numbers for each tariff and feed them into a spreadsheet to work
out what I expect the real costs to be. But then I have meter
readings going back years in that spreadsheet so know my use very
accurately.

ditto.

On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 10:35:47 +0000, Martin Brown wrote:

The cynic in me says SSE is just waving a marketing flag, rather
than
offering any thing really different to other suppliers.

Very probably but still worth a look. I certainly didn't get offered the
best tariff from my own supplier on renewal and I expect that is common.

Common as in contained in the terms of a limited period contract.
When that contract ends you normally get moved to that companies
standard tariff, this is rarely the best they offer.

Customer loyalty is rewarded by higher bills - the message is clear!

Yep, but that is how many things work these days. They reley on
people being too busy or too lazy to do a quick online check that
they won't be able to better the tariff they are going to be moved
to. Mind you to do that requires you to enter the future tariff into
the comparison site rather than the current one, that might be a too
hard for many of the population to cope with.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 02:09:48 -0700 (PDT)
fred wrote:

On Thursday, March 27, 2014 9:36:16 PM UTC, eastender wrote:
On 2014-03-27 21:06:21 +0000, Andy Burns said:



Yes, but I think they are expecting the person submitting the
reading

to follow the rule



"If the pointer on a dial falls between 9 and 0, reduce the
reading

already taken for the dial on the left by one"



rather than that they will reduce it for you ...



I asked the E.ON agent to confirm that he needed to take 1 away
from

the top two but he obviously ignored me or didn't understand that
two

dials needed reduction so have been billed 1000 kW too much.



This is after someone read the meter and they asked me to recheck
it -

I thing they are having trouble getting readers who know about
dials

now...



EDF want to replace the meter but it's in a built-in unit that I'll

have to break apart unfortunately and I've not got around to it.



The bill is still high - about £1000 for four months' gas and
electric

- is it possible (in London) to get it any cheaper or is E.ON about
the

best? I've never paid any attention to the bills until now but
suspect

there's not much to choose between them.



E.

Many years ago the meter in our house was under the hall table. As a
child I was fascinated to see the disk revolve, except one day it
wasn't revolving. I told me mother it was broken, and upon confirming
it wasn't working, she promptly turned on all the electric heaters
and the immersion heater. Her reasoning was they were going to
estimate the bill and as sure as God made little apples, they would
err on their side, so she was getting her dig in first.

In the US, most meters are outside the house, so the meter readers can
just move from house to house without bothering the occupants. We moved
into a rented place in Kansas City, and the meter never budged. We
received several months of bills with zero use, and then one evening,
the door bell rang, and there a was a guy with a new meter in his hand,
telling us that he was about to replace the old one.
The company then estimated the bill back to when we had moved in, and
although I took it up with the Missouri Public Service Commission, who
monitor the State's utility companies, they said that the rate that we
were being charged was fair, so we paid up. They let us pay it off over
several months, too.

--
Davey.

Dave Liquorice wrote:

On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 09:35:12 +0000, Martin Brown wrote:

... and SSE *has* to be worth a look right now.

"Prices fixed 'till 2016"

I have a couple of fixed tariffs, that I signed up for nearly 12
months ago, one ends Feb 15 the oher May 15.

I was able to "queue up" a tariff change in mid-October to take place
mid-December onto a 24 month fix, so I essentially got a 36 month fix as
the 2 year fix is only a few quid higher than my previous 1 year fix.

If millibrand gets in I'll have the consolation of that becoming a 49
month fix - any guesses how big the ramp-up will be come Jan 2017?

On 2014-03-28 10:08:03 +0000, Dave Liquorice said:

But then I have meter
readings going back years in that spreadsheet so know my use very
accurately.

It's not so easy to get the data when readings are mix of estimated and
real at random dates - I've just tried working out it with the two
years' worth of E.On bills we have and gave up. I spoke to an agent a
bit earlier to get the 1000kWh lopped off and asked him if they could
supply accurate data for a year and he said all he could do was go
through the bills with a calculator like me...

I must say E.On customer service is excellent - they answered both my
recent calls instantly and were friendly.

I also asked about smart meters - apparently free combined gas/electric
ones are coming but that may be a while.

E.

eastender wrote:

It's not so easy to get the data when readings are mix of estimated and
real at random dates

Just find the oldest non-estimated bill you've got, and take a reading
now, divide by the number of months between them ...

On 2014-03-28 21:06:49 +0000, Andy Burns said:

eastender wrote:

It's not so easy to get the data when readings are mix of estimated and
real at random dates

Just find the oldest non-estimated bill you've got, and take a reading
now, divide by the number of months between them ...

Yes but really you need a year so you don't get say two winters and one
summer - that's not so easy to do.

E.

In message 2014032822294526040-nospam@nospamcom, eastender
writes
On 2014-03-28 21:06:49 +0000, Andy Burns said:

eastender wrote:

It's not so easy to get the data when readings are mix of estimated
and
real at random dates
Just find the oldest non-estimated bill you've got, and take a
reading now, divide by the number of months between them ...

Yes but really you need a year so you don't get say two winters and one
summer - that's not so easy to do.


E.

It is as long as you take actual readings - if I get an estimated bill
I always take a reading and they redo the bill. Then you just need to
look back to the bill

Or keep your own records of readings - I try to do regular readings -
say every month or so. In an ideal world I do it every week, but ICNBA
(moslty cos the gas meter is in the cellar)
--
Chris French

Tim Watts writes:

On 28/03/14 09:35, Martin Brown wrote:

They fired all their meter readers and now every supplier outsources it
to what appears to be the same organisation of cheap untrained serfs.

Maybe my 8 year old some can get a Saturday job with them - he knows how
to read dial meters...

Round here, Scottish Power a.k.a. Iberdrola S.A. has outsourced meter
reading to G4S.
The last person I saw seemed well educated; probably laid off from a
decent job because of age.
But we know about the competence, honesty, and decency generally
displayed by G4S.

--
Windmill, Use t m i l l
J.R.R. Tolkien:- @ S c o t s h o m e . c o m
All that is gold does not glister / Not all who wander are lost

eastender wrote:

Yes but really you need a year so you don't get say two winters and one
summer - that's not so easy to do.

Perhaps this is also the time to resolve to take your own
readings regularly for future reference.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 22:29:45 +0000, eastender wrote:

On 2014-03-28 21:06:49 +0000, Andy Burns said:

eastender wrote:

It's not so easy to get the data when readings are mix of estimated and
real at random dates

Just find the oldest non-estimated bill you've got, and take a reading
now, divide by the number of months between them ...

Yes but really you need a year so you don't get say two winters and one
summer - that's not so easy to do.

E.

Although I read the gas every week (and the water), I submit a reading on
line at the end of March and the end of September. This gives me,
effectively, Winter and Summer and I have readings now for 4 years on leccy
and 6 years on gas. Very useful if switching as reallistic figures can be
entered for useage.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

Chris J Dixon wrote:
eastender wrote:

Yes but really you need a year so you don't get say two winters and one
summer - that's not so easy to do.

Perhaps this is also the time to resolve to take your own
readings regularly for future reference.

I used to do that, but with my smart meter, it's not necessary: I
download half-hourly readings from the supplier's web site.

--
Mike Barnes
Cheshire, England

Mike Barnes wrote:

Chris J Dixon wrote:
eastender wrote:

Yes but really you need a year so you don't get say two winters and one
summer - that's not so easy to do.

Perhaps this is also the time to resolve to take your own
readings regularly for future reference.

I used to do that, but with my smart meter, it's not necessary: I
download half-hourly readings from the supplier's web site.

That's OK for you, but the suggestion was aimed rather more at
the OP.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

On Fri, 28 Mar 2014 20:35:57 +0000, eastender wrote:

But then I have meter readings going back years in that
spreadsheet so
know my use very accurately.

It's not so easy to get the data when readings are mix of estimated and
real ...

Ignore the estimates, only pay attention to real (either yours or the
suppliers) readings and go back as far as you can. Spreadsheet has a
column of dates in ascending order next column the reading. Pick two
dates a year or slighly more apart, take one from the other to get
the number of days, take the difference between the associated
readings, divide that by the number of days and multiply by 365 to
get a mean annual consumption.

Simples.

Unless there have been major changes in lifestyle or occupancy it'll
be close enough.

--
Cheers
Dave.

[Default] On Thu, 27 Mar 2014 20:48:38 +0000, a certain chimpanzee,
eastender , randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:

I phoned in our meter reading today fom our electricty dial meter as
from left to right:

5 - exactly on
0 - exactly on
9 0 - between
5 6 - between
8 9 - between

This has been billed as:

50958

Am I right in thinking that this should be:

49958 ?

If it's 11:59 on an analogue clock, the hour hand appears to be
pointing to the 12, but it's not yet 12:00. So, presumably like the
hands on a clock, the only way the first needle would be exactly on 5
is if all the following needles were on 0, so if the proceeding
(smaller) dial's needle is on a 9, then you round down.
--
Hugo Nebula
"If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this,
just how far from the pack have I strayed"?

On 30/03/14 13:00, Hugo Nebula wrote:
[Default] On Thu, 27 Mar 2014 20:48:38 +0000, a certain chimpanzee,
eastender , randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:

I phoned in our meter reading today fom our electricty dial meter as
from left to right:

5 - exactly on
0 - exactly on
9 0 - between
5 6 - between
8 9 - between

This has been billed as:

50958

Am I right in thinking that this should be:

49958 ?

If it's 11:59 on an analogue clock, the hour hand appears to be
pointing to the 12, but it's not yet 12:00. So, presumably like the
hands on a clock, the only way the first needle would be exactly on 5
is if all the following needles were on 0, so if the proceeding
(smaller) dial's needle is on a 9, then you round down.


Indeed - which is also why there's a 1/10 dial

The main other "gotcha" on dial meters is that every other dial goes
counter clockwise... That does require paying attention.