Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television,
and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so have have
catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our heads.
(Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the issues
still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc.
And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...HDSatelliteKit

Our neighbours have dishes and appear to be fine getting a signal with
what I think are mostly small Sky dishes - we have a near-identical
location so imagine that side will be easy enough. (Have downloaded an
iPad satellite set up application.)

Should I take a punt with the Screwfix kit? The reviews seem OK on
average but there are quite a few who had to get replacements or
refunds. (Have not done a proper analysis but initial impression is a
lot of those are from 2011.)

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better? Or go
with this and expect to upgrade the receiver as and when I find one I
fancy more? (I know - highly subjective - how can anyone else really
answer that?)

Any suggestions?

--
Rod

On 19/11/2012 10:50, polygonum wrote:
Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television,
and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so have have
catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our heads.
(Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the issues
still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc.
And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...HDSatelliteKit


Our neighbours have dishes and appear to be fine getting a signal with
what I think are mostly small Sky dishes - we have a near-identical
location so imagine that side will be easy enough. (Have downloaded an
iPad satellite set up application.)

Should I take a punt with the Screwfix kit? The reviews seem OK on
average but there are quite a few who had to get replacements or
refunds. (Have not done a proper analysis but initial impression is a
lot of those are from 2011.)

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better? Or go
with this and expect to upgrade the receiver as and when I find one I
fancy more? (I know - highly subjective - how can anyone else really
answer that?)

Any suggestions?

I got mine from Satgear, good quality and helpful company. Don't fail to
install multiple LNBs, I use a quad arrangement. The multiple LNBs are
essential if you wish to record one channel while watching another, or
record 2 at once. Life being as it is there will be no worthwhile
programs one night then the next night 2 at the same time.

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 11:08:04 +0000, Broadback wrote:

Don't fail to install multiple LNBs, I use a quad arrangement. The
multiple LNBs are essential if you wish to record one channel while
watching another ...

Do you really mean "multiple LNBs" as in more than one or do you mean a
quad LNB that has four seperate, independant, outputs?

Multiple LNBs are normally only used to receive more than one satellite
(or constellation of satellites) that are adjacent to each other in the
same bit of sky without having to install a motorised dish.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 11:08:04 +0000, Broadback wrote:

Don't fail to install multiple LNBs, I use a quad arrangement. The
multiple LNBs are essential if you wish to record one channel while
watching another ...

Do you really mean "multiple LNBs" as in more than one or do you mean a
quad LNB that has four seperate, independant, outputs?

Multiple LNBs are normally only used to receive more than one satellite
(or constellation of satellites) that are adjacent to each other in the
same bit of sky without having to install a motorised dish.


There's quite a variety of LNBs out there.

universal LNB: one output, also gets signals from receiver for
band/polarization switching. no ext. switch needed.

twin LNB: like the above, but with two independent outputs(also
switchable..).

quad LNB: like the above.

quattro LNB: surprise!! different!! 4 outputs. Low/Hi band Vert/Horz
polarization. _requires_ external switch.

monoblocs: multiple LNBs in one package. used to get at two/more
different satellite locations at the same time. integrated DiSEqC
switch. Some people do not like those as the alignment requirements
differ dependent on antenna location, but monoblocs have fixed
alignment. alternative is to use a bar for mounting multiple distinct
LNBs. May have to be narrow ones as otherwise they might not fit.


Above has mostly been copied from he
http://www.reicheltpedia.de/index.php/LNB
Nomenclature may be a bit different in the UK.

It is also possible to use a rotating dish(USALS) to track multiple
locations(but only one at a time).

The DiSEqC specs are available online on the eutelsat homepage:
http://www.eutelsat.com/satellites/4_5_5.html

Also it is a good idea to use a grounding block to keep the
cabling(shield) at ground potential. It is slightly unpleasant getting
zapped by a charged cable, but your set top box/computer will like it
even less.

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012, "polygonum" writ:

Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television,
and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so have have
catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our
heads. (Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the
issues still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc.
And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...cm_mmc=Email-_
-E12W43A-_-Banner2-_-HDSatelliteKit

Or,

http://tinyurl.com/dyv9amn

at GBP16.65. I've got one of these and it's excellent.

--
P

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012, "Percy" writ:

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012, "polygonum" writ:

Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television,
and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so have have
catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our
heads. (Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the
issues still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc.
And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...cm_mmc=Email-_
-E12W43A-_-Banner2-_-HDSatelliteKit

Or,

http://tinyurl.com/dyv9amn

at GBP16.65. I've got one of these and it's excellent.

Sorry, somehow lost the rest of my post.

Then buy the Freesat receiver of your choice. The kit you are looking at
seems to be a generic Free To Air receiver. A proper Freesat receiver
will give you the Freesat EPG and also the other FTA channels in most
cases.
--
P

On 19/11/2012 11:12, Percy wrote:
On Mon, 19 Nov 2012, "Percy" writ:

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012, "polygonum" writ:

Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our
television, and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so
have have catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about
watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our
heads. (Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the
issues still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI,
etc. And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...cm_mmc=Email-_
-E12W43A-_-Banner2-_-HDSatelliteKit

Or,

http://tinyurl.com/dyv9amn

at GBP16.65. I've got one of these and it's excellent.

Sorry, somehow lost the rest of my post.

Then buy the Freesat receiver of your choice. The kit you are looking at
seems to be a generic Free To Air receiver. A proper Freesat receiver
will give you the Freesat EPG and also the other FTA channels in most
cases.

Thanks - definitely will consider that.

--
Rod

In article , polygonum
writes
On 19/11/2012 11:12, Percy wrote:

http://tinyurl.com/dyv9amn

at GBP16.65. I've got one of these and it's excellent.

Sorry, somehow lost the rest of my post.

Then buy the Freesat receiver of your choice. The kit you are looking at
seems to be a generic Free To Air receiver. A proper Freesat receiver
will give you the Freesat EPG and also the other FTA channels in most
cases.

Thanks - definitely will consider that.

That's a bldy good deal, snap it up. I was going to point you to CPC and
even with discount codes it would have been 30 odd for a zone 1 dish and
quad LNB, true it would have been a galvanised Triax dish but def worth
a punt, I have an install to do before Christmas and will get one of
those.

The screwfix box doesn't appear to be a freesat one so you don't get the
super easy to use freesat EPG. Basic freesat boxes eg Bush SD one, come
in at about 30quid and have only scart, to get HDMI for future proofing
you need to pay 60-100 but you will get HD for that and a network
connection that should support iPlayer (not other channels though I
think). If you go to the Humax site and buy a graded box (12mth guar,
hve bought several, no probs) you will save a fair bit. Foxsat HDR
recording boxes are being replaced by their new Youview range so you can
pick up a graded recording box from 150quid, bargain in my view, also
HD.

Don't forget to buy a satellite alignment meter (fiver) and a roll of
self amalgamating tape (2-3quid) for the dish connections. Trade trick
is to cut cable to length first (_not_ too short) and make the
connections before installing the dish. Buy CF100 grade cable with
copper foil and braid screening, 'F' is for foam filled which resists
water ingress better than good but air cored CT100 and the foam resists
kinking. F-type plugs are used for connections.

Good luck!
--
fred
it's a ba-na-na . . . .

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 12:22:22 +0000, fred wrote:

Trade trick is to cut cable to length first (_not_ too short)
and make the connections before installing the dish.

What is the point of doing that?


--

"polygonum" wrote in message
...
Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge hammer
to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only available for
more expensive packages, we can't even record while watching something
else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television, and via computers (out
to via HDMI to the television), so have have catch-up but some things we
want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a long
way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our local
option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our heads. (Some
very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the issues still apply
even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc. And
today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very inexpensive
kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...HDSatelliteKit

Our neighbours have dishes and appear to be fine getting a signal with
what I think are mostly small Sky dishes - we have a near-identical
location so imagine that side will be easy enough. (Have downloaded an
iPad satellite set up application.)

Should I take a punt with the Screwfix kit? The reviews seem OK on average
but there are quite a few who had to get replacements or refunds. (Have
not done a proper analysis but initial impression is a lot of those are
from 2011.)

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better? Or go
with this and expect to upgrade the receiver as and when I find one I
fancy more? (I know - highly subjective - how can anyone else really
answer that?)


Make sure you get FreeSat (with the standard EPG) and not just 'free to
view' which often has a crap EPG.
I bought a cheap box from Lidl but returned it because the EPG was useless.

That setup is amazingly cheap - I suspect that it isn't FreeSat because
there is a license fee to use the FreeSat logo and EPG which normally pushes
the base price up.

X-posted to uk.tech.digital-tv.

Cheers

Dave T
--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 10:50:01 +0000, polygonum wrote:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

Yes I had that email as well. B-) Seems a bargin but bear in mind that
reciever is a generic free to air HD satelite box it's not any form of
PVR. You won't have the Freesat EPG, so I think you only get "now & next"
information rather than a full 7 day guide, others will no doubt correct
or fill out that statement. B-)

The kit only comes with 30' of cable is that enough?

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better?

From your first para it looks like a PVR would be a better choice one
with at least two DSAT receivers so you can record one channel whilst
watching another. The LNB (box on the dish) will need at least two
outputs. If you ever swap the telly to one with a DSAT receiver that will
also need a feed from the LNB so fit a quad LNB and blank off the unused
outputs with self amalgamating tape until needed.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 19/11/2012 11:21, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 10:50:01 +0000, polygonum wrote:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

Yes I had that email as well. B-) Seems a bargin but bear in mind that
reciever is a generic free to air HD satelite box it's not any form of
PVR. You won't have the Freesat EPG, so I think you only get "now & next"
information rather than a full 7 day guide, others will no doubt correct
or fill out that statement. B-)

The kit only comes with 30' of cable is that enough?

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better?

From your first para it looks like a PVR would be a better choice one
with at least two DSAT receivers so you can record one channel whilst
watching another. The LNB (box on the dish) will need at least two
outputs. If you ever swap the telly to one with a DSAT receiver that will
also need a feed from the LNB so fit a quad LNB and blank off the unused
outputs with self amalgamating tape until needed.


Thanks.

Cable length not an issue - a) not much required; b) loads in shed. :-)

Are you saying that each LNB requires a separate run of cable?

Agreed some sort of PVR is probably what we want - but tend to avoid
buying things like that in the run up to Christmas. So was thinking
maybe 1) get this; 2) get it working; 3) (once we are happy all is well)
cancel Virgin; 4) (next year - Virgin notice period will take us there,
I am sure) buy Freesat PVR box.

--
Rod

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 11:42:54 +0000, polygonum wrote:

Are you saying that each LNB requires a separate run of cable?

Every satellite input on any receiver needs it's own connection to the
LNB(*) as the receiver controls the LNB so thatthe LNB to send the right
group of signals back to the receiver.

Agreed some sort of PVR is probably what we want - but tend to avoid
buying things like that in the run up to Christmas. So was thinking
maybe 1) get this; 2) get it working; 3) (once we are happy all is
well) cancel Virgin; 4) (next year - Virgin notice period will take us
there, I am sure) buy Freesat PVR box.

Yeah, seems sensible. You're aware of the limitations of that cheap kit
from screwfix but it should be fairly straight forward to change the LNB
to a quad one later. Put the four cables in now as that's the time
consuming and hard bit, seal the unused outside ends well with SA tape.

When you upgrade the screwfix box can then be used else where (still
needs and LNB connection of course) or feed the telly direct giving you
the abilty to record 2 channels whilst watching another depending on the
PVR you get.

(*)For up to 4 receivers a quad LNB will do after that it's worth
considering a multiswitch that takes the four groups of signals from the
LNB and feeds them as required to the recievers connected to it. Depends
how many more receivers you need to feed. You can get octo LNBs but
that's a big bunch of cables to get inside...

--
Cheers
Dave.

"polygonum" wrote in message ...

Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge hammer
to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only available for
more expensive packages, we can't even record while watching something
else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television, and via computers (out
to via HDMI to the television), so have have catch-up but some things we
want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a long
way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our local
option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our heads. (Some
very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the issues still apply
even after switch off.)

We ditched Sky a couple of years ago having got fed up with the high cost
and low quality programing.
We now have a Humax Foxsat box hooked up to the old Sky dish via a 4 way
LNB. The quality of the programmes is no better but at least we can watch
one and record another or record two at a time and watch one on digital when
the few decent things clash.

I changed the LNB and wired up it up myself (two cables required) with no
problem. I even managed to run a third line to the old sky box in another
room so we can watch whats free on Sky.

As STWNFI is a big cricket fan we also have a "Top up TV" box where we buy
Sky sport by the month when the main tests are on.

Mike

On 19/11/2012 10:50, polygonum wrote:
Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television,
and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so have have
catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our heads.
(Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the issues
still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc.
And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...HDSatelliteKit


Our neighbours have dishes and appear to be fine getting a signal with
what I think are mostly small Sky dishes - we have a near-identical
location so imagine that side will be easy enough. (Have downloaded an
iPad satellite set up application.)

Should I take a punt with the Screwfix kit? The reviews seem OK on
average but there are quite a few who had to get replacements or
refunds. (Have not done a proper analysis but initial impression is a
lot of those are from 2011.)

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better? Or go
with this and expect to upgrade the receiver as and when I find one I
fancy more? (I know - highly subjective - how can anyone else really
answer that?)

Any suggestions?


a) Buy a Freesat twin tuner PVR. I think that the replacement for the
Humax Foxsat HDR is now available.

b) See uk.tech.digital.tv

c) Use www.satcure.co.uk for little bits and technical info.

d) DIY installation is possible, but I would suggest purchasing a £10
Sat meter.

e) Look at the www.digitalspy.co.uk satellite forums

f) You must have line of site to satellite www.dishpointer.com

g) I would avoid the smallest Sky dishes. Bigger dishes get more signal
which helps when its is raining.


--
Michael Chare

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 23:38:11 +0000, Michael Chare wrote:

g) I would avoid the smallest Sky dishes. Bigger dishes get more signal
which helps when its is raining.

Meh. We have a "Zone 1" minidish in the far north of England, go more
than 30 miles further north and Sky fit the larger "Zone 2" minidishes.

We get a full strength signal with good quality on the end of about 40m
of CT100.

We have had rain fade once for justa few minutes but boy it didn't half
rain. The only other times we have lost the signal has been due to 1/2"
of ice build up on the face of the dish.

This is a DIY install so the dish alignment is spot on not just a "got a
signal that'll do" of a "professional Sky Cow^H^H^HInstaller".

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Tue, 20 Nov 2012 10:13:51 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

We have had rain fade once for justa few minutes but boy it didn't half
rain.

It's the the size of the lumps of rain that matters

--

I'm late into this thread and you've already received much useful
advice, but if you want a general intro to DIY dish mounting, with a
calculator page for accurate alignment, I have section on my site
geared specifically towards DIY Satellite TV:

http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/Audi...telliteTV.html

BTW, there's a similar section on DIY Terrestrial TV, if that's of any
interest to anyone:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/Audi...estrialTV.html

On Mon, 19 Nov 2012 10:50:01 +0000, polygonum
wrote:

Am thoroughly sick of paying for Virgin television - took a sledge
hammer to even get an HD box, and as a Tivo-based box seems only
available for more expensive packages, we can't even record while
watching something else. We have iPlayer on Virgin, on our television,
and via computers (out to via HDMI to the television), so have have
catch-up but some things we want more flexibility about watching.

We could go Freeview but in our precise location Crystal Palace is a
long way away and the signal seems to get affected by trees. And our
local option has limited channels and seems set up to go over our heads.
(Some very recent local aerials are gigantic - so I think the issues
still apply even after switch off.)

So Freesat beckons. I know absolutely nothing about selecting kit and
setting it up. We do have a decent, modern TV with loads of HDMI, etc.
And today I noticed that Screwfix are (*again) flogging a very
inexpensive kit:

HD Complete Satellite Kit - Product Code: 98603 £39.99.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/hd-complet...HDSatelliteKit

Our neighbours have dishes and appear to be fine getting a signal with
what I think are mostly small Sky dishes - we have a near-identical
location so imagine that side will be easy enough. (Have downloaded an
iPad satellite set up application.)

Should I take a punt with the Screwfix kit? The reviews seem OK on
average but there are quite a few who had to get replacements or
refunds. (Have not done a proper analysis but initial impression is a
lot of those are from 2011.)

Would I be better off paying a bit more to get something better? Or go
with this and expect to upgrade the receiver as and when I find one I
fancy more? (I know - highly subjective - how can anyone else really
answer that?)

Any suggestions?
--
================================================== =======
Please always reply to ng as the email in this post's
header does not exist. Or use a contact address at:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/JavaJive.html
http://www.macfh.co.uk/Macfarlane/Macfarlane.html