Number two daughter is moving back up to our neck of the woods, and is
coming back to stay for an indeterminate length of time whilst she and her
fella sort out a new flat or whatever in the area. Now she has this uncanny
knack of being able to find the exact spot that the shower tray leaks,
resulting in water coming down through the ceiling in the utility room
downstairs. I don't know how she manages it. Never happens when me and the
wife use the shower every day ...

Anyways, the silicone sealing around the tray and door etc is starting to
look a bit grotty as its been there a few years now, so I guess this is a
good time to re-do it. Trouble is that these days, I can't be fagged to
spend hours crammed down through the cubicle doors on my already knackered
knees, so I'm looking for testimonials from the good folk on here, for the
silicone digester chemicals that you can get now from the DIY sheds. Are
they any good ? Any recommendations for best value / performance / speed
products ? Do Toolstation do one ? Couldn't find it in their catalogue, but
could be looking in the wrong place ?

Obviously, I'd like to get the whole job done in a day if possible, so's the
shower is not out of service for longer than that. Also, what to clean down
with before re-caulking ? It would be a bit of a bugger to redo it all, only
to find that the new stuff didn't stick because there was some residue of
the digester left on the tiles ... :-)

TIA

Arfa

On 23/06/2012 17:51, Arfa Daily wrote:
Number two daughter is moving back up to our neck of the woods, and is
coming back to stay for an indeterminate length of time whilst she and
her fella sort out a new flat or whatever in the area. Now she has this
uncanny knack of being able to find the exact spot that the shower tray
leaks, resulting in water coming down through the ceiling in the utility
room downstairs. I don't know how she manages it. Never happens when me
and the wife use the shower every day ...

Anyways, the silicone sealing around the tray and door etc is starting
to look a bit grotty as its been there a few years now, so I guess this
is a good time to re-do it. Trouble is that these days, I can't be
fagged to spend hours crammed down through the cubicle doors on my
already knackered knees, so I'm looking for testimonials from the good
folk on here, for the silicone digester chemicals that you can get now
from the DIY sheds. Are they any good ? Any recommendations for best
value / performance / speed products ? Do Toolstation do one ? Couldn't
find it in their catalogue, but could be looking in the wrong place ?

Obviously, I'd like to get the whole job done in a day if possible, so's
the shower is not out of service for longer than that. Also, what to
clean down with before re-caulking ? It would be a bit of a bugger to
redo it all, only to find that the new stuff didn't stick because there
was some residue of the digester left on the tiles ... :-)

TIA

Arfa

I think that with all of them, you need to remove as much of the
silicone as possible by mechanical means before using the dissolver. I,
too, would be interested in other people's experience with them. I have
used some which I got from Screwfix, but wasn't over impressed. I have
recently bought some different stuff when Lidl had it on offer, but
haven't had cause to try it yet.
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

On 23/06/12 20:04, Roger Mills wrote:
On 23/06/2012 17:51, Arfa Daily wrote:
Number two daughter is moving back up to our neck of the woods, and is
coming back to stay for an indeterminate length of time whilst she and
her fella sort out a new flat or whatever in the area. Now she has this
uncanny knack of being able to find the exact spot that the shower tray
leaks, resulting in water coming down through the ceiling in the utility
room downstairs. I don't know how she manages it. Never happens when me
and the wife use the shower every day ...

Anyways, the silicone sealing around the tray and door etc is starting
to look a bit grotty as its been there a few years now, so I guess this
is a good time to re-do it. Trouble is that these days, I can't be
fagged to spend hours crammed down through the cubicle doors on my
already knackered knees, so I'm looking for testimonials from the good
folk on here, for the silicone digester chemicals that you can get now
from the DIY sheds. Are they any good ? Any recommendations for best
value / performance / speed products ? Do Toolstation do one ? Couldn't
find it in their catalogue, but could be looking in the wrong place ?

Obviously, I'd like to get the whole job done in a day if possible, so's
the shower is not out of service for longer than that. Also, what to
clean down with before re-caulking ? It would be a bit of a bugger to
redo it all, only to find that the new stuff didn't stick because there
was some residue of the digester left on the tiles ... :-)

TIA

Arfa

I think that with all of them, you need to remove as much of the
silicone as possible by mechanical means before using the dissolver. I,
too, would be interested in other people's experience with them. I have
used some which I got from Screwfix, but wasn't over impressed. I have
recently bought some different stuff when Lidl had it on offer, but
haven't had cause to try it yet.

I've used the Unibond stuff. It works fairly well, but it's messy,
sticky stuff- rather like sealer before it sets.

It is best to use one of those plastic removal tools to get the bulk off
first.

The new sealer stuck on OK afterwards- no problems there.

On 23/06/2012 20:04, Roger Mills wrote:
On 23/06/2012 17:51, Arfa Daily wrote:
Number two daughter is moving back up to our neck of the woods, and is
coming back to stay for an indeterminate length of time whilst she and
her fella sort out a new flat or whatever in the area. Now she has this
uncanny knack of being able to find the exact spot that the shower tray
leaks, resulting in water coming down through the ceiling in the utility
room downstairs. I don't know how she manages it. Never happens when me
and the wife use the shower every day ...

Anyways, the silicone sealing around the tray and door etc is starting
to look a bit grotty as its been there a few years now, so I guess this
is a good time to re-do it. Trouble is that these days, I can't be
fagged to spend hours crammed down through the cubicle doors on my
already knackered knees, so I'm looking for testimonials from the good
folk on here, for the silicone digester chemicals that you can get now
from the DIY sheds. Are they any good ? Any recommendations for best
value / performance / speed products ? Do Toolstation do one ? Couldn't
find it in their catalogue, but could be looking in the wrong place ?

Obviously, I'd like to get the whole job done in a day if possible, so's
the shower is not out of service for longer than that. Also, what to
clean down with before re-caulking ? It would be a bit of a bugger to
redo it all, only to find that the new stuff didn't stick because there
was some residue of the digester left on the tiles ... :-)

TIA

Arfa

I think that with all of them, you need to remove as much of the
silicone as possible by mechanical means before using the dissolver. I,
too, would be interested in other people's experience with them. I have
used some which I got from Screwfix, but wasn't over impressed. I have
recently bought some different stuff when Lidl had it on offer, but
haven't had cause to try it yet.

I gave up on chemical removers, what I do now and I am in the process of
doing one of the showers is do a small section at a time so I dont get
hacked of doing it but this means I do it properly. The side or section
I am doing I tape (gafa tape) a strip of polythene above it and a couple
of inches around the corners, the strip will be about 6 inches of a drop
and cover over the silicone seam and the edge of the tray.
A bit unsightly but it does allow the shower to be used until the job is
done.

[snip Arfa]

From my experience, I reckon the mistake people make with the gloops
you can buy (TS do do one, bought some a while ago) is expecting them to
actually dissolve silicone[1]. What they do is destroy the
'stickingness' so that all traces of the old stuff can be fully removed
so that freshly applied silicone will then stick.

Trick seems to be:

a) mechanical removal of 99.9% of the old stuff

b) apply gloop and wait prescibed time (20mins on the TS one)

c) Thoroughly wash away it and, with it, the remnants of the old stuff
with washing up liquid.

I bought this to remove silicon from a potted bit of circuiry to let me
repair it and just used some before re-sealing a kitchen sink and it
worked well in both cases. This was after reading a load of old UK.DIY
threads that said, as per the other posts in this one, that they didn't
really do a lot.

Scott

[1] At least, at a rate faster than tectonic shift.

"Scott M" wrote in message
...

[snip Arfa]

From my experience, I reckon the mistake people make with the gloops you
can buy (TS do do one, bought some a while ago) is expecting them to
actually dissolve silicone[1]. What they do is destroy the 'stickingness'
so that all traces of the old stuff can be fully removed so that freshly
applied silicone will then stick.

Trick seems to be:

a) mechanical removal of 99.9% of the old stuff

b) apply gloop and wait prescibed time (20mins on the TS one)

c) Thoroughly wash away it and, with it, the remnants of the old stuff
with washing up liquid.

I bought this to remove silicon from a potted bit of circuiry to let me
repair it and just used some before re-sealing a kitchen sink and it
worked well in both cases. This was after reading a load of old UK.DIY
threads that said, as per the other posts in this one, that they didn't
really do a lot.

Scott

[1] At least, at a rate faster than tectonic shift.


OK. Thanks all for the comments so far. Looks like my shagged-out left knee
is going to be taking some more stick, then. I like ss's idea of taping
polythene over the work area to allow the shower to continue to be used. On
the knee, it's a bit of a funny one. Out of the blue, it developed a problem
such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like having a glass shard in
the side towards the bottom - sort of 5 o'clock position on my left knee (or
right as you look at it from the front). It leaves a burning sensation for
a few minutes after you take the weight back off, but otherwise recovers
perfectly. Absolutely nothing else has any effect. You can run, jump, climb
stairs - anything - without a problem. I found a forum on the 'net where
literally hundreds of people all over the world describe the exact same
symptoms, but here's the odd thing. No one actually knows what causes it.
Many of the posters have seen specialists, and had all sorts of both
invasive and non invasive tests done, but no physical problem ever shows up.
It's a mystery, and not really an issue, until you forget and kneel down.
It's like you knelt on a nail. A lot of the posters said that it just got
better on its own in between three and nine months, but others say that they
have had it for two years or more with no sign of improvement. Anyone else
on here suffer from it ?

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...


"Scott M" wrote in message
...

[snip Arfa]

From my experience, I reckon the mistake people make with the gloops you
can buy (TS do do one, bought some a while ago) is expecting them to
actually dissolve silicone[1]. What they do is destroy the 'stickingness'
so that all traces of the old stuff can be fully removed so that freshly
applied silicone will then stick.

Trick seems to be:

a) mechanical removal of 99.9% of the old stuff

b) apply gloop and wait prescibed time (20mins on the TS one)

c) Thoroughly wash away it and, with it, the remnants of the old stuff
with washing up liquid.

I bought this to remove silicon from a potted bit of circuiry to let me
repair it and just used some before re-sealing a kitchen sink and it
worked well in both cases. This was after reading a load of old UK.DIY
threads that said, as per the other posts in this one, that they didn't
really do a lot.

Scott

[1] At least, at a rate faster than tectonic shift.


OK. Thanks all for the comments so far. Looks like my shagged-out left
knee is going to be taking some more stick, then. I like ss's idea of
taping polythene over the work area to allow the shower to continue to be
used. On the knee, it's a bit of a funny one. Out of the blue, it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom - sort of 5 o'clock
position on my left knee (or right as you look at it from the front). It
leaves a burning sensation for a few minutes after you take the weight
back off, but otherwise recovers perfectly. Absolutely nothing else has
any effect. You can run, jump, climb stairs - anything - without a
problem. I found a forum on the 'net where literally hundreds of people
all over the world describe the exact same symptoms, but here's the odd
thing. No one actually knows what causes it. Many of the posters have seen
specialists, and had all sorts of both invasive and non invasive tests
done, but no physical problem ever shows up. It's a mystery, and not
really an issue, until you forget and kneel down. It's like you knelt on a
nail. A lot of the posters said that it just got better on its own in
between three and nine months, but others say that they have had it for
two years or more with no sign of improvement. Anyone else on here suffer
from it ?

Arfa

I also have knee probs but was wondering how the dog shop was doing.

On 24/06/2012 02:32, scorched wrote:
it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom

Maybe not the same issue but I used to do a lot of motorbike repairs
over Winter on my bikes, I found after a day one of my knees started to
swell and give a lot of pain and it would take a couple of weeks to get
back to normal. The doc said take a couple of Ibuprofen the day before
you start (not sure of the dose now maybe 3 spread over the day) and
continue while doing the work.
It was a great help for me and I still do this if I know I will be on my
knees.

"scorched" wrote in message
eb.com...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
...


"Scott M" wrote in message
...

[snip Arfa]

From my experience, I reckon the mistake people make with the gloops you
can buy (TS do do one, bought some a while ago) is expecting them to
actually dissolve silicone[1]. What they do is destroy the
'stickingness' so that all traces of the old stuff can be fully removed
so that freshly applied silicone will then stick.

Trick seems to be:

a) mechanical removal of 99.9% of the old stuff

b) apply gloop and wait prescibed time (20mins on the TS one)

c) Thoroughly wash away it and, with it, the remnants of the old stuff
with washing up liquid.

I bought this to remove silicon from a potted bit of circuiry to let me
repair it and just used some before re-sealing a kitchen sink and it
worked well in both cases. This was after reading a load of old UK.DIY
threads that said, as per the other posts in this one, that they didn't
really do a lot.

Scott

[1] At least, at a rate faster than tectonic shift.


OK. Thanks all for the comments so far. Looks like my shagged-out left
knee is going to be taking some more stick, then. I like ss's idea of
taping polythene over the work area to allow the shower to continue to be
used. On the knee, it's a bit of a funny one. Out of the blue, it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom - sort of 5 o'clock
position on my left knee (or right as you look at it from the front). It
leaves a burning sensation for a few minutes after you take the weight
back off, but otherwise recovers perfectly. Absolutely nothing else has
any effect. You can run, jump, climb stairs - anything - without a
problem. I found a forum on the 'net where literally hundreds of people
all over the world describe the exact same symptoms, but here's the odd
thing. No one actually knows what causes it. Many of the posters have
seen specialists, and had all sorts of both invasive and non invasive
tests done, but no physical problem ever shows up. It's a mystery, and
not really an issue, until you forget and kneel down. It's like you knelt
on a nail. A lot of the posters said that it just got better on its own
in between three and nine months, but others say that they have had it
for two years or more with no sign of improvement. Anyone else on here
suffer from it ?

Arfa

I also have knee probs but was wondering how the dog shop was doing.



Dog shop ??

Arfa

On 24/06/12 02:23, Arfa Daily wrote:

I like ss's idea of
taping polythene over the work area to allow the shower to continue to
be used.

It works well. I've used it on an area where grout had cracked on the
bottom row of tiles, and it needed to dry out properly but leave the
shower useable.

On 24/06/2012 10:25, ss wrote:
On 24/06/2012 02:32, scorched wrote:
it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom

Maybe not the same issue but I used to do a lot of motorbike repairs
over Winter on my bikes, I found after a day one of my knees started to
swell and give a lot of pain and it would take a couple of weeks to get
back to normal. The doc said take a couple of Ibuprofen the day before
you start (not sure of the dose now maybe 3 spread over the day) and
continue while doing the work.
It was a great help for me and I still do this if I know I will be on my
knees.


Dunno what Arfa has, but that is housemaid's knee. You may prefer one of
the other names

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prepatellar_bursitis

Andy

"Andy Champ" wrote in message
. uk...
On 24/06/2012 10:25, ss wrote:
On 24/06/2012 02:32, scorched wrote:
it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom

Maybe not the same issue but I used to do a lot of motorbike repairs
over Winter on my bikes, I found after a day one of my knees started to
swell and give a lot of pain and it would take a couple of weeks to get
back to normal. The doc said take a couple of Ibuprofen the day before
you start (not sure of the dose now maybe 3 spread over the day) and
continue while doing the work.
It was a great help for me and I still do this if I know I will be on my
knees.


Dunno what Arfa has, but that is housemaid's knee. You may prefer one of
the other names

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prepatellar_bursitis

Andy


My first thought was 'housemaid's knee' but when I looked into that, the
symptoms are definitely not the same. AFAIK, that is also a repetitive
strain type injury caused by a lifetime of working on your knees, hence its
'common' name. I have only worked on my knees on a few DIY occasions, and
certainly not recently, the last time being when I spent a couple of weeks
building that counter in our burger joint about a year ago now. Many of the
people on the forum also said that they had thought that it might be that,
and some had even had that condition diagnosed by their doctors, but the
ones who had gone on to see a specialist had all had that diagnosis
absolutely refuted. There are a couple of other symptoms that again everyone
on the forum also has. These are that although there is absolutely nothing
wrong with the functionality of the knee for any condition other than
kneeling, if you stop and think about how the bad knee feels with respect to
the good one, something definitely feels not *quite* right, but it is faint,
and subtle. The other symptom is that there is a small patch of skin above
the area that hurts when you kneel, where there is reduced feeling. Also,
you can't provoke the pain by prodding anywhere, but the slightest kneeling
pressure is excruciating. Kneel on a cushion or on the 'side' of the knee
though, and nothing at all. It really is very strange ... :-\

Arfa

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
news


"Andy Champ" wrote in message
. uk...
On 24/06/2012 10:25, ss wrote:
On 24/06/2012 02:32, scorched wrote:
it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom

Maybe not the same issue but I used to do a lot of motorbike repairs
over Winter on my bikes, I found after a day one of my knees started to
swell and give a lot of pain and it would take a couple of weeks to get
back to normal. The doc said take a couple of Ibuprofen the day before
you start (not sure of the dose now maybe 3 spread over the day) and
continue while doing the work.
It was a great help for me and I still do this if I know I will be on my
knees.


Dunno what Arfa has, but that is housemaid's knee. You may prefer one of
the other names

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prepatellar_bursitis

Andy


My first thought was 'housemaid's knee' but when I looked into that, the
symptoms are definitely not the same. AFAIK, that is also a repetitive
strain type injury caused by a lifetime of working on your knees, hence
its 'common' name. I have only worked on my knees on a few DIY occasions,
and certainly not recently, the last time being when I spent a couple of
weeks building that counter in our burger joint about a year ago now. Many
of the people on the forum also said that they had thought that it might
be that, and some had even had that condition diagnosed by their doctors,
but the ones who had gone on to see a specialist had all had that
diagnosis absolutely refuted. There are a couple of other symptoms that
again everyone on the forum also has. These are that although there is
absolutely nothing wrong with the functionality of the knee for any
condition other than kneeling, if you stop and think about how the bad
knee feels with respect to the good one, something definitely feels not
*quite* right, but it is faint, and subtle. The other symptom is that
there is a small patch of skin above the area that hurts when you kneel,
where there is reduced feeling. Also, you can't provoke the pain by
prodding anywhere, but the slightest kneeling pressure is excruciating.
Kneel on a cushion or on the 'side' of the knee though, and nothing at
all. It really is very strange ... :-\


One strategy - buy some of those work trousers from Screwfix which have
pockets at the knee for cushion pads.
I have been trouble by bursitis but these seem to protect my knees whilst
working.

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...

"Arfa Daily" wrote in message
news


"Andy Champ" wrote in message
. uk...
On 24/06/2012 10:25, ss wrote:
On 24/06/2012 02:32, scorched wrote:
it
developed a problem such that if you kneel on it, you get a pain
like
having a glass shard in the side towards the bottom

Maybe not the same issue but I used to do a lot of motorbike repairs
over Winter on my bikes, I found after a day one of my knees started to
swell and give a lot of pain and it would take a couple of weeks to get
back to normal. The doc said take a couple of Ibuprofen the day before
you start (not sure of the dose now maybe 3 spread over the day) and
continue while doing the work.
It was a great help for me and I still do this if I know I will be on
my
knees.


Dunno what Arfa has, but that is housemaid's knee. You may prefer one of
the other names

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prepatellar_bursitis

Andy


My first thought was 'housemaid's knee' but when I looked into that, the
symptoms are definitely not the same. AFAIK, that is also a repetitive
strain type injury caused by a lifetime of working on your knees, hence
its 'common' name. I have only worked on my knees on a few DIY occasions,
and certainly not recently, the last time being when I spent a couple of
weeks building that counter in our burger joint about a year ago now.
Many of the people on the forum also said that they had thought that it
might be that, and some had even had that condition diagnosed by their
doctors, but the ones who had gone on to see a specialist had all had
that diagnosis absolutely refuted. There are a couple of other symptoms
that again everyone on the forum also has. These are that although there
is absolutely nothing wrong with the functionality of the knee for any
condition other than kneeling, if you stop and think about how the bad
knee feels with respect to the good one, something definitely feels not
*quite* right, but it is faint, and subtle. The other symptom is that
there is a small patch of skin above the area that hurts when you kneel,
where there is reduced feeling. Also, you can't provoke the pain by
prodding anywhere, but the slightest kneeling pressure is excruciating.
Kneel on a cushion or on the 'side' of the knee though, and nothing at
all. It really is very strange ... :-\


One strategy - buy some of those work trousers from Screwfix which have
pockets at the knee for cushion pads.
I have been trouble by bursitis but these seem to protect my knees whilst
working.

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

Well, now. Here's where it gets curiouser and curiouser ... Today, I dropped
a screw in the workshop, and without thinking, knelt straight down to pick
it up. As my knee hit the floor, I realised my mistake, and my brain was
already screaming PAIN !!! and my face was screwing up ready. But here's the
deal. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It felt as normal as the other side. Just
two days ago, it was still there bad as ever. Now ? Gone ...

I really can't make head or tail of it.

Arfa

Well, now. Here's where it gets curiouser and curiouser ... Today, I dropped
a screw in the workshop, and without thinking, knelt straight down to pick
it up. As my knee hit the floor, I realised my mistake, and my brain was
already screaming PAIN !!! and my face was screwing up ready. But here's the
deal. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It felt as normal as the other side. Just
two days ago, it was still there bad as ever. Now ? Gone ...

I really can't make head or tail of it.

Arfa


I get some rather odd things in finger joints. Come on all of a sudden
and without any obvious cause, not like lifting anything heavy or
similar.

Rather painful. Then lasts for a couple of days or so then just
disappears!....

--
Tony Sayer

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...

Well, now. Here's where it gets curiouser and curiouser ... Today, I
dropped
a screw in the workshop, and without thinking, knelt straight down to pick
it up. As my knee hit the floor, I realised my mistake, and my brain was
already screaming PAIN !!! and my face was screwing up ready. But here's
the
deal. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It felt as normal as the other side.
Just
two days ago, it was still there bad as ever. Now ? Gone ...

I really can't make head or tail of it.

Arfa


I get some rather odd things in finger joints. Come on all of a sudden
and without any obvious cause, not like lifting anything heavy or
similar.

Rather painful. Then lasts for a couple of days or so then just
disappears!....

--
Tony Sayer


I guess we're just getting old, Tony ... :-)

Arfa

In article , Arfa Daily
scribeth thus


"tony sayer" wrote in message
...

Well, now. Here's where it gets curiouser and curiouser ... Today, I
dropped
a screw in the workshop, and without thinking, knelt straight down to pick
it up. As my knee hit the floor, I realised my mistake, and my brain was
already screaming PAIN !!! and my face was screwing up ready. But here's
the
deal. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It felt as normal as the other side.
Just
two days ago, it was still there bad as ever. Now ? Gone ...

I really can't make head or tail of it.

Arfa


I get some rather odd things in finger joints. Come on all of a sudden
and without any obvious cause, not like lifting anything heavy or
similar.

Rather painful. Then lasts for a couple of days or so then just
disappears!....

--
Tony Sayer


I guess we're just getting old, Tony ... :-)

Arfa


Guess;?, Guess!?? Bl^^dy well know so Arfa;!...
--
Tony Sayer

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , Arfa Daily
scribeth thus


"tony sayer" wrote in message
...

Well, now. Here's where it gets curiouser and curiouser ... Today, I
dropped
a screw in the workshop, and without thinking, knelt straight down to
pick
it up. As my knee hit the floor, I realised my mistake, and my brain was
already screaming PAIN !!! and my face was screwing up ready. But here's
the
deal. Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It felt as normal as the other side.
Just
two days ago, it was still there bad as ever. Now ? Gone ...

I really can't make head or tail of it.

Arfa


I get some rather odd things in finger joints. Come on all of a sudden
and without any obvious cause, not like lifting anything heavy or
similar.

Rather painful. Then lasts for a couple of days or so then just
disappears!....

--
Tony Sayer


I guess we're just getting old, Tony ... :-)

Arfa


Guess;?, Guess!?? Bl^^dy well know so Arfa;!...
--
Tony Sayer



It's hard when you really are getting old, but still 20 in your head ... I
hit 58 this year, which didn't seem so bad until I suddenly thought that
when you add just another ten years to that, I'll be nearly 70 ! I know lots
of people are still very good at that age - my mother was one - but a lot of
people are also getting very decrepit at around that figure. Although my
father went on for a lot of years after that age, he was never really well.
I've never been 'properly' ill my entire adult life, which is why when
things like this start happening, it's all the more concerning that this is
the shape of things to come. You could actually get quite depressed about it
if you didn't have a generally sunny outlook on life ...

Arfa

Rather painful. Then lasts for a couple of days or so then just
disappears!....

--
Tony Sayer


I guess we're just getting old, Tony ... :-)

Arfa


Guess;?, Guess!?? Bl^^dy well know so Arfa;!...
--
Tony Sayer



It's hard when you really are getting old, but still 20 in your head ... I
hit 58 this year, which didn't seem so bad until I suddenly thought that
when you add just another ten years to that, I'll be nearly 70 ! I know lots
of people are still very good at that age - my mother was one - but a lot of
people are also getting very decrepit at around that figure. Although my
father went on for a lot of years after that age, he was never really well.
I've never been 'properly' ill my entire adult life, which is why when
things like this start happening, it's all the more concerning that this is
the shape of things to come. You could actually get quite depressed about it
if you didn't have a generally sunny outlook on life ...

Quite .. my thoughts exactly.

As time goes by;!...

Arfa


--
Tony Sayer