Bill Wright wrote
Dave Liquorice wrote
Chris J Dixon wrote

Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?
Tom Tom does that. However, unless you then define some waypoints
on that route, it can change its mind as you drive.

My TomTom only changes it's mind when I miss a turn, make a
deliberate decision to leave the route or drive on a new bit of road
it doesn't know about.

Satnavs need a 'common sense' filter.

They have that, the user.

When you ask for the quickest route sometimes they opt for a route that's 1 minute quicker but ten miles further.

You can always compare the distance with the quickest and shortest route.

The lady in my satnav is called Gertie.

I've reported you to the RSPCFTRSE, you'll be sorree...

MuddyMike wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a second lorry
from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the industrial estate they
were looking for, then he showed me the address on his delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

Bill

On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 19:18:59 +0000, Bill Wright wrote:

MuddyMike wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a second
lorry from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the industrial
estate they were looking for, then he showed me the address on his
delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

The famous one was St Ives...and St Ives....!

--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 05:56:03 +1100, Rod Speed wrote:

Bill Wright wrote
Dave Liquorice wrote
Chris J Dixon wrote

Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?
Tom Tom does that. However, unless you then define some waypoints on
that route, it can change its mind as you drive.

My TomTom only changes it's mind when I miss a turn, make a deliberate
decision to leave the route or drive on a new bit of road it doesn't
know about.

Satnavs need a 'common sense' filter.

They have that, the user.

When you ask for the quickest route sometimes they opt for a route
that's 1 minute quicker but ten miles further.

You can always compare the distance with the quickest and shortest
route.

The lady in my satnav is called Gertie.

I've reported you to the RSPCFTRSE, you'll be sorree...

I'm sure dennis has already done that - he's the local snitch.



--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

In article , Bill Wright
wrote:
MuddyMike wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a second
lorry from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the industrial
estate they were looking for, then he showed me the address on his
delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

and, ISTR, the tv relay at World's End. This was in london , but I think
there'sa another Worlds End a couple of hundred miles away.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.16

On 25/02/2012 12:35, Davey wrote:
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 11:31:18 +0000
Bill wrote:

Davey wrote:


I wish you would give lectures to the lorry drivers around here.
"You use a map? What's that for?"


I had one knock on my door, map in hand. Could I tell him the way to
Maltby? He'd been given the map but had no idea how to use it and I
guess he thought that I might be able to look at it and thus give him
directions. I rested the map on a car bonnet and pointed to where we
were and started to show him the route he needed to take, but he made
it plain that he just couldn't understand. I was aghast. It emerged
that he really had no idea at all about using a map. Didn't seem to
grasp that it was a representation on paper of the surface of the
planet. He needed directions, as in 'Go to the end of the road and
turn left, then take the second right...'.

Bill

I don't think they teach map reading nowadays. Just as they don't teach
history, geography, English, anything competitive.....

They didn't teach map reading in my day either, but it doesn't stop me
being pretty good at it. These days I do prefer the satnav though, as
once you get down to navigating in a built up area, it's far easier than
trying to remember a series of turns, road names, etc. and trying to
read (sometimes non-existant) road names while driving. You don't have
to find somewhere to stop to look at the detail in your A-Z again to
refresh your memory either!

The usual directions involve pubs and churches, although there are few
pubs left now. I grew up in the village of Chigwell, frequented
(earlier) by Dickens, and it had the church, the pub and the school all
at the 'T' junction which defined the village centre.

I had a couple of holidays on the Norfolk Broads and the navigation
seemed to consist almost enitirely of windmills and pubs as landmarks -
the latter being very handy.

SteveW

On 25/02/2012 19:41, Bob Eager wrote:
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 19:18:59 +0000, Bill Wright wrote:

MuddyMike wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a second
lorry from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the industrial
estate they were looking for, then he showed me the address on his
delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

The famous one was St Ives...and St Ives....!

Not satnav related, but when wanting particular items and searching on
the internet for shops that may sell them, it's very hard to find any in
the town of "Sale"

SteveW

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...

I'm sure dennis has already done that - he's the local snitch.

If you think you can make me feel bad about reporting crime you are wasting
your time.
The fact that you say things like that just shows what a pratt you are.

Steve Walker wrote
Davey wrote
Bill wrote
Davey wrote

I wish you would give lectures to the lorry drivers around here.
"You use a map? What's that for?"

I had one knock on my door, map in hand. Could I tell him the way to
Maltby? He'd been given the map but had no idea how to use it and I
guess he thought that I might be able to look at it and thus give
him directions. I rested the map on a car bonnet and pointed to
where we were and started to show him the route he needed to take,
but he made it plain that he just couldn't understand. I was
aghast. It emerged that he really had no idea at all about using a
map. Didn't seem to grasp that it was a representation on paper of
the surface of the planet. He needed directions, as in 'Go to the
end of the road and turn left, then take the second right...'.

I don't think they teach map reading nowadays. Just as they don't
teach history, geography, English, anything competitive.....

They didn't teach map reading in my day either,

Me neither.

but it doesn't stop me being pretty good at it.

Yeah, its another those things that some find a lot easier than others do, like maths etc.

These days I do prefer the satnav though,

Yeah, I'd never voluntarily go back to paper maps again unless there was no alternative.

as once you get down to navigating in a built up area, it's far easier
than trying to remember a series of turns, road names, etc. and
trying to read (sometimes non-existant) road names while driving.

Yeah. One of our citys did have a system of numbered major routes
so you could make up a list of the numbered routes before starting
and just follow that, but a satnav leaves that for dead.

You don't have to find somewhere to stop to look at the detail in your
A-Z again to refresh your memory either!

Yep.

The usual directions involve pubs and churches, although there are
few pubs left now. I grew up in the village of Chigwell, frequented
(earlier) by Dickens, and it had the church, the pub and the school
all at the 'T' junction which defined the village centre.

I had a couple of holidays on the Norfolk Broads and the navigation
seemed to consist almost enitirely of windmills and pubs as landmarks
- the latter being very handy.

Tim Streater wrote
Steve Walker wrote
Davey wrote

I don't think they teach map reading nowadays. Just as they don't teach history, geography, English, anything
competitive.....

They didn't teach map reading in my day either, but it doesn't stop me being pretty good at it.

Exactly.

Its a lot easier for some than other, like lots of things.

These days I do prefer the satnav though, as
once you get down to navigating in a built up area, it's far easier
than trying to remember a series of turns, road names, etc. and
trying to read (sometimes non-existant) road names while driving.

This is the only time a satnav serves any purpose, if you are driving with someone else.

No it isnt. Mate of mine recons it also eliminates a lot of
arguments when more than one person is in the car too.

On your own, it's marginally more handy.

Thats just plain wrong. Its much more handy than trying to
remember anything more than a trivial route and watching
out for the sometimes quite inadequate signage as he said.

Its also a hell of a lot quicker to just punch in the destination
on the satnav and do what it says than to plan the route with
a paper map in an area you know nothing about too.

Steve Walker wrote
Bob Eager wrote
Bill Wright wrote
MuddyMike wrote

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a
second lorry from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the
industrial estate they were looking for, then he showed me the
address on his delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

The famous one was St Ives...and St Ives....!

Not satnav related, but when wanting particular items and searching on the internet for shops that may sell them, it's
very hard to find any in the town of "Sale"

Nope, not with google shopping with your location set properly.

"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
Tim Streater wrote
Steve Walker wrote
Davey wrote

I don't think they teach map reading nowadays. Just as they don't teach
history, geography, English, anything competitive.....

They didn't teach map reading in my day either, but it doesn't stop me
being pretty good at it.

Exactly.

Its a lot easier for some than other, like lots of things.

These days I do prefer the satnav though, as
once you get down to navigating in a built up area, it's far easier
than trying to remember a series of turns, road names, etc. and
trying to read (sometimes non-existant) road names while driving.

This is the only time a satnav serves any purpose, if you are driving
with someone else.

No it isnt. Mate of mine recons it also eliminates a lot of
arguments when more than one person is in the car too.

On your own, it's marginally more handy.

Thats just plain wrong. Its much more handy than trying to
remember anything more than a trivial route and watching
out for the sometimes quite inadequate signage as he said.

Its also a hell of a lot quicker to just punch in the destination
on the satnav and do what it says than to plan the route with
a paper map in an area you know nothing about too.


Even more so with a tomtom live device as it really does know where the
queues are and can avoid them.
The latest can find destinations using google and other search engines too.
I'm not so sure about being able to tweet from them though.

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 05:52:04 +1100, Rod Speed wrote:

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of something
you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is Argos. A
catlogue showroom place so you can't play or really examine any of
the goods before purchase. There exclusions for things like
toiletries and software.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 05:52:04 +1100, Rod Speed wrote:

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of something
you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is Argos. A
catlogue showroom place so you can't play or really examine any of
the goods before purchase. There exclusions for things like
toiletries and software.

And sat navs.

dennis@home wrote
Dave Liquorice wrote
Rod Speed wrote

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of something you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is Argos. A catlogue showroom place so you can't play or
really examine any of the goods before purchase. There exclusions for things like toiletries and software.

And sat navs.

No exclusions for satnavs here.

I have bought from those operations when I'm not absolutely
certain that its what I want. Its handy to be able to read the
manual and decide that some aspect of it isnt what you want
or that its just too damned counter intuitive to be worth it etc.

I dont use the full refund very often, but it is handy when I do.

"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
dennis@home wrote
Dave Liquorice wrote
Rod Speed wrote

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of something
you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is Argos. A
catlogue showroom place so you can't play or really examine any of the
goods before purchase. There exclusions for things like toiletries and
software.

And sat navs.

No exclusions for satnavs here.

Well I just looked at a tomtom and its excluded from the 30 day money back
guaranty

On 24/02/2012 9:36 PM, Jim Hawkins wrote:
Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?
I'd like one that would show me how it was proposing
to get me to a destination before I committed to following it.
Can you do that with any of them ?
And can you start the plot from somewhere other than the place where you
happen to be at that moment ?
I'm thinking of buying one, but I'm finding it difficult to find out from
the sales blurbs exactly what you can and can't do with them.

Jim Hawkins




TT has always let you do that ... use itineraries.

However a neater way is that I sue Microsoft Autoroute on PC .. very
easy to use.
I click on start & end points, drop a few 'vias', let it plot route then
drag the route to alternate roads if I want (avoid tolls for example)
Save the route as a .itn file and then drop it into TT and open it up
as itinerary ... route fully planned.

On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 23:48:15 +0000
Rick wrote:

On 24/02/2012 9:36 PM, Jim Hawkins wrote:
Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?
I'd like one that would show me how it was proposing
to get me to a destination before I committed to following it.
Can you do that with any of them ?
And can you start the plot from somewhere other than the place
where you happen to be at that moment ?
I'm thinking of buying one, but I'm finding it difficult to find
out from the sales blurbs exactly what you can and can't do with
them.

Jim Hawkins




TT has always let you do that ... use itineraries.

However a neater way is that I sue Microsoft Autoroute on PC .. very
easy to use.

I appreciate your unintended mis-spelling of 'use'.
--
Davey.

In article ,
Rod Speed wrote:
Tom Tom does that. However, unless you then define some
waypoints on that route, it can change its mind as you drive.

Not unless you deviate from the route its telling you to use.

My new one does if it gets reports of bad traffic etc on the original
route.

--
*A person who smiles in the face of adversity probably has a scapegoat *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 25/02/2012 18:36, Rod Speed wrote:
Lobster wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Bill Wright wrote
Jim Hawkins wrote

Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?

I normally decide on my route using a paper map

I use maps.google myself, much more convenient than a paper map.

But thats only with the garage/yard sale run because I dont know where all the garage/yard sales are located and you
need to know that to
specify the order in the itinerary. I dont know of any satnav that you can just enter all the garage/yard sales into
the itinerary in any order with their start times and have the satnav sort the itinerary appropriately.

Even maps.google cant do that.

If anyone knows of an online mapping service that can, I'd love to hear about it.

then feed it into the satnav,

There are converters from a maps.google route to most satnavs.

Where/how?

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=%2...mtom%20convert

- that sounds really good. I'd much prefer to be able to plot my route on google maps where you can see what's going
on, rather than fiddling about on my TomTom, where zooming in and out of maps is (IMHO) almost impossible

Not so much almost impossible, just rather unintuitive and nothing like as
convenient as with maps.google.

Well, on my TomTom (quite old) you zoom in and out of maps via a slider
bar on the right hand side (very fiddly in itself); trying to do that to
view a trip of several hundred miles at high scale I certainly rate as
"almost impossible" But what are these converters from
maps.google.com to satnavs you mentioned?

David

On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 19:18:59 +0000, Bill Wright
wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a second lorry
from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the industrial estate they
were looking for, then he showed me the address on his delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

My company had a driver who trundled off to Brent Cross instead of
Brentwood, but later the same year the idiot bimbled his merry way to
Cheltenham not Chelmsford.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote
Rod Speed wrote

Tom Tom does that. However, unless you then define some
waypoints on that route, it can change its mind as you drive.

Not unless you deviate from the route its telling you to use.

My new one does if it gets reports of bad traffic etc on the original route.

True.

Lobster wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Lobster wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Bill Wright wrote
Jim Hawkins wrote

Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?

I normally decide on my route using a paper map

I use maps.google myself, much more convenient than a paper map.

But thats only with the garage/yard sale run because I dont know
where all the garage/yard sales are located and you need to know
that to specify the order in the itinerary. I dont know of any satnav that you can just enter all the garage/yard
sales into the itinerary in
any order with their start times and have the satnav sort the
itinerary appropriately.

Even maps.google cant do that.

If anyone knows of an online mapping service that can, I'd love to hear about it.

then feed it into the satnav,

There are converters from a maps.google route to most satnavs.

Where/how?

http://www.google.com.au/search?q=%2...mtom%20convert

- that sounds really good. I'd much prefer to be able to plot my
route on google maps where you can see what's going on, rather than fiddling about on my TomTom, where zooming in
and out of maps is (IMHO) almost impossible

Not so much almost impossible, just rather unintuitive and nothing
like as convenient as with maps.google.

Well, on my TomTom (quite old) you zoom in and out of maps via a slider bar on the right hand side (very fiddly in
itself);

Yeah, thats what I meant.

trying to do that to view a trip of several hundred miles at high scale I certainly rate as "almost impossible"

I havent found it almost impossible with the garage/yard sale
itinerarys when someone else has asked me where a particular
garage/yard sale actually is, when their satnav doesnt have that
place available and I need to say where it is off roads they do have.

Just awkward and a bit fiddly to use.

But what are these converters from maps.google.com to satnavs you mentioned?

You basically just setup an itinerary on maps.google, save that on whatever you
are using maps.google on, convert it to the .itn for the tomtom using whatever
converter you prefer, there are a few available, and then load that into your tomtom.

They just convert from one itinerary format to another,

"Jim Hawkins" wrote in message
m...

Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?
I'd like one that would show me how it was proposing
to get me to a destination before I committed to following it.
Can you do that with any of them ?
And can you start the plot from somewhere other than the place where you
happen to be at that moment ?
I'm thinking of buying one, but I'm finding it difficult to find out from
the sales blurbs exactly what you can and can't do with them.

Jim Hawkins

------------------------
There are some programs that allow you to plan a route on the PC and
download it to the Satnav. TomTom have one of their own (see the link on the
tomtom.com website but a better way might be to use Google maps where you
can drag the route to alter it and then down load it to your device with
programs like Tyre. Others are available if you Google "tomtom intinerary
converter". I haven't used then myself but I believe they are fairly easy
to use. Google maps also allows you to view parts of the route in Streetview
if you want to see what it looks like.

John M

In article ,
wrote:
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 19:18:59 +0000, Bill Wright
wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a second lorry
from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the industrial estate they
were looking for, then he showed me the address on his delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

My company had a driver who trundled off to Brent Cross instead of
Brentwood, but later the same year the idiot bimbled his merry way to
Cheltenham not Chelmsford.

I doubt if he could pass a current driving test if he couldn't read for
whatever reason.

--
*Prepositions are not words to end sentences with *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message ,
writes
On Fri, 24 Feb 2012 21:36:30 -0000, "Jim Hawkins"
wrote:

Are there any sat-navs that let you plot a route before you go ?

I noticed the included sat-nav on my phone will do that. Type in a
destination and drag the display along the route it outlines.

Not that I've used it, having not bought the phone for that purpose.

I do have a sat nav, but often as not now I will use the Google Maps
Navigation function on my Android smartphone for a bit of quick and
dirty navigation. Just cos it's handier really for a quick bit of
navigation. It's gets a sat lock pretty much instantly (presumably cos
it knows pretty much where it is from the cell towers), the google map
search is much quicker and easier than inputting on the satnav. And it
does have an attempt to show which bits of the route have got traffic
delays (I know that some new satnavs can do this sort of thing as well)

The main limitation is that you can't use way points or get it to give
alternate routes (unlike the desktop googlemaps). and of course you need
a 3G connection. Though it seems to do some pre caching of maps, as even
when it loses 3G for a bit it still seems to show the maps fine.
--
Chris French

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
wrote:
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 19:18:59 +0000, Bill Wright
wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a
second lorry from the same firm behind. I had never heard of
the industrial estate they were looking for, then he showed me
the address on his delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

My company had a driver who trundled off to Brent Cross instead of
Brentwood, but later the same year the idiot bimbled his merry way
to Cheltenham not Chelmsford.

I doubt if he could pass a current driving test if he couldn't read
for whatever reason.

I know someone who failed his theory test as he could not find the exam
cent-)

--
Adam

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 11:12:58 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


My company had a driver who trundled off to Brent Cross instead of
Brentwood, but later the same year the idiot bimbled his merry way to
Cheltenham not Chelmsford.

I doubt if he could pass a current driving test if he couldn't read for
whatever reason.

It wasn't that he couldn't read - he didn't listen. The POD form would
be handed to him with the address on it, but he'd already been told
where the pickup/deliver was and instead of checking the written
version, would head off into the sunset...

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 11:18:39 +0000, chris French
wrote:

I noticed the included sat-nav on my phone will do that. Type in a
destination and drag the display along the route it outlines.

Not that I've used it, having not bought the phone for that purpose.

I do have a sat nav, but often as not now I will use the Google Maps
Navigation function on my Android smartphone for a bit of quick and
dirty navigation. Just cos it's handier really for a quick bit of
navigation. It's gets a sat lock pretty much instantly (presumably cos
it knows pretty much where it is from the cell towers), the google map
search is much quicker and easier than inputting on the satnav. And it
does have an attempt to show which bits of the route have got traffic
delays (I know that some new satnavs can do this sort of thing as well)

The main limitation is that you can't use way points or get it to give
alternate routes (unlike the desktop googlemaps). and of course you need
a 3G connection. Though it seems to do some pre caching of maps, as even
when it loses 3G for a bit it still seems to show the maps fine.

I used mine for the first time yesterday on a route I take frequently
- 40 miles in which it didn't put a foot wrong, including the
alternate route I knew was shortest, and when I deviated for a spot of
camera work it nagged me about a wrong turn then after a km started
giving me new directions via the road I was now on. One sticky moment
came when I stopped in a town along the way; having parked up next to
a pub, on a dead end road next to sheltered housing, it insisted I
could rejoin the route by driving through a pensioner's living room.
I'm mildly impressed and might use it again, but it works quite well,
although basic.
I still prefer maps though - a decent map provides a much better
overview.

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 12:59:17 +0000
wrote:

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 11:18:39 +0000, chris French
wrote:

I noticed the included sat-nav on my phone will do that. Type in a
destination and drag the display along the route it outlines.

Not that I've used it, having not bought the phone for that purpose.

I do have a sat nav, but often as not now I will use the Google Maps
Navigation function on my Android smartphone for a bit of quick and
dirty navigation. Just cos it's handier really for a quick bit of
navigation. It's gets a sat lock pretty much instantly (presumably
cos it knows pretty much where it is from the cell towers), the
google map search is much quicker and easier than inputting on the
satnav. And it does have an attempt to show which bits of the route
have got traffic delays (I know that some new satnavs can do this
sort of thing as well)

The main limitation is that you can't use way points or get it to
give alternate routes (unlike the desktop googlemaps). and of course
you need a 3G connection. Though it seems to do some pre caching of
maps, as even when it loses 3G for a bit it still seems to show the
maps fine.

I used mine for the first time yesterday on a route I take frequently
- 40 miles in which it didn't put a foot wrong, including the
alternate route I knew was shortest, and when I deviated for a spot of
camera work it nagged me about a wrong turn then after a km started
giving me new directions via the road I was now on. One sticky moment
came when I stopped in a town along the way; having parked up next to
a pub, on a dead end road next to sheltered housing, it insisted I
could rejoin the route by driving through a pensioner's living room.

That's our scenario, except for the pensioner bit. The
TomTom-following lorry drivers try to make a turn which they can't, and
end up with their front bumper where our fence post was until they got
there. The living room is a foot further. Someday, we're going to be
looking at a headlight instead of our TV set.
The house has been here for hundreds of years, we're not moving it!
--
Davey.

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 11:12:58 +0000 (GMT)
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

In article ,
wrote:
On Sat, 25 Feb 2012 19:18:59 +0000, Bill Wright
wrote:

I was asked for direction in Norwich by a lorry driver with a
second lorry from the same firm behind. I had never heard of the
industrial estate they were looking for, then he showed me the
address on his delivery note.

It was for Northwich some 210 miles away!

Similar thing here a few years back. Epworth and Hepworth.

My company had a driver who trundled off to Brent Cross instead of
Brentwood, but later the same year the idiot bimbled his merry way
to Cheltenham not Chelmsford.

I doubt if he could pass a current driving test if he couldn't read
for whatever reason.

'Reading' and 'Comprehension' are different subjects.
I won a German Reading Prize at school, but I didn't know what the
words meant, that wasn't the point. I was able to read a piece of
previously-unseen prose correctly.
--
Davey.

On 25/02/2012 23:20, dennis@home wrote:


"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
dennis@home wrote
Dave Liquorice wrote
Rod Speed wrote

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of
something you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is Argos. A
catlogue showroom place so you can't play or really examine any of
the goods before purchase. There exclusions for things like
toiletries and software.

And sat navs.

No exclusions for satnavs here.

Well I just looked at a tomtom and its excluded from the 30 day money
back guaranty

Correct. I bought my wife a cheap Satnav at Christmas and they
specifically told me that it was excluded from the 14-day return and in
addition any faults after that would mean it being sent back to the
manufacturer, not swapped for another from stock.

SteveW

Davey wrote:
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 12:59:17 +0000
wrote:

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 11:18:39 +0000, chris French
wrote:

I noticed the included sat-nav on my phone will do that. Type in a
destination and drag the display along the route it outlines.

Not that I've used it, having not bought the phone for that
purpose.

I do have a sat nav, but often as not now I will use the Google Maps
Navigation function on my Android smartphone for a bit of quick and
dirty navigation. Just cos it's handier really for a quick bit of
navigation. It's gets a sat lock pretty much instantly (presumably
cos it knows pretty much where it is from the cell towers), the
google map search is much quicker and easier than inputting on the
satnav. And it does have an attempt to show which bits of the route
have got traffic delays (I know that some new satnavs can do this
sort of thing as well)

The main limitation is that you can't use way points or get it to
give alternate routes (unlike the desktop googlemaps). and of course
you need a 3G connection. Though it seems to do some pre caching of
maps, as even when it loses 3G for a bit it still seems to show the
maps fine.

I used mine for the first time yesterday on a route I take frequently
- 40 miles in which it didn't put a foot wrong, including the
alternate route I knew was shortest, and when I deviated for a spot
of camera work it nagged me about a wrong turn then after a km
started giving me new directions via the road I was now on. One
sticky moment came when I stopped in a town along the way; having
parked up next to a pub, on a dead end road next to sheltered
housing, it insisted I could rejoin the route by driving through a
pensioner's living room.

That's our scenario, except for the pensioner bit. The
TomTom-following lorry drivers try to make a turn which they can't,
and end up with their front bumper where our fence post was until
they got there. The living room is a foot further. Someday, we're
going to be looking at a headlight instead of our TV set.
The house has been here for hundreds of years, we're not moving it!

You may well not be moving it, but some truck may well do some day.

"Davey" wrote in message
...

That's our scenario, except for the pensioner bit. The
TomTom-following lorry drivers try to make a turn which they can't, and
end up with their front bumper where our fence post was until they got
there. The living room is a foot further. Someday, we're going to be
looking at a headlight instead of our TV set.
The house has been here for hundreds of years, we're not moving it!

You need an RSJ for a fence post.
Or maybe an anti tank ditch.

Steve Walker wrote:
On 25/02/2012 23:20, dennis@home wrote:


"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
dennis@home wrote
Dave Liquorice wrote
Rod Speed wrote

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of
something you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is
Argos. A catlogue showroom place so you can't play or really
examine any of the goods before purchase. There exclusions
for things like toiletries and software.

And sat navs.

No exclusions for satnavs here.

Well I just looked at a tomtom and its excluded from the 30 day
money back guaranty

Correct. I bought my wife a cheap Satnav at Christmas and they
specifically told me that it was excluded from the 14-day return and
in addition any faults after that would mean it being sent back to the
manufacturer, not swapped for another from stock.

They are the sort of rules that got me banned from the Doncaster branch of
B&Q.

--
Adam

On 26/02/2012 19:07, dennis@home wrote:


"Davey" wrote in message
...

That's our scenario, except for the pensioner bit. The
TomTom-following lorry drivers try to make a turn which they can't, and
end up with their front bumper where our fence post was until they got
there. The living room is a foot further. Someday, we're going to be
looking at a headlight instead of our TV set.
The house has been here for hundreds of years, we're not moving it!

You need an RSJ for a fence post.
Or maybe an anti tank ditch.

Or an anti-tank mine!

SteveW

ARWadsworth wrote:

in addition any faults after that would mean it being sent back to the
manufacturer, not swapped for another from stock.

They are the sort of rules that got me banned from the Doncaster branch of
B&Q.

They just can't make up rules like that. They have to obey the law.

Bill

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 19:52:55 +0000, Steve Walker wrote:

On 26/02/2012 19:07, dennis@home wrote:


"Davey" wrote in message
...

That's our scenario, except for the pensioner bit. The
TomTom-following lorry drivers try to make a turn which they can't,
and end up with their front bumper where our fence post was until they
got there. The living room is a foot further. Someday, we're going to
be looking at a headlight instead of our TV set. The house has been
here for hundreds of years, we're not moving it!

You need an RSJ for a fence post.
Or maybe an anti tank ditch.

Or an anti-tank mine!

A while ago, there was someone on here who was always getting one of his
fence posts mangled by an (unknown) neighbour using an adjacent shared
driveway, to a car park at the back I think.

He was planning to replace it with a steel one made to look like wood. He
never did come back and tell us how well it worked - presumably he would
have identified the neighbour by the mangled car...



--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 20:14:59 +0000, Bill Wright wrote:

ARWadsworth wrote:

in addition any faults after that would mean it being sent back to the
manufacturer, not swapped for another from stock.

They are the sort of rules that got me banned from the Doncaster branch
of B&Q.

They just can't make up rules like that. They have to obey the law.

And the thing to do is go in and argue - on a Saturday morning!



--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 26/02/2012 19:09, ARWadsworth wrote:
Steve Walker wrote:
On 25/02/2012 23:20, dennis@home wrote:


"Rod wrote in message
...
dennis@home wrote
Dave wrote
Rod Speed wrote

A couple of our operations allow you to do a free return of
something you buy and find you dont like,

Places here do, the one that springs imediatly to mind is
Argos. A catlogue showroom place so you can't play or really
examine any of the goods before purchase. There exclusions
for things like toiletries and software.

And sat navs.

No exclusions for satnavs here.

Well I just looked at a tomtom and its excluded from the 30 day
money back guaranty

Correct. I bought my wife a cheap Satnav at Christmas and they
specifically told me that it was excluded from the 14-day return and
in addition any faults after that would mean it being sent back to the
manufacturer, not swapped for another from stock.

They are the sort of rules that got me banned from the Doncaster branch of
B&Q.

For complaining too loudly / aggressively?

Luckily when I've been driven to that stage, I've usually managed to
have enough interested customers listening in that management have
sorted out my problems quickly (and usually to my advantage) so as not
to put other customers off.

One occassion was going to Halfords for something I needed urgently on a
Sunday, in my oily overalls and nipping into Comet next door to demand
to see a manager, as all week they'd been telling me on the phone that
the manager was out and the deputy manager was busy, but would call me
back. I stood at the tills comlaining loudly about an item damaged in
transit, lack of return calls, having to interrupt work on my car to try
and talk to someone, etc. with a long group of potential customers
behind me. Amazingly the manager was quickly found and a more than
agreeable sum was paid to me in short order. IIRC £50 off a £200
dishwasher, when the damage was to the side panel, which would be up
against the cupboard - I just didn't see why I should pay full price for
a damaged item, even if it didn't really affect me.

Another was having had a brand new trailer suspension unit fail on me
(fortunately on the return journey from a holiday in France and less
than half an hour before the breakdown cover expired, over a 150 miles
from home). Towsure didn't want to know, but again having made a fuss in
front of a number of customers, the manager finally replaced the ball
bearing suspension units with better taper roller versions.

Unfortunately I can only complain properly when my wife is not with me,
as she gets embarrassed and interferes or has a go at me later.

SteveW