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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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OT Paper recycling question
Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass
collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. Tim |
#2
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OT Paper recycling question
On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote:
Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. Oddly enough, a mixed waste system can end up recovering more recyclables than a segregated one. It is much less bother for the householder to drop everything into one big bin than to sort it and put it into multiple bins, so more people recycle. Colin Bignell |
#3
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OT Paper recycling question
Nightjar wrote:
On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. Oddly enough, a mixed waste system can end up recovering more recyclables than a segregated one. It is much less bother for the householder to drop everything into one big bin than to sort it and put it into multiple bins, so more people recycle. Our council tells us that shredded paper is OK in our recycling bins. When I visited the sorting facility recently, it was clear that the screens they used to separate small stuff for landfill would pass any paper shreddings. I asked about this, and they said that I was correct, but they felt that it was psychologically better to encourage recycling. Chris -- Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh. |
#4
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OT Paper recycling question
On 15/02/2012 21:39 Chris J Dixon wrote:
Our council tells us that shredded paper is OK in our recycling bins. When I visited the sorting facility recently, it was clear that the screens they used to separate small stuff for landfill would pass any paper shreddings. I asked about this, and they said that I was correct, but they felt that it was psychologically better to encourage recycling. Our's says 'no shredded paper'. They say it gums up their machinery. They also don't accept glass in the recycling bin. It seems like they expect us to burn petrol to take it to them! -- F |
#5
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OT Paper recycling question
F wrote:
On 15/02/2012 21:39 Chris J Dixon wrote: Our council tells us that shredded paper is OK in our recycling bins. When I visited the sorting facility recently, it was clear that the screens they used to separate small stuff for landfill would pass any paper shreddings. I asked about this, and they said that I was correct, but they felt that it was psychologically better to encourage recycling. Our's says 'no shredded paper'. They say it gums up their machinery. They also don't accept glass in the recycling bin. It seems like they expect us to burn petrol to take it to them! The best strategy is to put it in the car, take an unusual route to work, and fly tip. Why should we play their silly game? Bill |
#6
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OT Paper recycling question
On 16/02/2012 01:28, Bill Wright wrote:
F wrote: On 15/02/2012 21:39 Chris J Dixon wrote: Our council tells us that shredded paper is OK in our recycling bins. When I visited the sorting facility recently, it was clear that the screens they used to separate small stuff for landfill would pass any paper shreddings. I asked about this, and they said that I was correct, but they felt that it was psychologically better to encourage recycling. Our's says 'no shredded paper'. They say it gums up their machinery. They also don't accept glass in the recycling bin. It seems like they expect us to burn petrol to take it to them! The best strategy is to put it in the car, take an unusual route to work, and fly tip. Why should we play their silly game? There's a difference between not playing to the rules (eg putting paper in general rubbish rather than recycling) and being an utter **** who fly tips. |
#7
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OT Paper recycling question
Our's says 'no shredded paper'.
Same here in N.London. But in the same breath they encourage us to shred bills etc to avoid identity theft :-(. But at least our waste is no longer driven all the way to Birmingham for sorting - or at least they tell us it's not. Paul DS |
#8
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OT Paper recycling question
Paul D Smith wrote:
Our's says 'no shredded paper'. Same here in N.London. But in the same breath they encourage us to shred bills etc to avoid identity theft :-(. But at least our waste is no longer driven all the way to Birmingham for sorting - or at least they tell us it's not. Paul DS No, it now goes to Tyne and Wear, where they need the jobs, instead. |
#9
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OT Paper recycling question
Chris J Dixon wrote:
Our council tells us that shredded paper is OK in our recycling bins. When I visited the sorting facility recently, it was clear that the screens they used to separate small stuff for landfill would pass any paper shreddings. I asked about this, and they said that I was correct, but they felt that it was psychologically better to encourage recycling. So they treat us like children! ******** to it! I will continue to subvert their rules. Bill |
#11
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OT Paper recycling question
"Nightjar" wrote in message ... On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. Oddly enough, a mixed waste system can end up recovering more recyclables than a segregated one. It is much less bother for the householder to drop everything into one big bin than to sort it and put it into multiple bins, so more people recycle. Probably also more cost efficient as you have to sort 'segregated' waste anyway to take out all the things that have ben incorrectly included. -- No plan survives contact with the enemy. [Not even bunny] Helmuth von Moltke the Elder (\__/) (='.'=) (")_(") |
#12
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OT Paper recycling question
Nightjar wrote:
On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. Oddly enough, a mixed waste system can end up recovering more recyclables than a segregated one. It is much less bother for the householder to drop everything into one big bin than to sort it and put it into multiple bins, so more people recycle. Colin Bignell It's all ******** anyway. They use CO2 to send the glass to China where they use it as hardcore. Total nonsense. Bill |
#13
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OT Paper recycling question
Bill Wright wrote:
It's all ******** anyway. They use CO2 to send the glass to China Where can I buy one of these CO2 powered bulk transporters? |
#14
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OT Paper recycling question
Yes, I wish our council would do this. However I gave up recycling as the
firm are a health and safety nightmare for blind people, just chucking bins and bags into the property from the street and I damn nearly broke an ankle. Brian -- Brian Gaff - Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff' in the display name may be lost. Blind user, so no pictures please! "Nightjar" wrote in message ... On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. Oddly enough, a mixed waste system can end up recovering more recyclables than a segregated one. It is much less bother for the householder to drop everything into one big bin than to sort it and put it into multiple bins, so more people recycle. Colin Bignell |
#15
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OT Paper recycling question
In article ,
Tim writes: The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. The collected glass isn't recycled - it's not viable to do so. It's ground up and used as foundations for roads and the like. It's a way of burying it in the ground without attracting landfill tax. -- Andrew Gabriel [email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup] |
#16
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OT Paper recycling question
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article , Tim writes: The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. The collected glass isn't recycled - it's not viable to do so. It's ground up and used as foundations for roads and the like. In China. Bill |
#17
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OT Paper recycling question
On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote:
Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. Our council already do that and they have a collection wagon that looks like Heath Robinson designed it. The poor guys who work on it have to manually sort the mixed junk into the right skips on the side. When one skip is full a crazy system of hydraulics and levers yanks it all high into the air and lobs it into the divided lorry sections. On a windy day the behaviour of large plastic lemonade bottles is not ideal. I always wonder what would happen if they did this underneath a phone or electricity line. They do have a separate paper feed in a blue bag, but cans, glass and plastic bottles are all in one mixed box. I pity the guys sorting it. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. To be fair our council does run very good recycling tips. The thing that kerbside collections highlight for me is how much cardboard there is (they don't collect that as it has no marginal value at all). -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#18
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OT Paper recycling question
On 16/02/2012 09:13 Martin Brown wrote:
They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. I suppose they would get *brownie* points if they went through the motions to recycle them... And they do recycle sh*t round here. To farmers. -- F |
#19
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OT Paper recycling question
On 16/02/2012 09:57, F wrote:
On 16/02/2012 09:13 Martin Brown wrote: They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. I suppose they would get *brownie* points if they went through the motions to recycle them... And they do recycle sh*t round here. To farmers. A farm about 5 miles away did that one year. You could smell it on the wind when it blew in the wrong direction. He practically made his nearby village unliveable with the smell and was black balled for it. -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#20
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OT Paper recycling question
Martin Brown wrote:
They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. To be fair our council does run very good recycling tips. The thing that kerbside collections highlight for me is how much cardboard there is (they don't collect that as it has no marginal value at all). We have a 'brown' bin which is nominally for garden waste but also allows cardboard and shredded paper which apparently goes into the compost too. -- Chris Green |
#21
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OT Paper recycling question
In article ,
Martin Brown writes: On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. Our council already do that and they have a collection wagon that looks like Heath Robinson designed it. The poor guys who work on it have to manually sort the mixed junk into the right skips on the side. When one skip is full a crazy system of hydraulics and levers yanks it all high into the air and lobs it into the divided lorry sections. On a windy day the behaviour of large plastic lemonade bottles is not ideal. I always wonder what would happen if they did this underneath a phone or electricity line. Kerbside sorting - pioneered by Islington IIRC. Not having the householder have to sort the recycle waste gets the highest recycle rate, but having workers do it at the kerbside also makes it the most expensive recycling scheme. They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. To be fair our council does run very good recycling tips. The thing that kerbside collections highlight for me is how much cardboard there is (they don't collect that as it has no marginal value at all). Ours do. It may well end up in an incinerator though. Of course, burying paper and cardboard in the ground is the opposite of digging up coal and burning it, but logic never comes in to such considerations. It's always someone's blinkered target over a holistic understanding of the whole picture. -- Andrew Gabriel [email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup] |
#22
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OT Paper recycling question
"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message ... Kerbside sorting - pioneered by Islington IIRC. Not having the householder have to sort the recycle waste gets the highest recycle rate, but having workers do it at the kerbside also makes it the most expensive recycling scheme. Not always. We can dump all our recycling in a wheelie bin that they empty weekly. It then goes to a sorting plant where much of it is separated automatically. Far cheaper than kerbside sorting and just as easy for the householder. I would suggest that Islington is wasting taxpayers cash if they are still doing it. |
#23
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OT Paper recycling question
On 16/02/2012 14:17, dennis@home wrote:
"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message ... Kerbside sorting - pioneered by Islington IIRC. Not having the householder have to sort the recycle waste gets the highest recycle rate, but having workers do it at the kerbside also makes it the most expensive recycling scheme. Not always. We can dump all our recycling in a wheelie bin that they empty weekly. It then goes to a sorting plant where much of it is separated automatically. Far cheaper than kerbside sorting and just as easy for the householder. I would suggest that Islington is wasting taxpayers cash if they are still doing it. It seems to me that the larger the city the weirder and more inconvenient for householders their waste recycling scheme. Although for my money Salford takes the biscuit with no fewer than four full size wheelie bins for every household. Household waste is black, the "green" garden waste bin is a lurid shocking pink, blue is for cardboard and paper and brown is for glass, cans and plastic. Any advance on four full size wheelie bins per household? (I have seen a few others with smaller bins of many colours) -- Regards, Martin Brown |
#24
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OT Paper recycling question
dennis@home wrote:
"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message ... Kerbside sorting - pioneered by Islington IIRC. Not having the householder have to sort the recycle waste gets the highest recycle rate, but having workers do it at the kerbside also makes it the most expensive recycling scheme. Not always. We can dump all our recycling in a wheelie bin that they empty weekly. It then goes to a sorting plant where much of it is separated automatically. Far cheaper than kerbside sorting and just as easy for the householder. I would suggest that Islington is wasting taxpayers cash if they are still doing it. Let's think about this: Chomp the waste up into crumbs and either put it in an air blower or a water bath. Either way, glass crumbs and metal sink, plastic floats and paper will float more or become slurry. Metal and glass are easily seperated by magenetic techniques - so the only two problems I can see a How to seperate grades of plastic - maybe the mix goes to some crap use that doesn't matter? How to cope with kitchen waste in the equation as IIRC Harrow do? Other council's answer to kitchen waste is to shove it in the garden waste and use composting farms that get the temperature reliably high to kill evil bugs. So I can almost see how automatic recycling seperation could be done - love to see it explained properly through. -- Tim Watts |
#25
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OT Paper recycling question
On Thu, 16 Feb 2012 11:31:28 +0000, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article , Martin Brown writes: On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. Our council already do that and they have a collection wagon that looks like Heath Robinson designed it. The poor guys who work on it have to manually sort the mixed junk into the right skips on the side. When one skip is full a crazy system of hydraulics and levers yanks it all high into the air and lobs it into the divided lorry sections. On a windy day the behaviour of large plastic lemonade bottles is not ideal. I always wonder what would happen if they did this underneath a phone or electricity line. Kerbside sorting - pioneered by Islington IIRC. Not having the householder have to sort the recycle waste gets the highest recycle rate, but having workers do it at the kerbside also makes it the most expensive recycling scheme. Around here they just have recycling points here and there - paper and cardboard in one, glass and plastics in the other. AFAIK it gets sorted at the local tip[1]; I have no idea how or what they then do with it all, though. [1] except that at the tip they want you to separate out corrugated card from other card/paper, yet this isn't a requirement at the scattered recycling points. (refuse collection is an optional service here, rather than being bundled in with the equivalent of council tax) cheers Jules |
#26
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OT Paper recycling question
Martin Brown wrote:
On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. Our council already do that and they have a collection wagon that looks like Heath Robinson designed it. The poor guys who work on it have to manually sort the mixed junk into the right skips on the side. When one skip is full a crazy system of hydraulics and levers yanks it all high into the air and lobs it into the divided lorry sections. On a windy day the behaviour of large plastic lemonade bottles is not ideal. I always wonder what would happen if they did this underneath a phone or electricity line. They do have a separate paper feed in a blue bag, but cans, glass and plastic bottles are all in one mixed box. I pity the guys sorting it. Cans, glass and plastic are easily separated automatically. Eddy currents generated by AC electromagnets (Essentially laid out as linear motors) drive the metal off the track, and the glass is dense, so it isn't blown away by the air jets or lifted by the fluid flotation methods used to get the plastic off the track. Sorting different plastics can be a right pain in the backside. Ferrous and non-ferrous metals are easily separated, although separating the non-ferrous stream into useful fractions is not so easy, and both streams need the steel and iron to be clean, i.e not fastened to non-ferrous bits. Pop rivets or pop riveted assemblies tend to be a problem, as there's usually a steel core inside the aluminium tube. -- Tciao for Now! John. |
#27
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OT Paper recycling question
On 16/02/2012 09:13, Martin Brown wrote:
On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. Our council already do that and they have a collection wagon that looks like Heath Robinson designed it. The poor guys who work on it have to manually sort the mixed junk into the right skips on the side. When one skip is full a crazy system of hydraulics and levers yanks it all high into the air and lobs it into the divided lorry sections. On a windy day the behaviour of large plastic lemonade bottles is not ideal. I always wonder what would happen if they did this underneath a phone or electricity line. They do have a separate paper feed in a blue bag, but cans, glass and plastic bottles are all in one mixed box. I pity the guys sorting it. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. To be fair our council does run very good recycling tips. The thing that kerbside collections highlight for me is how much cardboard there is (they don't collect that as it has no marginal value at all). Ours has a 140 litre grey bin for non-recyclable waste, collected every week; a 240 litre green bin for garden waste (we can also put food waste in it) that is collected for some form of accelerated composting every fortnight; a 240 litre black bin for glass bottles, plastic bottles and tin cans, which is collected once a month; and finally a 240 litre blue bin for paper and cardboard that is collected once a month. Which all works out as the grey bin plus one other bin each week and seems to work pretty well. Although I did get close to emptying rubbish bags into the council offices when they failed to collect our grey bin (along with a number of others) one Wednesday, then failed to answer the phone after I got home from work (even picking it up an dropping it back down to lose the call), making sure I could not call until Thursday morning. On Thursday when I got through, they said it would be 48 hours before they could empty it, but as that put it back to Saturday (due to their failure to answer the phone), it would actually be Monday or possibly Tuesday. I pointed out that our bin was completely full, we were a houshold of five and two of the kids were still in disposable nappies and it was the height of summer, but it did no good. That part of the "service" I am not at all happy about - especially as 50% of the wagons serving other areas drive past the end of our road every day! SteveW |
#28
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OT Paper recycling question
On Sat, 18 Feb 2012 00:18:44 -0000, Steve Walker
wrote: On 16/02/2012 09:13, Martin Brown wrote: On 15/02/2012 18:57, Tim wrote: Our council has just announced that rather than have a separate glass collection, we can now put all our bottles in our general recycling bin along with the cans, paper, cardboard, plastic bottles etc. Our council already do that and they have a collection wagon that looks like Heath Robinson designed it. The poor guys who work on it have to manually sort the mixed junk into the right skips on the side. When one skip is full a crazy system of hydraulics and levers yanks it all high into the air and lobs it into the divided lorry sections. On a windy day the behaviour of large plastic lemonade bottles is not ideal. I always wonder what would happen if they did this underneath a phone or electricity line. They do have a separate paper feed in a blue bag, but cans, glass and plastic bottles are all in one mixed box. I pity the guys sorting it. On the one hand this is more convenient for me but I had always thought at broken glass shards were a major headache for paper recyclers. So, is this a good thing or a reflection of the lack of value of waste paper which may now be either not being recycled or perhaps going though some less discriminating recycling process? The council also gave up sorting glass quite some time ago which also concerned me a bit given the lack of value to recyclers of unsorted glass. They are going through the motions to score the %age recycling brownie points. To be fair our council does run very good recycling tips. The thing that kerbside collections highlight for me is how much cardboard there is (they don't collect that as it has no marginal value at all). Ours has a 140 litre grey bin for non-recyclable waste, collected every week; a 240 litre green bin for garden waste (we can also put food waste in it) that is collected for some form of accelerated composting every fortnight; a 240 litre black bin for glass bottles, plastic bottles and tin cans, which is collected once a month; and finally a 240 litre blue bin for paper and cardboard that is collected once a month. Which all works out as the grey bin plus one other bin each week and seems to work pretty well. Although I did get close to emptying rubbish bags into the council offices when they failed to collect our grey bin (along with a number of others) one Wednesday, then failed to answer the phone after I got home from work (even picking it up an dropping it back down to lose the call), making sure I could not call until Thursday morning. On Thursday when I got through, they said it would be 48 hours before they could empty it, but as that put it back to Saturday (due to their failure to answer the phone), it would actually be Monday or possibly Tuesday. I pointed out that our bin was completely full, we were a houshold of five and two of the kids were still in disposable nappies and it was the height of summer, but it did no good. That part of the "service" I am not at all happy about - especially as 50% of the wagons serving other areas drive past the end of our road every day! SteveW My mother has one place for all recyclables which makes it very easy. We have: A grey bin for non-recyclables. It would take us about a month to fill it. A brown bin for garden refuse A box for glass and cans A sack for paper A sack for cardboard Disposable bags for plastics An inside waste food bin with corn starch liners (not suitable for warm or wet food) that are transferred to an outside bin. We are just a couple but only the food bin goes out regularly for hygiene reasons rather than because it is full. Our collections have so far been very reliable but the costs involved must be horrendous. |
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