Concerning our Worcester Bosch Greenstar HE Plus 35.

We thought that W/B Boilers were a Good German high class product,
Vorsprung durch Technik & all that. but ours was fitted by a W/B
dealer 7 years ago and has broken down at least once most years.

The repairs have been done by W/B service organisation. In every
instance the engineer has shown up and pronounced that it was not
installed according to W/B specifications (but we had presumed any
regularisation it needed had been done by the W/B engineer the
previous year). In every instance a routine service was charged for as
part of the repair but must have been completed in 3-5 minutes max.

The last time, (during last winters snow) the engineer did it in zero
time flat saying the combustion chamber "did not need doing", putting
a junior hacksaw through the condensate drain as he left "En passant".

Currently the boiler has a new fault which causes it to drip from deep
within it's Saturn V rocket like guts, and which is difficult to get
at because the boiler lives in a cupboard. :-(

All the repairs and associated dis-mantling and re-mantling are
playing havoc with the decorative finishes, and SWMBO has indicated
that she's had enough and would prefer a simple wall hung boiler (any
leaks would be evident) which presumably need not have a heat output
of 35 Kw. to heat a modern 4-bed well insulated house, and a seperate
provision for (stored ?) hot water.

One difficulty is that the boiler is currently located on the front
wall of the house and all sinks and hand wash basins are on the rear
wall 23 feet away. There is no access to the roofspace above the
utility room where the boiler is currently located.

A solution which avoided long delays before the hot water was
available at the taps (Which was especially bad with the W/B boiler,
even in Pre-Heat mode), would be most welcome.

Any suggestions? no Saniflo (burn the house) type suggestions IYP.

Derek G

On Nov 9, 11:35*pm, Derek Geldard wrote:
Concerning our Worcester Bosch Greenstar HE Plus 35.

We thought that W/B Boilers were a Good German high class product,
Vorsprung durch Technik & all that. but ours was fitted by a W/B
dealer 7 years ago and has broken down at least once most years.

The repairs have been done by W/B service organisation. In every
instance the engineer has shown up and pronounced that it was not
installed according to W/B specifications (but we had presumed any
regularisation it needed had been done by the W/B engineer the
previous year). In every instance a routine service was charged for as
part of the repair but must have been completed in 3-5 minutes max.

The last time, (during last winters snow) the engineer did it in zero
time flat saying the combustion chamber "did not need doing", putting
a junior hacksaw through the condensate drain as he left "En passant".

Currently the boiler has a new fault which causes it to drip from deep
within it's Saturn V rocket like guts, and which is difficult to get
at because the boiler lives in a cupboard. * * *:-(

All the repairs and associated dis-mantling and re-mantling are
playing havoc with the decorative finishes, and SWMBO has indicated
that she's had enough and would prefer a simple wall hung boiler (any
leaks would be evident) which presumably need not have a heat output
of 35 Kw. to heat a modern 4-bed well insulated house, and a seperate
provision for (stored ?) hot water.

One difficulty is that the boiler is currently located on the front
wall of the house and all sinks and hand wash basins are on the rear
wall 23 feet away. There is no access to the roofspace above the
utility room where the boiler is currently located.

*A solution which avoided long delays before the hot water was
available at the taps (Which was especially bad with the W/B boiler,
even in Pre-Heat mode), would be most welcome.

Any suggestions? no Saniflo (burn the house) type suggestions IYP.

Derek G


This is the problem with combi boilers.They are complex hence more
likely to go wrong.
They are only used to reduce overall installation costs. There is
little benifit to the user apart from saving the standing losses of a
hot water store..
However to put anything else in would be expensive, you would have to
find space for a hot water cylinder.
So you are down to another combi. The technology has improved.
Someone will come on here and tell you what is currently the best make
to buy.

Long pipe runs for hot water are down to bad design/cowboys. The only
way round it is to move the boiler (expensive) or some sort of over/
under sink (instantaneous/storage) electric heater

On Wed, 9 Nov 2011 23:05:00 -0800 (PST), harry
wrote:

On Nov 9, 11:35*pm, Derek Geldard wrote:
Concerning our Worcester Bosch Greenstar HE Plus 35.

We thought that W/B Boilers were a Good German high class product,
Vorsprung durch Technik & all that. but ours was fitted by a W/B
dealer 7 years ago and has broken down at least once most years.

The repairs have been done by W/B service organisation. In every
instance the engineer has shown up and pronounced that it was not
installed according to W/B specifications (but we had presumed any
regularisation it needed had been done by the W/B engineer the
previous year). In every instance a routine service was charged for as
part of the repair but must have been completed in 3-5 minutes max.

The last time, (during last winters snow) the engineer did it in zero
time flat saying the combustion chamber "did not need doing", putting
a junior hacksaw through the condensate drain as he left "En passant".

Currently the boiler has a new fault which causes it to drip from deep
within it's Saturn V rocket like guts, and which is difficult to get
at because the boiler lives in a cupboard. * * *:-(

All the repairs and associated dis-mantling and re-mantling are
playing havoc with the decorative finishes, and SWMBO has indicated
that she's had enough and would prefer a simple wall hung boiler (any
leaks would be evident) which presumably need not have a heat output
of 35 Kw. to heat a modern 4-bed well insulated house, and a seperate
provision for (stored ?) hot water.

One difficulty is that the boiler is currently located on the front
wall of the house and all sinks and hand wash basins are on the rear
wall 23 feet away. There is no access to the roofspace above the
utility room where the boiler is currently located.

*A solution which avoided long delays before the hot water was
available at the taps (Which was especially bad with the W/B boiler,
even in Pre-Heat mode), would be most welcome.

Any suggestions? no Saniflo (burn the house) type suggestions IYP.

Derek G


This is the problem with combi boilers.They are complex hence more
likely to go wrong.

But they can be fine. W-B have a reasonable reputation and I have one
installed at home. IME the W-B technicians that service my boiler
have been fine. However, if you're not happy with them, then find
someone else to fix them. I've found W-B fans can be unreliable but
otherwise they are reasonable.

They are only used to reduce overall installation costs. There is
little benifit to the user apart from saving the standing losses of a
hot water store..
However to put anything else in would be expensive, you would have to
find space for a hot water cylinder.
So you are down to another combi. The technology has improved.
Someone will come on here and tell you what is currently the best make
to buy.

I don't think things have changed that much.

Long pipe runs for hot water are down to bad design/cowboys. The only
way round it is to move the boiler (expensive) or some sort of over/
under sink (instantaneous/storage) electric heater

If a combi boiler is located a long way away from the taps then you
will have long pipe runs. You can move the boiler or go for a stored
water solution. If it was me I would try to fix your current boiler.

If you've got plenty of money then it's worth looking at a heat
bank/thermal store. However you'll need to make room for an airing
cupboard for that. You can use a system or heating only boiler for
this.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) Due to the amount of spam posted via googlegroups and
(")_(") their inaction to the problem. I am blocking some articles
posted from there. If you wish your postings to be seen by
everyone you will need use a different method of posting.

On 10/11/2011 07:05, harry wrote:
On Nov 9, 11:35 pm, Derek wrote:
Concerning our Worcester Bosch Greenstar HE Plus 35.

We thought that W/B Boilers were a Good German high class product,
Vorsprung durch Technik& all that. but ours was fitted by a W/B
dealer 7 years ago and has broken down at least once most years.

The repairs have been done by W/B service organisation. In every
instance the engineer has shown up and pronounced that it was not
installed according to W/B specifications (but we had presumed any
regularisation it needed had been done by the W/B engineer the
previous year). In every instance a routine service was charged for as
part of the repair but must have been completed in 3-5 minutes max.

The last time, (during last winters snow) the engineer did it in zero
time flat saying the combustion chamber "did not need doing", putting
a junior hacksaw through the condensate drain as he left "En passant".

Currently the boiler has a new fault which causes it to drip from deep
within it's Saturn V rocket like guts, and which is difficult to get
at because the boiler lives in a cupboard. :-(
A good few heating engineers that I know personally tell me that WB are
living on a reputation from the past, they are no longer as good as they
are made out and ridiculously overpriced for what they are. They prefer
Vaillant, Viessmann and some ATAG.

All the repairs and associated dis-mantling and re-mantling are
playing havoc with the decorative finishes, and SWMBO has indicated
that she's had enough and would prefer a simple wall hung boiler (any
leaks would be evident) which presumably need not have a heat output
of 35 Kw. to heat a modern 4-bed well insulated house, and a seperate
provision for (stored ?) hot water.

Your combi boiler would have been sized based on the hot water
requirement, 35 kw would be the output the boiler works at when in DHW
mode. If using a regular boiler, do a heatloss calculation so you can
work out how many KW you need and then get a boiler with a few KW more
than what you need. You could also add 3kw for hot water provision BUT
with modern high recovery cylinders and a good control system you can
make the system give priority to hot water so it receives the boilers
full output when heating the cylinder and then goes back to a low flow
temperature for CH.

You could always get the system properly flushed and get another combi
boiler, there are some pretty reliable one's out there. I have a
Vaillant Ecotec which is over 3 years old now without a breakdown and my
neighbour has a Vaillant Ecomax which is some 12 years old with only one
breakdown when it was moved to a new part of the house.


One difficulty is that the boiler is currently located on the front
wall of the house and all sinks and hand wash basins are on the rear
wall 23 feet away. There is no access to the roofspace above the
utility room where the boiler is currently located.

A solution which avoided long delays before the hot water was
available at the taps (Which was especially bad with the W/B boiler,
even in Pre-Heat mode), would be most welcome.

Any suggestions? no Saniflo (burn the house) type suggestions IYP.

Derek G

Is all your hot water pipework in 15mm? I have found that if some
existing 22mm pipework was used with a combi, the delays in getting hot
water can be quite long.




--
David