Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

Fred wrote:
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

Definately not.
For skimming (board finish, multi-finish etc) you want a hawk and trowel,
and a flat brush for wetting, these are the only tools you'll need.
A darby is for backing plaster and render, and is completely useless for
skimming.

--
Phil L
RSRL Tipster Of The Year 2008

On 7 July, 12:57, "Phil L" wrote:
Fred wrote:
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

Definately not.
For skimming (board finish, multi-finish etc) you want a hawk and trowel,
and a flat brush for wetting, these are the only tools you'll need.
A darby is for backing plaster and render, and is completely useless for
skimming.

I agree on the darbys etc

Tho instead of a flat brush & bucket I prefer a handheld pump-up
pressurised garden sprayer - £5odd in Asda etc

(Naturally I am not a profeshunal plasterer.....)

Cheers
Jim K

On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 05:12:43 -0700 (PDT), Jim K wrote:

For skimming (board finish, multi-finish etc) you want a hawk and
trowel, and a flat brush for wetting, these are the only tools
you'll
need.

Isn't it easier to do the application and polishing with a float
rather than a trowel? An old float is best, one were the sharp edges
facing the wall have been gently worn/rounded away. Take a bit of
fine emery paper wrapped around a block of wood to a new float.

A darby is for backing plaster and render, and is completely
useless
for skimming.

I agree on the darbys etc

Yep.

Tho instead of a flat brush & bucket I prefer a handheld pump-up
pressurised garden sprayer - £5odd in Asda etc

Sprayer works but I've found a plastic pasting brush and bucket is
best. You can clean the float with the brush in the bucket.

(Naturally I am not a profeshunal plasterer.....)

Ditto.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Fred
wibbled on Wednesday 07 July 2010 12:33

Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

Re Trowel:

http://www.google.co.uk/products?q=m...en&sc oring=p

This is absolutely worth the money. I've used an old flat steel float and
one of the Marshalltowns and there is no comparison - as a beginner, the
Permashape gives you quite a bit of help IME - or rather it doesn't go out
of its way to mess you up like a bad or very flat or unbroken in traditional
trowel.

Watch the youtube videos of plastering too - quite a few good ones to give
you a mental feel of what to expect.

--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

In article ,
Jim K writes:
On 7 July, 12:57, "Phil L" wrote:
Fred wrote:
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I

For first time, I would assume the finish might not be good enough,
and you'll want to fit a new sheet of plasterboard afterwards.

Indeed you might be better off finding something like the cupboard
under the stairs, of a garage wall, to skim first.

will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

No, "level" is the job of the plasterboard (or scratch coat if you aren't
using plasterboard).

TIA

Definately not.
For skimming (board finish, multi-finish etc) you want a hawk and trowel,
and a flat brush for wetting, these are the only tools you'll need.
A darby is for backing plaster and render, and is completely useless for
skimming.
I agree on the darbys etc
Tho instead of a flat brush & bucket I prefer a handheld pump-up
pressurised garden sprayer - £5odd in Asda etc

or free if you have one with a cleaning product in it and wash it out.
And yes, easier than a brush. You may want a bucket of water and a brush
to clean off the trowel in the latter stages.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Dave Liquorice wrote:

Isn't it easier to do the application and polishing with a float
rather than a trowel? An old float is best, one were the sharp edges
facing the wall have been gently worn/rounded away. Take a bit of
fine emery paper wrapped around a block of wood to a new float.

What do you mean by 'float'? - a float is made of semi-solid plastic,
usually mustard coloured for some bizzare reason,
and is used to flatten off lumps and bumps from partially seet backing
plaster and render, they can also be made of wood.
A trowel is metal, which I think is what you might be reffering to WRT the
sharp edges and emery cloth, in whaich case, what do you tmean by trowel?

Float:
http://snipurl.com/z3ndy

Trowel:
http://snipurl.com/z3nf4



--
Phil L
RSRL Tipster Of The Year 2008

On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 15:28:19 +0100, Phil L wrote:

What do you mean by 'float'? - a float is made of semi-solid plastic,
usually mustard coloured for some bizzare reason, and is used to flatten
off lumps and bumps from partially seet backing plaster and render, they
can also be made of wood.
snip
Float:
http://snipurl.com/z3ndy

Seems to be a rough 50:50 split between metal and plastic there. B-)

In my book a float is rectangular and "floats" over the surface
smoothing
it. Float is a bit of misnomer, the final polish on setting plaster
involves quite a bit of force... A float can be made of a variety of
materials, plaster polishing is normally done with a thin springy
metal one.

Trowel:
http://snipurl.com/z3nf4

Another page in my book has trowels diamond shaped and made of metal
metal.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 15:28:19 +0100, Phil L wrote:

What do you mean by 'float'? - a float is made of semi-solid plastic,
usually mustard coloured for some bizzare reason, and is used to
flatten off lumps and bumps from partially seet backing plaster and
render, they can also be made of wood.
snip
Float:
http://snipurl.com/z3ndy

Seems to be a rough 50:50 split between metal and plastic there. B-)

In my book a float is rectangular and "floats" over the surface
smoothing
it. Float is a bit of misnomer, the final polish on setting plaster
involves quite a bit of force... A float can be made of a variety of
materials, plaster polishing is normally done with a thin springy
metal one.

It's probably geographical, I'd been plastering 20 years and never heard the
word 'hawk' in relation to plastering, around here, everyone calls them
'handboards', it was only when Tommy Walsh et al appeared on TV that I heard
him call it a hawk! - If I'd gone in the builder's merchant and asked for a
hawk he'd have directed me to the nearest zoo.



Trowel:
http://snipurl.com/z3nf4

Another page in my book has trowels diamond shaped and made of metal
metal.

Ah, you mean a pointing trowel or a brickie's trowel....there are also
variants of this which are flat at the end and these are bucket trowels,
used for getting mortar from the bottom of buckets, a PITA with a pointed
trowel.

--
Phil L
RSRL Tipster Of The Year 2008

On 7 July, 12:33, Fred wrote:
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

If you watch a plasterer it looks dead easy but it isn't. You need to
practice somewhere first to get the hang of it. One tool that is lots
easier to use than a float is the spreader tool. You get them inside
the cans of ready mixed plaster, just a flat bit of plastic. You can
buy fancier ones separately.
This the sort of thing:-
http://www.google.co.uk/products?q=s...ter&hl=en&aq=f
They are a lot easier to use than a float.
You will find the whole trick is knowing when to start rubbing up or
polishing (also can be done with the spreader)

You might find it an idea to do some practice with the pre-mixed stuff
(Polyfilla etc.) & then move onto plaster. The polyfilla doesn't go
off as quick and you can mess round with it more. Too expensive
though for big jobs.

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 15:28:19 +0100, Phil L wrote:

What do you mean by 'float'? - a float is made of semi-solid plastic,
usually mustard coloured for some bizzare reason, and is used to flatten
off lumps and bumps from partially seet backing plaster and render, they
can also be made of wood.
snip
Float:
http://snipurl.com/z3ndy

Seems to be a rough 50:50 split between metal and plastic there. B-)

In my book a float is rectangular and "floats" over the surface
smoothing
it.

LOL try that with a flat metal float on wet gypsum plaster.


Trowel:
http://snipurl.com/z3nf4

Another page in my book has trowels diamond shaped and made of metal
metal.


A Trowel can also be

"a small hand-held tool with a curved scoop for lifting plants or earth"

A Float can also be

a cork or buoy supporting the edge of a fishing net

but nothing will "Float" over wet gypsum plaster.



--

On 7 July, 15:20, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
In article ,
Jim K writes:

On 7 July, 12:57, "Phil L" wrote:
Fred wrote:
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I

For first time, I would assume the finish might not be good enough,
and you'll want to fit a new sheet of plasterboard afterwards.

Indeed you might be better off finding something like the cupboard
under the stairs, of a garage wall, to skim first.

will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

No, "level" is the job of the plasterboard (or scratch coat if you aren't
using plasterboard).

TIA

Definately not.
For skimming (board finish, multi-finish etc) you want a hawk and trowel,
and a flat brush for wetting, these are the only tools you'll need.
A darby is for backing plaster and render, and is completely useless for
skimming.
I agree on the darbys etc
Tho instead of a flat brush & bucket I prefer a handheld pump-up
pressurised garden sprayer - £5odd in Asda etc

or free if you have one with a cleaning product in it and wash it out.

pressurised?? what's in that then??
NB the trigger powered ones gave me blisters and I couldn't get
enough out without swearing and wasting valuable setting time - hence
the pump-up pressurised option.

And yes, easier than a brush. You may want a bucket of water and a brush
to clean off the trowel in the latter stages.

aye

Jim K

In article o.uk,
"Dave Liquorice" writes:
On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 15:28:19 +0100, Phil L wrote:

What do you mean by 'float'? - a float is made of semi-solid plastic,
usually mustard coloured for some bizzare reason, and is used to flatten
off lumps and bumps from partially seet backing plaster and render, they
can also be made of wood.
snip
Float:
http://snipurl.com/z3ndy

Seems to be a rough 50:50 split between metal and plastic there. B-)

In my book a float is rectangular and "floats" over the surface
smoothing

This is simply a common misconception.
Floats are wooden (or modern plastic equivalents).
They are never used for polishing, but for flattening surfaces which
you don't want polished. The business end is the flat face.

Conversely, with a trowel, you never use the flat face (well, only
by accident, followed by trying to repair the resulting lump of
plaster you just pulled out;-) The business end of a trowel are the
long edges, which are used for smoothing and polishing.

it. Float is a bit of misnomer, the final polish on setting plaster
involves quite a bit of force... A float can be made of a variety of
materials, plaster polishing is normally done with a thin springy
metal one.

Trowel:
http://snipurl.com/z3nf4

Another page in my book has trowels diamond shaped and made of metal
metal.

That's a brick layer's trowel, but that is what leads to the confusion
between a plaster's trowel and a plaster's float - a misconception that
it's the shape that differentiates them.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

"Fred" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

A straight length of 3" skirting will do you .... I worked on many building
sites and that is all I have ever seen plasterers use.

You only use them to get basic level, final finish is with trowel

In message
, Jim
K writes
On 7 July, 12:57, "Phil L" wrote:
Fred wrote:
Hi,

I am getting ready to have a go at plastering for the first time. I
will be plastering onto plasterboard. I know I'll need a trowel (or is
it a float - what's the difference?) and a hawk but what about these
feather edges and darbys I have seen in the Screwfix/tool
station/machine mart catalogues?

A quick google suggests they are used to apply the back coat of
plaster. But can they/are they used for finishing coats too? Would it
be useful for me to get one to make sure my coat of plaster is
completely smooth and level?

TIA

Definately not.
For skimming (board finish, multi-finish etc) you want a hawk and trowel,
and a flat brush for wetting, these are the only tools you'll need.
A darby is for backing plaster and render, and is completely useless for
skimming.

I agree on the darbys etc

Tho instead of a flat brush & bucket I prefer a handheld pump-up
pressurised garden sprayer - £5odd in Asda etc

(Naturally I am not a profeshunal plasterer.....)

Yesterday I watched our tame plasterer scrape off the artex and skim a
24' by 12' ceiling in our house. Plastering is not looming large on my
DIY skills list. Even if I was tempted by evening classes (which I
generally am, but generally also do nothing about) I doubt I'd trust
myself to skim a ceiling.


--
Mike Buckley
RD350LC2
XJ900S

On Thu, 8 Jul 2010 21:20:44 +0100, Mike Buckley
wrote:

Even if I was tempted by evening classes (which I
generally am, but generally also do nothing about) I doubt I'd trust
myself to skim a ceiling.

People here have recommended classes but I've never found any listed
at my local college. I agree with you, even if I did get good, I would
only do walls, never ceilings!

On Wed, 7 Jul 2010 14:20:53 +0000 (UTC),
(Andrew Gabriel) wrote:

For first time, I would assume the finish might not be good enough,
and you'll want to fit a new sheet of plasterboard afterwards.

Thanks for all the pointers. It seems I can save some money by not
buying unnecessary darbys and feather edges. I was thinking of having
a go at a small wall in our smallest bedroom and call a pro in if it
went horribly wrong, but perhaps I might try a couple of practice
sheets in the garage first. I guess plasterboard is cheap enough to do
that. I think I have been reading your old posts for technique. Thanks
again for those.

Fred
wibbled on Thursday 15 July 2010 20:18

On Thu, 8 Jul 2010 21:20:44 +0100, Mike Buckley
wrote:

Even if I was tempted by evening classes (which I
generally am, but generally also do nothing about) I doubt I'd trust
myself to skim a ceiling.

People here have recommended classes but I've never found any listed
at my local college. I agree with you, even if I did get good, I would
only do walls, never ceilings!

Short courses for DIY hackers are often to be found at specialist training
units - there's one at Waddon, South London, and another near Gatwick.

--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

In article ,
Tim Watts writes:
Fred
wibbled on Thursday 15 July 2010 20:18

On Thu, 8 Jul 2010 21:20:44 +0100, Mike Buckley
wrote:

Even if I was tempted by evening classes (which I
generally am, but generally also do nothing about) I doubt I'd trust
myself to skim a ceiling.

People here have recommended classes but I've never found any listed
at my local college. I agree with you, even if I did get good, I would
only do walls, never ceilings!

Short courses for DIY hackers are often to be found at specialist training
units - there's one at Waddon, South London, and another near Gatwick.

In Aldershot is the Building trades offshoot of Farnborough College.
I did a bricklaying course there.
I did my plastering course at Aldershot Building Centre which was
in the army grounds and partly for retraining those due to be leaving
the army, but it's gone now that the new premises has opened.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]