Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

I tried an old OnDigital box I had. It worked for about 2 channel
changes, then froze.

Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2
minutes, then froze.
Returned it, and got another one.
This does the same.
Tried via 2 scart TV's, same on both.
Symptoms are it finds all the channels, can select channels, then
suddenly it stays on last selected channel and sound disappears.
Have to unplug from mains to get control back for the next 2 mins.

Do I have to keep returning these till one works?
--
Bill

"Bill" wrote in message
...
Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

I tried an old OnDigital box I had. It worked for about 2 channel changes,
then froze.

Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2 minutes,
then froze.
Returned it, and got another one.
This does the same.
Tried via 2 scart TV's, same on both.
Symptoms are it finds all the channels, can select channels, then suddenly
it stays on last selected channel and sound disappears.
Have to unplug from mains to get control back for the next 2 mins.

Do I have to keep returning these till one works?
--
Bill

Where in the world are you Bill ?

sounds like it may be a poor signal area!!

sounds like it may be a poor signal area!!



I was thinking along the same lines and also that digibox box is probably
receiving updates via the digital signal and it's this which is 'locking'
the boxes up.
Maybe best if Bill takes the box back and gets the shop to plug the thing in
and see if it works properly.

In article ,
Bill writes:
Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

Is old relative going to cope with two remotes, different
tuning scheme, some functions on one, some on the other?
I've seen this really confuse not-so-elderly.

You may be better off with a new TV with digital tuner.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Andrew Gabriel wrote:

You may be better off with a new TV with digital tuner.


New digital standard coming out imminently. You won't be able to get
all the channels in some areas in the new year, and in most areas come
2012. Try explaining that to the elderly.

Andy
--
Look for DVB-T2 for more information

"Bill" wrote in message
...
Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

I tried an old OnDigital box I had. It worked for about 2 channel changes,
then froze.

Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2 minutes,
then froze.
Returned it, and got another one.
This does the same.
Tried via 2 scart TV's, same on both.
Symptoms are it finds all the channels, can select channels, then suddenly
it stays on last selected channel and sound disappears.
Have to unplug from mains to get control back for the next 2 mins.

Do I have to keep returning these till one works?

As others have suggested, try an alternative aerial.
The Telecam TCE2001 is highly recommended as an indoor one.
I was going to say, £20 from Argos - but I've jsut checked and they're down
to £8

On Mon, 2 Nov 2009 18:58:27 +0000, Bill wrote:

Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

I tried an old OnDigital box I had. It worked for about 2 channel
changes, then froze.

Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2
minutes,

May not be the case now but the Sagem boxes did seem to have a habit
of freezing. Had one myself, and a mate, and reading the Argos
reviews. While ago now tho.

In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
Bill writes:
Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

Is old relative going to cope with two remotes, different
tuning scheme, some functions on one, some on the other?
I've seen this really confuse not-so-elderly.

You may be better off with a new TV with digital tuner.

Old relative was offered age-related deal for the North Welsh
changeover, talked to "the lady" and they rightly agreed that she was on
Winter Hill. Said they would be back in touch with her. They haven't,
and now W Hill is 2 days away.

She was going to accept the offer of a new Panasonic TV plus a nice man
to check her (known dodgy) aerial and fix it, all as part of the scheme
for the over( mustn't mention here age)'s. Seemed a good price to me if
aerial work is needed.

SWMBO here has decreed we have to be ready for when she suddenly loses
BBC2 on Wednesday. Hence the panic.

Our aerial is fine, and I've also tried with a different aerial. These
Sagem boxes do seem to pick up Welsh TV from the back of the aerial and
insert that as BBC1 Wales etc. I presume this is because Moel-y-Parc has
upped its power with its earlier changeover.

It just seems odd that 3 boxes all do this freezing, yet our main TV,
video and the upstairs thing with a Maplin PVR feeding the ancient TV
off a set top aerial all work fine.
--
Bill

Quick further question in view of previous replies, and yes I know I'd
be better in a uk tv group, but...

I suppose it's possible that when the Sagem box scans, it picks up the
now enhanced BBC Wales off the back of the aerial before it gets to the
Winter Hill channels. It does announce the channels as BBC1Wales etc.

I try not to get bogged down in how this new-fangled TV works, but is it
possible that the box is getting confusing update commands from the
different regions?

I think it's back to Currys yet again in the morning, though.
--
Bill

Bill wrote:
Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

I tried an old OnDigital box I had. It worked for about 2 channel
changes, then froze.

Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2
minutes, then froze.
Returned it, and got another one.
This does the same.
Tried via 2 scart TV's, same on both.
Symptoms are it finds all the channels, can select channels, then
suddenly it stays on last selected channel and sound disappears.
Have to unplug from mains to get control back for the next 2 mins.

Do I have to keep returning these till one works?

I've been very satisfied with Sony STB's. I bought three on Ebay. One is
a bit flaky, but the other two are fine.

Bill wrote:
Quick further question in view of previous replies, and yes I know I'd
be better in a uk tv group, but...

I suppose it's possible that when the Sagem box scans, it picks up the
now enhanced BBC Wales off the back of the aerial before it gets to the
Winter Hill channels. It does announce the channels as BBC1Wales etc.

I try not to get bogged down in how this new-fangled TV works, but is it
possible that the box is getting confusing update commands from the
different regions?


I generally find that you end up with tow channels of everything, and
one doesn't work that well.

I think it's back to Currys yet again in the morning, though.

In message , John
Rumm writes
Bill wrote:


Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2
minutes, then froze.
Returned it, and got another one.
This does the same.
Tried via 2 scart TV's, same on both.

TVs/SCARTS are unlikely to make any difference in this case.


The reason I suspected they might was that some research on the net
seemed to suggest all sorts of weird things like usb serial data on
scarts on some boxes. Doesn't seem to be the case here though.

Symptoms are it finds all the channels, can select channels, then
suddenly it stays on last selected channel and sound disappears.

Boxes can freeze on a poor signal - however, that is usually just the
channel freezing or pixelating or stopping and starting. The box itself
should not crash or lock up, and you should be able to tune away to
other channels.

Have to unplug from mains to get control back for the next 2 mins.

That sounds like either a faulty box, or you have found one that is
buggy enough to actually crash in the presence of too many decoding
errors.

The only button that does anything in the fault condition is the 'hold
for 5 secs' reset button on the box itself.

Do I have to keep returning these till one works?

Buy a different brand of box and see how you get on. Pop to somewhere
like maplin and buy an inline 6dB attenuator and put that in the aerial
lead before doing a tune. That should prevent it attempting to tune
very weak fringe reception channels[1]. If you get perfect reception
with the attenuator there that is also a good indication that you have
a bit of headroom in your signal to cope with normal signal variation.
(obviously take the attenuator out once its all tuned and running)


[1] another trick is to look up the range of channels used by your
transmitter. When tuning, pull the aerial lead out when outside of that
range - that will also drop many duplicated / weak channels.


Ok, I thought I'd try the unplug aerial during tuning trick, but that
didn't help. Further research seems to show that, unknown to me, a relay
transmitter for BBC Wales, "Storeton Wales", has popped up almost in
line with Winter Hill, 500watts but only about 3 miles away. It used to
just relay WH in the opposite direction. I suspect that this is where
I'm getting BBC 1 Wales from. It's on Channel 57, Winter Hill is Ch 56.

Have rung Currys prior to the next visit. Yesterday they said no-one
else had returned any of these boxes. Today they say that for the
duration of the changeover there is chaos and everyone will be having
similar problems. They will return the money when I take it back.

I can't really believe that these boxes have firmware that can be
crashed by incoming signals. I've built crystal sets that work better
than this.
--
Bill

In message , John
Rumm writes
(And to be fair, your crystal set was probably not decoding the AM
using a DSP, while unpicking FEC, Convolutional codes, interleave
buffers, running inverse DCTs and demuxing multiple video streams)

I can't resist saying "Ah but neither are these digiboxes".

I have returned the box for cash in hand. My query about how, if none of
their other boxes would work any better, they would be able to sell any
TV's at the moment didn't draw any response.

I've had another go with the old OnDigital Nokia box - still locks up
after a few minutes. I then remembered I had a DVB-T device for the
laptop. That works fine, just like the TV's here. Old relative won't
have a computer in the house, though, so that's out, but at least I can
make something work. It sees both the Wales BBC relay and the Winter
Hill service so I can choose between them and set it up manually, unlike
these 'clever' set-top boxes.

I'm beginning to think it is better if she does lose BBC2 for a month to
trigger her back into the 'assisted' subsidised set plus aerial route.
--
Bill

"Bill" wrote in message
...
Am I being stupid?

We need to find a box to update an old relative to digital TV. Urgently.

I tried an old OnDigital box I had. It worked for about 2 channel changes,
then froze.

Went out and bought new low-end Sagem box. It worked for about 2 minutes,
then froze.
Returned it, and got another one.
This does the same.
Tried via 2 scart TV's, same on both.
Symptoms are it finds all the channels, can select channels, then suddenly
it stays on last selected channel and sound disappears.
Have to unplug from mains to get control back for the next 2 mins.

Do I have to keep returning these till one works?


The OnDigital box will not work. Can your relative cope with two remotes
that a separtae box requires? Do the decent thing and buy them a new set.

Peter Crosland